ATD 2017 Draft Thread IV

[TheDevilMadeMe]

This is sure have changed from the days when the idea was to make the ATD playoffs move quickly to avoid GMs losing interest.

 

[ResilientBeast]

This is sure have changed from the days when the idea was to make the ATD playoffs move quickly to avoid GMs losing interest.

This period was stretched and a gm or two said they wishes they had more time. There has to be a better solution but I'm struggling to find one.

 

[seventieslord]

This period was stretched and a gm or two said they wishes they had more time. There has to be a better solution but I'm struggling to find one.

The draft itself should move slower. No one will lose interest during the draft itself. More time for discussion and analysis of the drafted players, and for guys to get their bios done. Fewer bad, rushed picks.

Then move the playoffs faster.

 

[jarek]

There's just no consequence for not voting. every year a number of people completely check out in the later rounds and we never hold them accountable for it. It's often the same people too.

I like HT18's idea. It makes not voting have a major consequence because you lose your voice in the outcome. Obviously I would hope that having the vote on your own series count be dependent on voting on every other series too.

The only other thing I can think of to encourage voting is to give some kind of incentive for it, and the only incentive I can think of at the moment is choosing your draft position the following year.

 

[jarek]

This period was stretched and a gm or two said they wishes they had more time. There has to be a better solution but I'm struggling to find one.

One of those GMs admitted the fault was their own due to doing nothing the first week.

There is simply nothing left to do at this point but to move it along and hope the GMs that skipped this round show up for next round.

To be clear, I am saying that we should just go ahead with whatever voting we have. We *might* get 1-2 more votes and it might take a week to get them. Not worth it.

The draft itself should move slower. No one will lose interest during the draft itself. More time for discussion and analysis of the drafted players, and for guys to get their bios done. Fewer bad, rushed picks.

Then move the playoffs faster.

We've already had people complaining the draft moves too slow - myself included. IF there was some compelling discussion left to be had, I'd be all for it, but I have barely seen anything the last few years. There just isn't much left to be discussed that hasn't already been done so, unless someone finds some ground breaking new information on a player, or an era, or what have you.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

I like HT18's idea. It makes not voting have a major consequence because you lose your voice in the outcome. Obviously I would hope that having the vote on your own series count be dependent on voting on every other series too.

The only other thing I can think of to encourage voting is to give some kind of incentive for it, and the only incentive I can think of at the moment is choosing your draft position the following year.

Of course, it's all or none when it come to voting

 

[seventieslord]

I like HT18's idea. It makes not voting have a major consequence because you lose your voice in the outcome. Obviously I would hope that having the vote on your own series count be dependent on voting on every other series too.

The only other thing I can think of to encourage voting is to give some kind of incentive for it, and the only incentive I can think of at the moment is choosing your draft position the following year.

The first part solves a minor problem (guys not even eliminated who aren't voting) but won't solve the big problem (guys eliminated who are now checked out).

The second part might help with that but I don't think that much.

One of those GMs admitted the fault was their own due to doing nothing the first week.

There is simply nothing left to do at this point but to move it along and hope the GMs that skipped this round show up for next round.

To be clear, I am saying that we should just go ahead with whatever voting we have. We *might* get 1-2 more votes and it might take a week to get them. Not worth it.

This is unfortunately correct.

We've already had people complaining the draft moves too slow - myself included. IF there was some compelling discussion left to be had, I'd be all for it, but I have barely seen anything the last few years. There just isn't much left to be discussed that hasn't already been done so, unless someone finds some ground breaking new information on a player, or an era, or what have you.

So? let them complain. They won't lose interest to the point that they leave and don't come back.

If there's not enough compelling discussion, then we aren't, as a group, excited enough for the draft. And maybe we should think about having it every second year. Absence will make the heart grow fonder.

 

[jarek]

Why isn't it possible that there simply aren't enough compelling discussion points remaining?

 

[seventieslord]

Why isn't it possible that there simply aren't enough compelling discussion points remaining?

Whether there are or there aren't, i don't think it changes what I said.

 

[BenchBrawl]

So are we moving forward with what we have?

 

[ResilientBeast]

So are we moving forward with what we have?

I asked Theokritos to release the votes we have yesterday

 

[jarek]

Whether there are or there aren't, i don't think it changes what I said.

I think it kind of does, actually. If there aren't enough compelling discussion points remaining, it doesn't matter if you do an ATD every year or every 10 years - you're going to have the same problem.

The easiest and simplest counteraction to this is getting more new people in who aren't so familiar with all the players, AND who are also willing to start the discussions themselves.

 

[Theokritos]

Cole Division Consolation Round

Toronto Maple Leafs defeat Montreal AAA in 7 games
Stars: ***Bobby Orr, **Milt Schmidt, *Mark Messier

Next round:
Coleman Conference Consolation Round: Toronto Maple Austons vs Toronto Maple Leafs
Fisher Conference Consolation Round: Miami Screaming Eagles vs Strathcona Shadows

 

[jarek]

Coleman Conference Consolation Round: Toronto Maple Austons vs Toronto Maple Leafs

Lol.

 

[Theokritos]

The Toronto derby, a true classic.

 

[Theokritos]

Playoff

We ended up with 15 ballots. Voters: BenchBrawl, chaosrevolver, Iceman, Hawkey Town 18, jarek, Johnny Engine, King Forsberg, Namba 17, ResilientBeast, seventieslord, Sprague Cleghorn, TDMM, tinyzombies, tony d, Voight.

Bob Cole Division Final:

Chicago Shamrocks defeat Southern Shore Breakers in 7 games
Stars: ***Syl Apps, **Howie Morenz, *Chris Chelios​

Rene Lecavalier Division Final:

West Lafayette Lion Tamers defeat Dukla Jihlava in 7 games
Stars: ***Jacques Plante, **Gordie Howe, *Newsy Lalonde​

Foster Hewitt Division Final:

Montreal Maroons defeat Cobalt Silver Kings in 7 games
Stars: ***Henri Richard, **Georges Vézina, *Cyclone Taylor
​

Jim Robson Division Final:

Montreal Canadiens defeat Regina Pats in 7 games
Stars: ***Patrick Roy, **Doug Harvey, *Bryan Trottier​

Next round:
Coleman Conference Final: Chicago Shamrocks vs West Lafayette Lion Tamers
Fisher Conference Final: Montreal Canadiens vs Montreal Maroons

 

[jarek]

I know it's the long weekend, but.. wow.

 

[BenchBrawl]

I know it's the long weekend, but.. wow.

Don't worry, some action will develop.On a personal note I'm just checking my opponent's players more in depth, re-reading threads/bios and so on before I start my case.

 

[seventieslord]

I think it kind of does, actually. If there aren't enough compelling discussion points remaining, it doesn't matter if you do an ATD every year or every 10 years - you're going to have the same problem.

Of course it matters. One of the reasons there's a perception that there aren't as many compelling discussion points, is because not much changes in the pecking order of all-time players year after year. In two years there will be twice as much change, leading to more impetus for discussion.

Also, even if there wasn't any change in two years, the long layoff would cause people to be less bored and more excited. They wouldn't see the reopening of a topic as "the same old thing we talked about last year", it would be two years since it was last brought up.

The easiest and simplest counteraction to this is getting more new people in who aren't so familiar with all the players, AND who are also willing to start the discussions themselves.

This is a benefit no matter what. Whether the ATD is in trouble or not.

New suggestion - Force a different league size every season. And not just a little different. A lot different. For example, after this year's 25-team draft, force next year's draft to be outside the range of 21-29 teams. Whatever it settles on for 2018, make sure 2019 is not within 4 teams of that.

Every year we just have to get a feel for whether it's going to be a plus or minus year, and start gearing towards it. If we have a goal for a number of teams, it's typically reachable, whether by encouraging guys to team up (think guys who check out early) or discouraging it while aggressively pursuing annual fence-sitters.

A much different number of teams in the draft is a great way to keep it interesting because it really shakes up the players, particularly in the middle of the draft, putting guys in roles we may not have usually put them in.

 

[jarek]

Yes I agree about different draft sizes every year wholeheartedly, even if it has to be artificially forced.

 

[Iceman]

In worst case, allow people to manage 2 teams.

 

[seventieslord]

In worst case, allow people to manage 2 teams.

Agree. In worst case.

If we're in a situation where we had 25 last year and therefore need 30+ or 21- and we're getting on the high side, then yes, absolutely.

 

[ResilientBeast]

I'd like to get the voting for this round open in about a week just so we can keep this moving and end before the actual playoffs

 

[ResilientBeast]

I'd like to get the voting for this round open in about a week just so we can keep this moving and end before the actual playoffs

So no opposition to voting opening mid next week? (Wednesday?)

 

[jarek]

So no opposition to voting opening mid next week? (Wednesday?)

I hope that someone shows up in my series between now and then.