The Sun: Maple Leafs on trial; heads may roll. Just about everything in question.

[DarkKnight]

Matthews has one even strength point, how sad is that.

 

[socko]

Look At Kadri. Thanks for nothing Dubass

Nothing would have been a lot better than what Dubas gave us.

 

[Racer88]

Not according to Shanny. He also says this group will win a cup.

Shanny is delusional but he sure has ownership fooled

 

[Pebble live]

Just to be clear…. How many rounds did we win with all these great players?

Who cares, at least they were fun to watch. I am not on the "must win a playoff round" train everyone else is on.

I want a team that shows heart, plays hard, and if they lose, at least they left it all out there. Losing that round to the caps sucked. But after the way the team played in that series, I was excited for the future and entertained.

This roster is by far the worst makeup we've had in years.

You know who else has been suspended multiple times? Tom Wilson. Caps stuck with him because he had heart. They won a cup with him.

Get off this narrative.

 

[SoVi3t]

Kyper claims they made the Murray trade because of the analytics. If he is right and tat trumped his injury history, shame on them. I mean you gambled on Mrazek last year who also had an history of injuries (IIRC he is out again with a groin injury) and as many predicted he was injured 3 times. Did you not learn anything ?? Sheesh.

Dubas seems to love to gamble on wounded veterans.

 

[Gary Nylund]

He may have inherited the rights to the core, but it was Kyle and only Kyle who gave them all super player-friendly deals and paid them all as if they were proven winners before they'd won a damn thing.

They had the two richest extensions in Matthews and Marner in league history, outside of McDavid, coming out of their rookie deals. In fact, Marner got the richest extension of any RW in league history coming out of his ELC, and Edmonton got McDavid for 8 seasons rather than Kyle walking Matthews to free agency over 5 years only 1M$ cheaper. He basically cost a season of Nylander by waiting to the 11th hour before caving and giving him everything he wanted - which he could have done 6 months earlier and had him in training camp.

Say what you want, but Lou Lamoriello would have never, ever, EVER handed out those contracts. EVER.

When push comes to shove, Dubas has squandered every possible asset available to him. He gave away cap space to kids who hadn't accomplished anything yet and made them very, very rich. He traded draft picks for guys who did nothing to help the team. He made some decent trades, but also some terrible ones and let the acquired assets walk so he could focus on his vision of a team, and undeserved loyalty to guys who didn't deserve it (how do you not get rid of Holl and give Lyubushkin the same dollar amount given he was a VAST improvement over what we had?)

I really think Kyle will be a very successful GM one day, but not here, and not until he gets a lot more experience under his belt. He's not eaten his piece of humble pie yet, and hasn't shown an ounce of humility that maybe, just maybe, his vision for how to build a team is flawed. Up this point, though, he's considered himself the smartest kid in the room and the walls are about to come crashing down hard.

There's plenty Dubas has done worthy of criticism, but some of the criticisms are way over the top and too many people seem to think that basically everything he's done is wrong and that's just dumb.

Tavares has played really well and even if he's overpaid by 2 million or so, that's hardly such a big problem that it dooms the team. Every team in the league has contract(s) that are worse than that, lets be serious here and that's why I said I'm sick about hearing how that signing doomed the team. UFA's are always overpaid by whatever and every team in the league pretty much wanted him so whining about that is such a joke.

I don't have the time and energy do go over all this you posted point by point but let's just say that IMO there is lots wrong here. Like paying as if they're "proven winners", that's so ridiculous, how do people keep saying this nonsense? Players get paid based on individual performance, regardless of how the team does. That's why players like Matthews and McDavid get paid a ton, because they are great players and they are worth it. That's a great example of how stupid so much of the Dubas criticism is. He's made mistakes but paying superstars "before they'd won a damn thing" isn't one of them, some of you people really need to get a grip. And it was Nylander who caved at the last minute, f*** it's so tiresome to see the same lies posted here, what is the matter with some of you people?

 

[thewave]

SIMMONS: Maple Leafs on trial; heads may roll. Just about everything in question

This is not about blue-and-white noise or a product of an overly active media environment.

torontosun.com

Best Quote:


"This is not the usual early season concern, the shrug-your-shoulders type. There is every reason to believe the Leafs are nearing implosion time whether that means a firing or firings or a trade of monumental impact will be determined by how the team responds Wednesday against Philadelphia, Saturday night against Boston, Sunday night in Carolina, next Tuesday against Vegas: Suddenly, this hockey season is about game to game. And suddenly, the Maple Leafs are on trial and an early season verdict awaits."

Toronto might very well win the majority of these up and coming games, but the damage is done: key players are out due to long term injuries, and their bottom 6 has no ability to hold leads/contribute. The cap situation is dire: Dubas is finally able to play a full roster due to LTIR relief.

The the biggest challenge now is not even on the ice. The fans are furious or they don't care. Dubas/Shanny/Keefe have nothing to show for their efforts, and they've mortgaged the future.

The ticking clock is getting louder and louder...

Yes. As of right now. I can say with utmost certainty.

-The fans did not fail us
-The players did not fail us

-Kyle Dubas has been a failure
-No #1 Tender in all this time
-An imbalanced hockey team that can not win a playoff round against lesser teams
-Has depleted our assets for nothing.

-Shanahan has been a failure for supporting the direction this long and not identifying what we did years ago.
-The board and upper management that could not identify the issues long ago has been a failure.

If you can't see the writing is on the wall now, you never will. You'll just continue following hockey moves in a reactionary mindset. They do, you opine (usually appealing to authority).

 

[justashadowof]

Yup, he's a competitive beauty not some Dubanite pansy ass.

 

[HockeyVirus]

Wow can you believe the Panthers lost to the Coyotes? Their core should be blown up TBH. At least that would be my response if not for their *checks notes* 1 playoff series win in 25 years which somehow means there is hope for them

 

[justashadowof]

Wow can you believe the Panthers lost to the Coyotes? Their core should be blown up TBH. At least that would be my response if not for their *checks notes* 1 playoff series win in 25 years which somehow means there is hope for them

"Hey look over here! This NHL team stumbled. Don't focus on the state of the Leafs, let's focus on the state of some other cherry picked team."

 

[HockeyVirus]

"Hey look over here! This NHL team stumbled. Don't focus on the state of the Leafs, let's focus on the state of some other cherry picked team."

I never said the Leafs have played well so far, I am just.. Not sure if I am laughing or sad or a bit of both with this board.

Honestly embarrassing reading this board this week. Especially because in 2 weeks these posters will all be gone.

 

[ULF_55]

Like this, you mean? You'd be right - sometimes you need a few players that will drag the boys into the fight.

Watching Kadri and Komorov on this shift brings a tear to my eye. It was beautiful.

You identify Komorov, and that might be key.

He was never a star.
He was never a points leader.
He was never a quitter.

Heck, you know what is funny ... Grabovski might have had more character than the current Leafs stars.
Gravovski put it all out there. (At the risk of his health/career.)
Sometimes you don't know what you have ...

 

[Gary Nylund]

Yes. As of right now. I can say with utmost certainty.

-The fans did not fail us
-The players did not fail us

-Kyle Dubas has been a failure
-No #1 Tender in all this time
-An imbalanced hockey team that can not win a playoff round against lesser teams
-Has depleted our assets for nothing.

-Shanahan has been a failure for supporting the direction this long and not identifying what we did years ago.
-The board and upper management that could not identify the issues long ago has been a failure.

If you can't see the writing is on the wall now, you never will. You'll just continue following hockey moves in a reactionary mindset. They do, you opine (usually appealing to authority).

You don't think the players failed us? Interesting POV. IMHO they failed us in game 7 for four years in a row.

First the 3rd period against Boston, we got humiliated 4-0 in that period that's where is all started. Then we didn't show up in the deciding game for the next 3 years getting outscored 11-2 in those 3 games so that's 4 consecutive years of playing some of our worst hockey of the season when it mattered the most. When a team plays pretty well for 82 games, then plays again pretty well in the playoffs and then just disappears in game 7, you seriously don't think that's on the players?

Just to recap, we got outscored 4-0 in the 3rd against Boston, then 11-2 in the next 3 series deciding games for a total of 15-2 in the 4 most important games of that 4 year span. And your POV is that you could say to the players that no worries guys, getting outscored 15-2 in these 10 period of hockey doesn't mean you failed. Don't worry guys, you are all awesome, this is all the fault of your four eyed GM? Seriously?

 

[Notsince67]

Matthews has one even strength point, how sad is that.

Let's make him captain

 

[Americanadian]

Ok pretend our star players took less like Tampa's, where are you finding Norris and Vezina candidates to pay that extra money? Blaming 1-2 mil overpayments as the reason we don't have a Vasi or Hedman is insane, it would only be relevant if we had guys that good that we had to let go in UFA. All the extra cap would do is get you Kuemper instead of Murray and a 2-3mil D instead of Mete, you're still never getting Vasi/Hedman unless you get incredibly lucky and draft them.

Saving ~4M on the core (10.5x5 for Matthews, 6Mx6 for Nylander, 9Mx6 for Marner) doesn't get you a superstar, you need to draft them. Saving 4M on the cap allows you to get a Marino to shore up the right side or a Bjorkstrand/Niederreiter/Marchment to round out the top 6.

 

[stealth1]

I never said the Leafs have played well so far, I am just.. Not sure if I am laughing or sad or a bit of both with this board.

Honestly embarrassing reading this board this week. Especially because in 2 weeks these posters will all be gone.

You honestly think they are going to just flip a switch and go beast mode like last season? Over there next month I have them at .500 at best. They have a more difficult schedule then October.

 

[ULF_55]

Have we checked out the prospects?
Some really positive reviews coming in.
Might be too late for Dubas and Keefe.
Won't be too late for the fans though.

 

[ToneDog]

Matthews has one even strength point, how sad is that.

Let's give him 15.34mx8 (17% in an 90m cap). Better yet, let's give him a blank cheque and go down the same rat hole.

God let's hope we have a competent GM when Matthews is ready to negotiate his next deal.

 

[Gary Nylund]

You honestly think they are going to just flip a switch and go beast mode like last season? Over there next month I have them at .500 at best. They have a more difficult schedule then October.

It's hard to imagine at this point, isn't it? I mean it could happen but I'm not holding my breath.

Have we checked out the prospects?
Some really positive reviews coming in.
Might be too late for Dubas and Keefe.
Won't be too late for the fans though.

But ... but ... but ... didn't you hear that Dubas emptied our prospect pool and traded away our future?

Let's give him 15.34mx8 (17% in an 80m cap). Better yet, let's give him a blank cheque and go down the same rat hole.

God let's hope we have a competent GM when Matthews is ready to negotiate his next deal.

Yeah I'm pretty sure Matthews is going to get paid, and get paid a lot. The only thing the GM will get to decide is if we will pay him ourselves or let someone else do it.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Let's give him 15.34mx8 (17% in an 80m cap). Better yet, let's give him a blank cheque and go down the same rat hole.

God let's hope we have a competent GM when Matthews is ready to negotiate his next deal.

Or the best one - AM like Dubas so we have to keep Kyle

Wow can you believe the Panthers lost to the Coyotes? Their core should be blown up TBH. At least that would be my response if not for their *checks notes* 1 playoff series win in 25 years which somehow means there is hope for them

Sad when you have to look at other teams to prop up the Leafs

 

[ULF_55]

Or the best one - AM like Dubas so we have to keep Kyle


Sad when you have to look at other teams to prop up the Leafs

Yeah, better to look at the bigger picture:

Couple teams there need to get their heads straight.

 

[Magic Man]

One thing I'll never understand about Shanahan is how he became so soft. He was a mean power forward back in his day. After playing that role back in the day how is he not aware that physicality plays a difference in winning and losing. One of the better power forwards of all time is blowing his cup window because he allowed the team to be neutered from a physical perspective because spread sheets told him they don't need to be physical to win. That's really disappointing.

 

[hotpaws]

Tavares has played really well and even if he's overpaid by 2 million or so, that's hardly such a big problem that it dooms the team. Every team in the league has contract(s) that are worse than that, lets be serious here and that's why I said I'm sick about hearing how that signing doomed the team. UFA's are always overpaid by whatever and every team in the league pretty much wanted him so whining about that is such a joke.

he's overpaid by 3-4m , he's by far the biggest reason this team is where it is presently and yes ufa's get overpaid but smart teams only overpay for a need

 

[57 Years No Cup]

Like this, you mean? You'd be right - sometimes you need a few players that will drag the boys into the fight.

Watching Kadri and Komorov on this shift brings a tear to my eye. It was beautiful.

Sigh... those were the days. So much promise wasted.

 

[ULF_55]

Matthews has one even strength point, how sad is that.

1 EVG, 3 EVP.

Robertson-Nylander-marner
Tavares-Matthews-Malgin