Salary Cap: Do you trust Kyle Dubas with salary negotiations?

[ORRFForever]

So what would you have signed Nylander for?

I don't know. I can give you a lowball number now but, of course, hindsight is 20/20.

I just never thought Nylander was all that good in the first place.

 

[WickedPegJets]

Yes Kappy is a keeper.
Sometimes a one of skill player is not as important to team synergy as 2 players with a different skill set/multifunctional + a solid D when it comes down to cap/team/dynamic.

Yet the hard working scrappy Kappy is more likely to be traded at the trade deadline to acquire a top-4 dman (preferably a right-handed shooter).

 

[LeafFever]

I don't know. I can give you a lowball number now but, of course, hindsight is 20/20.

I just never thought Nylander was all that good in the first place.

He's worthy of 6.9 million.

 

[LeafFever]

Yet the hard working scrappy Kappy is more likely to be traded at the trade deadline to acquire a top-4 dman (preferably a right-handed shooter).

I would do it.

 

[Bomber0104]

Half of Hfboards would have made that same choice.

He was a consensus too 5 pick taken in the top 5 of a draft.....

Edit: phone autocorrect typo

Alright so the most important Leaf draft pick up until that point doesn't count because HFboards liked it too.

Got it.

 

[The Podium]

So what does what he wanted have to do with his horrible contract 7.5m per is the real amount. A vast over payment for too short of a deal. Dubas got bent over and then said thanks we will not trade you as long as I am the GM.

6.9 is the real amount, 7.5 is the amount to accommodate the time missed. It is a fictional number that is not paid out or reflected in the cap hit.

 

[Trapper]

Yet the hard working scrappy Kappy is more likely to be traded at the trade deadline to acquire a top-4 dman (preferably a right-handed shooter).

I won’t be a fan of Dubas if that happens.
Wrong guy to move as bad as we need a top 4 D.

 

[ORRFForever]

He's worthy of 6.9 million.

Fair enough. I don't see it, and never have (being honest), but smarter people than me agree with you so...

 

[Dreakmur]

So what would you have signed Nylander for?

6.5 times 8 years. Knock off .25 per year less.

 

[LeafingTheWay]

I just think an inexperienced GM, especially a kid, will fold to ensure he does not kill the Golden Goose of players he inherited. It's not his money and it's too easy to say, "I'd rather overpay than lose XYZ".

Of course, I don't know for sure. I just know how I thought when I was Dubas' age and I know I would have given in.

Then again, perhaps Nylander will start producing and it will end up being a good deal for the Leafs.

But that's the thing. Why do we assume that Dubas, a guy who's literally had to overcome all these old guys doubting his experience since he started as a 14 year old scout, would have the same thinking as you when you were his age? Literally at every step of his career, he's had people automatically assume things against him just because of his age. In my honest opinion man, it's super illogical to assume that.

He didn't inhereit those players, it was part of the rebuilding process. He was involved since since 2014/2015, which is when the rebuild started. He didn't have the final say in decisions of course, but he was part of this entire process.

My opinion on contract decisions (No facts, just an opinion like the others here I guess) : In the end, he amount he'll give to anyone in contracts is likely determined by the internal Cap guys (I.e Pridham). Every move is calculated. It's not like the olden guys who always got in cap issues, where they just went on 'gut' feelings.

 

[ORRFForever]

If I had been Dubas, I would have packaged Nylander with (fill in the blank) and traded for a higher end D-Man.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Originally with the Nylander negotiation it was reported he wanted the $8.5 million that Draisaitl got from the Oilers. Instead we heard Dubas offered $6.5 million and we know they agreed on $6.9 million. Now some would say Nylander won but in the end Dubas gave him an extra $400,000 and not even close to the $8.5 million. So yes I do trust Dubas going forward with the salary negotiations for Matthews and Marner.

 

[The Podium]

But that's the thing. Why do we assume that Dubas, a guy who's literally had to overcome all these old guys doubting his experience since he started as a 14 year old scout, would have the same thinking as you when you were his age? Literally at every step of his career, he's had people automatically assume things against him just because of his age. In my honest opinion man, it's super illogical to assume that.

He didn't inhereit those players, it was part of the rebuilding process. He was involved since since 2014/2015, which is when the rebuild started. He didn't have the final say in decisions of course, but he was part of this entire process.

My opinion on contract decisions (No facts, just an opinion like the others here I guess) : In the end, he amount he'll give to anyone in contracts is likely determined by the internal Cap guys (I.e Pridham). Every move is calculated. It's not like the olden guys who always got in cap issues, where they just went on 'gut' feelings.

This is an excellent post. People need to realize that 1 person isnt making all the decisions. They have the same guy in place dictating the numbers that they would have under Lou or any other GM.

 

[LeafFever]

If I had been Dubas, I would have packaged Nylander with (fill in the blank) and traded for a higher end D-Man.

Dubas is going to trade for a top 4 D.

 

[Slyfox]

His success vastly triumphs Dubas' both playing and managing.

AHL trophy notwithstanding.

And that's not up for debate.

Why isn't he a GM of an NHL team then?

 

[LeafingTheWay]

His success vastly triumphs Dubas' both playing and managing.

AHL trophy notwithstanding.

And that's not up for debate.

Yup managing with shady tactics gives him the upper hand clearly.

I mean ya in the NHL, Hunter could've used his shady skills and bribed players under the table too? Could've used MLSE's money to do it eh.

 

[diceman934]

6.9 is the real amount, 7.5 is the amount to accommodate the time missed. It is a fictional number that is not paid out or reflected in the cap hit.

There is nothing fictional about the money we will pay Nylander. The real number =real money paid. We over paid him by at least 1m per and rewarded him for sitting out.

 

[ORRFForever]

But that's the thing. Why do we assume that Dubas, a guy who's literally had to overcome all these old guys doubting his experience since he started as a 14 year old scout, would have the same thinking as you when you were his age? Literally at every step of his career, he's had people automatically assume things against him just because of his age. In my honest opinion man, it's super illogical to assume that.

He didn't inhereit those players, it was part of the rebuilding process. He was involved since since 2014/2015, which is when the rebuild started. He didn't have the final say in decisions of course, but he was part of this entire process.

My opinion on contract decisions (No facts, just an opinion like the others here I guess) : In the end, he amount he'll give to anyone in contracts is likely determined by the internal Cap guys (I.e Pridham). Every move is calculated. It's not like the olden guys who always got in cap issues, where they just went on 'gut' feelings.

You make good points. I just think, because of Dubas' age and inexperience, there was zero chance of Nylander not being overpaid. But, then again, as you and other have said, experienced GM's overpay all the time so... maybe Old Man Lou would have done the same thing.

 

[LeafFever]

There is nothing fictional about the money we will pay Nylander. The real number =real money paid. We over paid him by at least 1m per and rewarded him for sitting out.

You like 7.5 because it sounds worse.
It is a 6.9 million cap hit. That's all that matters to a rich team.

 

[WickedPegJets]

There is nothing fictional about the money we will pay Nylander. The real number =real money paid. We over paid him by at least 1m per and rewarded him for sitting out.

Don't think the rest of the hard working grinders on this team haven't noticed!

 

[Bomber0104]

Why isn't he a GM of an NHL team then?

Because he co-owns the London Knights.

 

[GodEmperor]

Our genius coach would still have him on the 4th line if Nylander signed in the summer.

This, keep in mind Babcock was actually dumb enough to play Komarov over him last year in the playoffs while giving Komarov PP time even, oh and you guys remember who was on our first line the 2nd game? Leo Komarov….OH AND YOU GUYS REMEMBER WHO TOOK A TOO MANY MEN PENALTY THAT PUT US DOWN 2-0 AFTER WE WERE DOMINATING THE GAME AND THEN WE ENDED UP BEING SPANKED??????????????? LEO KOMAROV.

Anyways Dubas' negotiations were fine, Nylander was paid completely fairly, funny because so many people here completely hated my "hot takes" on Nylander, yet the guy has proved to be pathetic beyond measure and yet people are unhappy with Dubas? Give me a break, the ONLY way negotiations go different is if Dubas believes like I do now about Nylander's character and it seems 9/10 fans were against my assessment so why get on Dubas for believing the same thing they did about Nylander????

 

[ORRFForever]

Dubas is going to trade for a top 4 D.

Hope so.

 

[LeafFever]

Because he co-owns the London Knights.

He's never even been interviewed.

 

[The Podium]

There is nothing fictional about the money we will pay Nylander. The real number =real money paid. We over paid him by at least 1m per and rewarded him for sitting out.

Nylander is paid the equivalent to 6.9 x 6 (41.4 million), not 7.5 (45 million). He lost ~ 3.5 million to time missed. The 7.5 million is a fictional number to give him the real number of 6.9, reflected in both pay and cap hit.