Proposal: Leafs - Flames

[Ziggdiezan]

http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/rat...ers&minutes=1500&disp=1&sort=PCT&sortdir=DESC

It's 5 on 5 guy.

I wonder if you checked his p/60 and g/60 saw he was a top line player and decided to look at his 5v5 stats to find some way to prove your point.

Also I wouldn't traded Matthews straight up. Leafs need a #1C so bad

 

[BWDude]

Yes, like the last time the Leafs traded high end prospects/picks for a great winger worked out so well.

Never Again. Please, at least not until we see if keeping our guys is a valid method.

 

[Leafidelity]

No thanks.

 

[Mr Hockey*]

It would have to be Mattews+

if not then there is no need for a discussion. This is worse than the Brodie to Montreal trade earlier this week.

Matthews will win you a cup! Gaudreau will help win you a cup ...

 

[Blitzago*]

Leaf fans....

How often is a 22 year old 80 point forward traded? If ever he were traded I would want Marner, Nylander, a first round pick without protection and maybe more. The fact of the manner is you don't trade 22 year old PPG players for 20 year old prospects. Yes Nylander has played some NHL games but he will never be the player Gaudreau is today, i would be more than willing to bet on it also. Marner is forsure a nice piece but he is also no where near Gaudreau's level of talent, nor will he ever be.. He he was close he would already be in the NHL putting up points it's a simple fact.

There is nothing on your roster I trade Gaudteau for today. Nothing makes sense, yes Mathews may be close on value but we are already stacked at center and don't really need him, we need more Gaudreaus!

Sorry no deal to be found here

There's no 80 point forwards in this deal, you must be in the wrong place.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

There's no 80 point forwards in this deal, you must be in the wrong place.

Lol this guy.

 

[OvermanKingGainer]

If this trade happened, it would be because Gaudreau's contract demands are just not fitting (too short term or something?). If there's any team that could give reasonable value, Toronto is certainly that. Asking for Matthews is too high, even I admit Matthews is more valuable.

Marner + 2017 1st

Would probably be my ask. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[Mitchy]

If this trade happened, it would be because Gaudreau's contract demands are just not fitting (too short term or something?). If there's any team that could give reasonable value, Toronto is certainly that. Asking for Matthews is too high, even I admit Matthews is more valuable.

Marner + 2017 1st

Would probably be my ask. Nothing more, nothing less.

Perfectly fair. In fact, I think that favours Toronto.

Matthews would definitely be a no go. His value to the franchise is just too much.

 

[Mr Hockey*]

.............

 

[Connor]

I wonder if you checked his p/60 and g/60 saw he was a top line player and decided to look at his 5v5 stats to find some way to prove your point.

Also I wouldn't traded Matthews straight up. Leafs need a #1C so bad

Haha, you wonder incorrectly friend.

I went 5 on 5 because the ability to produce points at even strength separates the elite from the average. That's the FIRST AND ONLY stat I looked at.

... apparently Van Riemsdyk and Bozak are quite average.

 

[blueberrie]

Matthews+

Leafs dont do that one for one.

 

[OvermanKingGainer]

Perfectly fair. In fact, I think that favours Toronto.

Maybe. It really depends where 2016-17 Toronto ends up drafting. Marner + Liljegren probably favours Calgary if Marner pans out.

 

[Blitzago*]

Lol this guy.

It's an accurate statement, no?

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

It's an accurate statement, no?

If you're so concerned about accuracy, then by all means. Just seems like a weird thing to take issue with considering he scored 78p in 79gp. He's obviously capable of hitting 80 points.

Do you think Nylander is a 13 point player?

 

[Johnnybegood13]

Matthews will win you a cup! Gaudreau will help win you a cup ...

What does that even mean?

The only time Matthews has won anything is when he's on an allstar team(under 18), his club teams have done nothing.

Do I even have to list the awards Gaudreau and his teams have done over the last 5 or so years.

 

[Atomos2]

What does that even mean?

The only time Matthews has won anything is when he's on an allstar team(under 18), his club teams have done nothing.

Do I even have to list the awards Gaudreau and his teams have done over the last 5 or so years.

You win with dominant two way centres like Kopitar, Toews and Bergeron that will wear down opposing teams and be able to control the matchup game when the game gets tighter. It's common knowledge.

Wingers like Ovechkin, Hall, Tarasenko are fascinating to watch and will get you a lot of points in the regular season, but they cannot take you all the way to the promise land unless you have a dominant centre accompanying them.

 

[TOGuy14]

Haha, you wonder incorrectly friend.

I went 5 on 5 because the ability to produce points at even strength separates the elite from the average. That's the FIRST AND ONLY stat I looked at.[\b]

... apparently Van Riemsdyk and Bozak are quite average.

Basically you chose a singular arbitrary stat to base your entire argument on and have now declared it the be all and end all of player evaluation?

Ok then, seems like you are a rational person with reasonable debating techniques.

 

[Connor]

Basically you chose a singular arbitrary stat to base your entire argument on and have now declared it the be all and end all of player evaluation?

Ok then, seems like you are a rational person with reasonable debating techniques.

The stat I picked shows offensive production and evens it out between all players.

Van Riemsdyk and Bozak are not impact players or difference makers, at least offensively 5 on 5. They are not close to as good or valuable as you think.

 

[Randy Randerson]

The stat I picked shows offensive production and evens it out between all players.

Van Riemsdyk and Bozak are not impact players or difference makers, at least offensively 5 on 5. They are not close to as good or valuable as you think.

Its good that we had Colin Greening and Brad Boyes then, who were both in the top 90 forwards in 5 on 5 pts/60, so are top line forwards by definiton....right?

BTW, JVR was also a top 90 forward...so even using this single stat in isolation (which makes it so ridiculous that guys like Boyes and Greening are above him), JVR is still, by definition, a 1st line forward.

Maybe its worth considering that the leafs were the worst team in the NHL last year, and that its tough to put up points 5 on 5 if you're hemmed in your own zone all the time, or if your linemates are lower caliber

JVR - Kadri, Komarov, Phaneuf, Bozak
Gaudreau - Monahan, Giordano, Brodie, Hudler

Which set of linemates do you think helps point production more?

JVR's PP Pts/60 is actually better than anyone on the flames....so I guess even though he's not an impact player, he would be your best powerplay producer, since looking at stats in isolation works?

Oh, and Joe Colborne was Calgary's best player - how could you let him walk?? 2.52 5on5 pts/60....good for 10th in the NHL, he's elite.

I think I could be a really good GM, I could put together an under-the-radar group of first line forwards so cheap and easy (according to 5on5 Pts/60) - Erik Haula (46th), Nick Bonino (59th), Jannik Hansen (61st), Devante Smith-Pelley (69th), then I'll make a big push for Anasthasiou (7th) and the aforementioned Colborne (10th).....wow, powerhouse. How have NHL clubs not caught on to this inefficiency yet?? They're still chasing these so-called "elite" guys like Ovechkin (52nd), Malkin (58th), Getzlaf (92nd), Stamkos (96th) and Giroux (98th), or so-called "first liners" like Monahan (80th, a mere 4 spots ahead of JVR, who we can all agree is a pretty mediocre hockey player)


....point made, or shall I continue?

 

[TOGuy14]

The stat I picked shows offensive production and evens it out between all players.

Van Riemsdyk and Bozak are not impact players or difference makers, at least offensively 5 on 5. They are not close to as good or valuable as you think.

Over the past three seasons Sean Monahan is 122nd among forwards for P/60.

He is beaten by studs such as Michael Frolik, Brad Boyes, Zach Kassian, Ales Hemsky, Joe Colborne and more.

I think based on this evidence Sean Monahan is probably closer to a 3C than a 2C. This arbitrary stat does not lie, he is not as good or valuable as you think.

FWIW Gaudreau is ranked 35th in P/60 using this same metric. He is a mighty fine second line winger.

 

[Kelly]

Lol this guy.

Leaf fans get **** on for calling JVR a 30 goal player so fair is fair.

 

[Randy Randerson]

No we dont. But thats not what the guy i quoted said.. he said he wouldnt do the trade one for one.

Ah, apologies then. Yes we absolutely trade Marner for Gaudreau 1 for 1

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Leaf fans get **** on for calling JVR a 30 goal player so fair is fair.

Fight stupidity with stupidity? Yea, that's a good policy . . .

 

[therealkoho]

sorry that's not even close, Lupul is garbage, While is Calgary throwing anything in.

If it was going to happen it would be Marner and a significant plus. And I doubt its about money, Calgary's ownership group is one of the wealthier in the NHL.

Any trade of Gaudreau is a strict hockey trade.

I doubt it as well, but the only reason I could see even marginally for the original proposal, made by a Flamer btw, otherwise it makes no sense!

I'm surprised you didn't detect the sarcasm in my post.

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

If a reasonable deal could be made for a talented winger, obviously we would make it but this is what the thread has so far...



Basically two blue chip prospects, Bozak (good 2C), and JVR (1 LW) for Gaudreau and a bunch of cap dumps. How would this possible make us a better team?



Why would we give up the 1st OV + for a small winger, again this makes no sense.



Again two blue chips and an elite grinder for a small winger



This is just a straight up joke, won't even begin to discuss this...

I love how every leafs player is gold but the guy who was 6th in scoring in the league as a 22 year old is a "small winger", yah no bias at all in this post.....