Confirmed Signing with Link: [CAR/MTL] Habs accept Kotkaniemi offer sheet (1 year, $6.1M), 2022 1st, 2022 3rd [Part III]

[Moose Head]

Wait so the Molsons sold the team before then bought it back?

The former owners were the brewery, a corporation. The current owners are a group headed by the family who founded the brewery.

 

[Incubajerks]

This thread is still going?
I haven't logged in 2 weeks amd thus is still relevant?

KK is on pace for a 27 point season.
Why is this thread still active?

Because you haven't logged in 2 weeks but you are still bitter.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

how is he looking so far? I've caught a couple games and noticed him positively, but not sure if its because I have a vested interest or because he's actually doing good things.

Just as you’ve mentioned, he’s been making a positive impact. Doing the little things and working hard. Going to the net with intention and even started playing a bit physical.

Last night in Chicago he was part of two really good tic tac toe passing plays that would have ended up as easy tap in goals but the Canes messed up the ‘toe’.

 

[WaW]

how is he looking so far? I've caught a couple games and noticed him positively, but not sure if its because I have a vested interest or because he's actually doing good things.

He has 3 points in 9 games. Doesn't matter how many "little things" he does well if he's gonna continue with the offensive production he's had for his whole career as most non-Carolina fans predicted.

When the offensive numbers on a young player or a new acquisition (both, in this case) don't look great, people tend to over-emphasize how "good" he does at the little things.

Let's put it this way, when he's still putting up similar numbers like this through 30 games (i.e. sitting at like 8-12 points), you'll start seeing all of the "I told you so's" all over this thread.

No 6 million dollar player is worth his salary because "he works hard and plays well in his own zone!"

 

[inthe6ix]

He has 3 points in 9 games. Doesn't matter how many "little things" he does well if he's gonna continue with the offensive production he's had for his whole career as most non-Carolina fans predicted.

When the offensive numbers on a young player or a new acquisition (both, in this case) don't look great, people tend to over-emphasize how "good" he does at the little things.

Let's put it this way, when he's still putting up similar numbers like this through 30 games (i.e. sitting at like 8-12 points), you'll start seeing all of the "I told you so's" all over this thread.

No 6 million dollar player is worth his salary because "he works hard and plays well in his own zone!"

It wasn't about the salary, it was about revenge for Aho and despite what he says in the press, Dundon got it.

 

[WaW]

It wasn't about the salary, it was about revenge for Aho and despite what he says in the press, Dundon got it.

Way too early to make that assessment. If Kotkaniemi isn't going to show any offensive progression in what is now his 4th year, Montreal getting a 1st for him to flip for Dvorak is most likely for the best (although Dvorak needs to pick it up too). At this point, where he was picked just doesn't matter anymore. Offensively he's been the same guy for 3+ seasons now. He's still a bottom-sixer.

Dundon will have "gotten his revenge" if Kotkaniemi is gonna play like a top 6 forward for the first time in his career. This might take a few seasons to assess.

 

[BrindAmours Army]

how is he looking so far? I've caught a couple games and noticed him positively, but not sure if its because I have a vested interest or because he's actually doing good things.

With the exception of a rough first game I think he's looked great. He could easily have two or three more goals and three or four more assists. His skating isn't great, as advertised, but not terrible. Seems to enjoy playing with Aho and TT.

 

[Svechhammer]

At this point, the only ones complaining about Kotkaniemi's season so far are Habs fans

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

There’s a strong desire for Carolina to take an L here, but the downside risk was limited by design. The hot start is making the unlikely scenario of a fluke season leading to a Top 10 pick even more of a fantasy. The realistic worst case is a modest gamble (1st in the 20s) that doesn’t work out. As a result, Kotkaniemi doesn’t have to put up 70 points, the only way we’re not going to read commentary about point production or the qualifying offer, for this to result in an acceptable outcome. Trying to convince us otherwise will not be a successful venture.

 

[Lurk Muller]

Our methods are only controversial to those who lack imagination.

You'll be hard pressed to find a canes fan that cares about Kotkas numbers, at least in relation to his salary till we see his next contract. It might not even be with the Canes.

Honestly he's kinda exceeding my expectations after some Habs fans made it sound like he only had 1 leg and still managed to kick their dogs in his spare time.

I think other fans underestimate our ability to cheer for a guy that barely scores but tries real hard. That was kinda our brand for a decade or so.

 

[Svechhammer]

With the exception of a rough first game I think he's looked great. He could easily have two or three more goals and three or four more assists. His skating isn't great, as advertised, but not terrible. Seems to enjoy playing with Aho and TT.

Yeah and while it might not yet be showing on the scoresheet, he's already helping a lot offensively. He fills a pretty big hole that we've had in our roster for a while in that he's willing to just park his ass in front of the goalie in the offensive zone to screen. That alone has accounted for a few goals in and of itself, and while he might not have had an assist or scored it off a tip, he absolutely is enabling that to happen. Surprisingly, outside of Neiderriter and Staal, we really haven't had anyone else willing to do that, so this is a big need filled from his end, and its not a coincidence our scoring is way up right now because of it.

 

[McJedi]

Lost in all this. Dvorak doesn’t look very good in Montreal. He’s been a disappointing 2C so far.

hard to see the upgrade from KK to Dvorak. Looks lateral at best.

Dvorak was -4 at one point in the game last night. He’s probably been a negative move from KK. And cost the 1st round pick to land. Ouch.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

Seems to be the same player he was in Montreal so far . Solid 3rd C, good for him im rooting for him

 

[Svechhammer]

Seems to be the same player he was in Montreal so far . Solid 3rd C, good for him im rooting for him

He's a 2nd line winger for us that is playing 3rd line mins because Brindy shuffled the lineup after the Nino injury to inexplicably play Martinook on the 1st line, putting Svech on the 2nd.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

He's a 2nd line winger for us that is playing 3rd line mins because Brindy shuffled the lineup after the Nino injury to inexplicably play Martinook on the 1st line, putting Svech on the 2nd.

I did not check his time on ice im not that invested in following him but im def rooting for him. I just saw somebody point out his point production and figured he must be getting third line minutes or he would probably have more points. He's a solid little player. I dont know why you guys are so defensive about him being a third liner right now if hes helping the team win

 

[abo9]

With the exception of a rough first game I think he's looked great. He could easily have two or three more goals and three or four more assists. His skating isn't great, as advertised, but not terrible. Seems to enjoy playing with Aho and TT.

thanks. I believe people over emphasize the production over 10 games on a stacked team, and the dollar amount of that contract. The other night I think he was screening the goalie on a goal for you guys. It doesn't appear on the scoresheet but hey its useful and if he taps it in it will!

Like, the Canes are grossly underpaying To ny DeAngelo, and overpaying Kotka by 2-3M this year, I think the GM is managing the cap space fine.

And keeping in mind that he's completely stalled progression as a Hab, it might take a couple months to a year to get a real sense of how he's developing in Carolina.

he's always been a project and only 21.

 

[Svechhammer]

I did not check his time on ice im not that invested in following him but im def rooting for him. I just saw somebody point out his point production and figured he must be getting third line minutes or he would probably have more points. He's a solid little player. I dont know why you guys are so defensive about him being a third liner right now if hes helping the team win

Yeah, I mean there's only so much that the point total will tell you. We've generally been a team where guys struggle to really start lighting it up right away once they get here, but given time to gel they explode. That said, when it comes to him its really about his role, and he's filling some big areas of need for us. His ability to screen the goalie is really helping out whatever line is on the ice with him, even if he's not getting the points for it.

At this point, I'd say he's been a decent net positive for us. Not exploding on the scene, but generally makes us better with him than without. Definitely a piece we'll probably want to keep around going forward if he's willing to extend at something reasonable (around $3.5m aav)

 

[japhi]

Lost in all this. Dvorak doesn’t look very good in Montreal. He’s been a disappointing 2C so far.

hard to see the upgrade from KK to Dvorak. Looks lateral at best.

Lost in all of this is that the sample for most players YTD is too small. If Dvo or KK get 3 points next game it changes the math significantly.

I agree Dvo hasn't been great, but no one on MTL has and most of these guys will revert to the mean over the course of the season.

KK is actually producing what I expected him to, slightly under. I figured him for 35 points and that is probably where he lands. And I doubt that gets him the 4x4 that folks were talking about being in place. While it's great that he is creating net front presence, hard to believe there aren't 200 other guys in the league that could do same and produce .4ppg playing with guys producing 1.2 ppg. And he is pretty weak defensively.

That is the interesting aspect of all this, how do you price a guy that needs top 6 mins to produce bottom 6 production, that doesn't play shutdown or kill penalties.

But again, he is one big game away from being on pace for 50 points so silly to try and take too much from the first 9 games. And fwiw I am jealous.....of the Canes team! What a powerhouse, going be as very fun year for Canes fans.

 

[Habs Halifax]

The former owners were the brewery, a corporation. The current owners are a group headed by the family who founded the brewery.

So the Habs are owned by a family who also owns the Molson Coors Brewery? . I think the money they used to buy the Habs comes from money they earned selling Beer. Kind of where buddies statement comes from but technically your right

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

Like I'm sure every Canes fan would like KK to be scoring at a PPG clip (although that would certainly make extending him more problematic cap wise) but the fact is that regardless of what's showing up on the scoresheet... he IS playing well and he IS doing all the little things right.

Is that a cop out or cover up from Canes fans to make it seem like the deal is better than it is and we are actually disappointed with KK's play? If you want to think that then you can, but bottom line is KK is helping the Canes win games and that's all that matters in the end. I'd rather he keeps doing what he's doing and only show up on the scoresheet from time to time but actually impact the play positively on the ice rather than be a liability and rack up a bunch of secondary assists in losses or goals in garbage time.

Will the tune change if the Canes go on a losing streak and we could use help from secondary scoring and we aren't getting it? Sure, but I guess we'll cross that bridge when and if we come to it. It's 8 games into a season with a new team and he's moving all around the top 3 lines. Canes are confident he'll settle in and find chemistry with linemates eventually while impacting the scoresheet and on the ice. We're not worried so not sure why anyone else is...

 

[Price is Wright]

It's impressive how many don't understand that KK is currently an extra piece sliding into where he fits and next summer when Trochek and Nino are UFA and he's got a new deal that's when he becomes a vital part of the Hurricanes.

His stats don't matter that much this season unless someone goes down long term. He's depth on a cup run.

 

[Not The One]

It's impressive how many don't understand that KK is currently an extra piece sliding into where he fits and next summer when Trochek and Nino are UFA and he's got a new deal that's when he becomes a vital part of the Hurricanes.

His stats don't matter that much this season unless someone goes down long term. He's depth on a cup run.

Giving him a 1-year contract is a very strange way of locking up his services. He's basically a UFA if he doesn't get the offer he's looking for from the Canes. Plus he's not even playing as a C. If he ends up with about 25-30 points and another team offers him a million more than the Canes, why wouldn't choose the other offer.

I find it very strange that this could be an actual strategy that the team is counting on.

 

[BrindAmours Army]

Let's put it this way, when he's still putting up similar numbers like this through 30 games (i.e. sitting at like 8-12 points), you'll start seeing all of the "I told you so's" all over this thread.

"

We already are. They never stopped, because they are still salty.

 

[Grand Admiral Thrawn]

Because you haven't logged in 2 weeks but you are still bitter.

Bitter?
90% of Habs were more than happy to take the pics, stop it now.

 

[1909]

Giving him a 1-year contract is a very strange way of locking up his services. He's basically a UFA if he doesn't get the offer he's looking for from the Canes. Plus he's not even playing as a C. If he ends up with about 25-30 points and another team offers him a million more than the Canes, why wouldn't choose the other offer.

I find it very strange that this could be an actual strategy that the team is counting on.

He will still be an RFA at the end of this season.