Proposal: Would you trade Stutzle for Matthews?

[GCK]

I'm not a Leafs fan first of all, second of all Zibby has 37 goals and is on pace to break 40 as well, is he a 60 goal player? No. And Stutzle won't be either. Matthews is.

I see you are a Rangers fan, that explains why you are trying to minimize the player who went two spots after Laf.

 

[TS Quint]

The mental gymnastics in this thread is awesome.

 

[Habs Halifax]

No comment

 

[Lahey]

If that's "wasting" the end of someone's career, then what exactly did your Leafs do to Spezza, Marleau and Thornton? Giordano and Simmonds next. And finally, Mr. Toronto himself Johnny T. Or is extending their season by 2 weeks considered a success to you?

Giroux is a point per game player right now, he has a few years left and Ottawa will give him at least 1-2 playoff runs. Who knows, he may even win a playoff series for his home team before Mr. Toronto does.


Auston Matthews' 3rd season:
68GP 37G 36A 73P, -9 on a playoff team

Tim Stützle's 3rd season:
66GP 35G 43A 78P, -2 on a non-playoff team

Not trying to say Tim is better, but how can you confidently say that Tim will never hit 50 when his numbers at the same age are nearly identical as your boy wonder Matthews? Or was that an "off'" year for him too?

Stützle is playing at a 43 goal pace through 66 games and just turned 21, and you're saying he'll never sniff 50. You're kind of a clown and a bad look for the smart leaf fans.

context matters.

Tim Stu 3rd season: 20:56 Ice time/Game on a bad team
Matthews 3rd season (with idiotic babcock): 18:33 Ice time/Game on a good team

Babcock fired the next season.

 

[Golden_Jet]

context matters.

Tim Stu 3rd season: 20:56 Ice time/Game on a bad team
Matthews 3rd season (with idiotic babcock): 18:33 Ice time/Game on a good team

Babcock fired the next season.

Looks like a lot that extra time is PK.
Started PKing around Christmas , now has 3 shorties.

 

[Future]

This will go down as another HF all time classic

Get as many shots in as you can while he has his first down season playing through an injury.

 

[LokiDog]

All of the ignoring contracts, ignoring age, ignoring what Matthews’ next contract will look like posts are dumb. The question isn’t who would you want on your team in a vacuum. The question is would you trade Stutzle for Matthews. The answer is no. It’s always no. Stutzle’s new contract hasn’t even begun and he’s 10 games away from finishing a 97 point pace season (where he’ll reach 90). Just turned 21 and his next contract takes him until the end of his 29 year old season at 8.35M. Matthews has one year left on an 11.6M deal and will be 26 when it starts. He’s going to be 27 and getting 12M until he’s 34-35. The answer is 100% always no. You’re not trading a 90 point 21 year old center locked into 8.35 until he’s 30 for a 26 year old center who needs a new contract that will likely cost 4M more than the 21 year old and taking him well past his prime years, even if he has been a 110 point player.

 

[authentic]

+- is a bad way of judging a player's defensive abilities, because Toronto collectively is a better team and it shows in the statistics of the majority of players.
Stützle is pretty good defensively as well, he backchecks hard and gets a lot of penalty kill time. But he plays on a team without any defensive structure. That is not his fault.

That was just the simplest example to show the gap between the two as two-way players. No one sane thinks Stutzle compares to Matthews defensively.

Matthews has by far the best +/- on his own team and Stutzle isn't even top 5 on a worse team. Look at possession, blocked shots, takeaways, etc. Better yet watch them play and you would know Stutzle still isn't as good as Matthews playing injured.

 

[authentic]

If that's "wasting" the end of someone's career, then what exactly did your Leafs do to Spezza, Marleau and Thornton? Giordano and Simmonds next. And finally, Mr. Toronto himself Johnny T. Or is extending their season by 2 weeks considered a success to you?

Giroux is a point per game player right now, he has a few years left and Ottawa will give him at least 1-2 playoff runs. Who knows, he may even win a playoff series for his home team before Mr. Toronto does.


Auston Matthews' 3rd season:
68GP 37G 36A 73P, -9 on a playoff team

Tim Stützle's 3rd season:
66GP 35G 43A 78P, -2 on a non-playoff team

Not trying to say Tim is better, but how can you confidently say that Tim will never hit 50 when his numbers at the same age are nearly identical as your boy wonder Matthews? Or was that an "off'" year for him too?

Stützle is playing at a 43 goal pace through 66 games and just turned 21, and you're saying he'll never sniff 50. You're kind of a clown and a bad look for the smart leaf fans.

A 43 goal pace in todays scoring environment is really good but Matthews finished tied for 2nd in goals as a 19 year old rookie with 17 minutes ice time and 2:20 powerplay time per game. Can you even imagine thinking they're comparable?

 

[TS Quint]

That was just the simplest example to show the gap between the two as two-way players. No one sane thinks Stutzle compares to Matthews defensively.

Matthews has by far the best +/- on his own team and Stutzle isn't even top 5 on a worse team. Look at possession, blocked shots, takeaways, etc. Better yet watch them play and you would know Stutzle still isn't as good as Matthews playing injured.

Isn’t it easier for opposing teams to game plan to stop the Sens top line than the Leafs? With the Leafs you have to pick your poison on which line you don’t put your best checkers on. With the Sens I’m pretty sure it’s not much of a choice who you try to shut down.

 

[authentic]

Isn’t it easier for opposing teams to game plan to stop the Sens top line than the Leafs? With the Leafs you have to pick your poison on which line you don’t put your best checkers on. With the Sens I’m pretty sure it’s not much of a choice who you try to shut down.

You could certainly argue that, but really what are we saying here, do people really not believe Matthews is the clearly better two-way player? He got 7 2nd place votes for the Selke last season playing infront of goalies with under 870 sv% when he was on the ice.

 

[McVespa99]

Yes he does .. logic and common sense agrees just fine ...its simple. It's easy ...Tim is a good player and will probably get better but he will never win a hart or Rocket...its just not happening. AM34 will probably win more rockets and could even be MVP again if mcdavid has an off year. Like I said the only way a trade wukf happen is if AM34 informed dubas he would not return and asked for a trade....the. Tim would be a excellent prize to recoup but that's where it ends.

Agree to disagree, with your take and your "logic and common sense"

 

[Golden_Jet]

That was just the simplest example to show the gap between the two as two-way players. No one sane thinks Stutzle compares to Matthews defensively.

Matthews has by far the best +/- on his own team and Stutzle isn't even top 5 on a worse team. Look at possession, blocked shots, takeaways, etc. Better yet watch them play and you would know Stutzle still isn't as good as Matthews playing injured.

This coming from the poster that says only 4th line scrubs PK. So not the best judge of 2 way play.

 

[Atomos2]

Love how AM will probably win more, if McDavid has an off year, but no chance Tim can win in the same situation, 21 years old and on pace of 43 goals and 93 points, but no chance he every scores close to AM, LOL oh leafs fans, AM is the better player now, no doubt, but this implication that a 21 year old won't get better, even though he is and that a guy who had 60 goals once (yes only once leafs fans) will be a perennial rocket winner (even though he's only won once) is f***ing hilarious.

Love how the trade could happen but only if AM asks out, as if any team gives up a player like TS for a guy that wants out, the level of delusion it would take to believe some of the crap you guys are peddling, WOW

Learn to fact check. It destroys your credibility.

 

[Qward]

This will go down as another HF all time classic thread.

People just can’t help themselves. Get as many shots in as you can now while he has his first down season playing through a hand injury.

Okay.

He's also ugly.

 

[TkachukNorris79]

I'm not a Leafs fan first of all, second of all Zibby has 37 goals and is on pace to break 40 as well, is he a 60 goal player? No. And Stutzle won't be either. Matthews is.

Okay but Zibby is turning 30 in a month, he is likely already at his ceiling, if not very close to it. Zibanejad isn't on the level that Matthews/Stutzle was at the same age, and this is coming from someone who got to watch him every night those years. He had 16 goals as a 21 year old... And then continued to improve, as does almost every 21 year old NHL player.

Tim just turned 21 in January and we still have no idea where his ceiling is... Not sure why you are so sure that he won't hit 50 in his career when he will break 40 before his ELC is up.

 

[Lemontree]

By that logic AM would never have a chance at winning again either right? Oh and is this year not a down year for AM? So this year will never happen again for AM? TS is 21 and on pace for 97 points, if that alone isn't "elite" as you say I'd love to know your definition of elite is?........ AM has one season of 60 goals, but will be a perennial rocket winner, TS at 21 is on pace for 43 goals but will "somehow" never touch AM and his one (ONE) 60 goal season. ok then.......

You said the leafs could trade for someone like TS if AM wanted out, my argument is there is no chance in hell a team trades a player like TS for a player that wants out. Any chance you can counter argue that, since, you know, that was your argument? Unless the sheer lunacy of it has no counter argument, which makes sense if that's what ya wanna go with?

Matthews is the back to back Rocket winner and finished 1 goal off of shared winners in 2019-2020.

Only Ovechkin has more goals than Matthew since 2016-17 (Matthews rookie year). Definitely dumb of some people to consider Matthews a Rocket contender each year. Your username seems more factually accurate than your opinions.

 

[Jerkbait]

Agree to disagree, with your take and your "logic and common sense"

Fair enough but I think you will history will repeat itself here..

 

[Atomos2]

Not a chance I would trade 8+ years of Stutzle for 1+ year of Matthews. You'd be crazy to. Will Matthews always be the better player? What about in say 2-3 years? You can't say for sure. He is a great player but it's arguable that Marner is just as good or even better so they inflate each other's stats. Stutzle plays with Tkachuk and other good players too, but not one as good as Mariner (I realize M and M aren't always on the same line, but they are sometimes plus the PP, maybe Matthews is well behind last year's pace from playing less with Marner) .

Which is funny because not even a month ago we had Sens fans claiming Tkachuk is better than Marner

Brady Tkachuk vs Mitch Marner

Marner has proven he is soft and can't show up when it matters. So you need to subtract that from his regular season accomplishments. It's a big subtraction. We've been waiting a long time for Playoff Warrior Tkachuk to show up.

forums.hfboards.com

So you can see why Leaf fans aren't taking these comparisons seriously. Eventually every Leaf will lose to the shiny new toy until something shinier and newer comes along.

 

[Jerkbait]

By that logic AM would never have a chance at winning again either right? Oh and is this year not a down year for AM? So this year will never happen again for AM? TS is 21 and on pace for 97 points, if that alone isn't "elite" as you say I'd love to know your definition of elite is?........ AM has one season of 60 goals, but will be a perennial rocket winner, TS at 21 is on pace for 43 goals but will "somehow" never touch AM and his one (ONE) 60 goal season. ok then.......

You said the leafs could trade for someone like TS if AM wanted out, my argument is there is no chance in hell a team trades a player like TS for a player that wants out. Any chance you can counter argue that, since, you know, that was your argument? Unless the sheer lunacy of it has no counter argument, which makes sense if that's what ya wanna go with?

Thats correct as long as AM34, McDavid, Berard, DP, and Thompson are playing Tim will not win a rocket...its not a prediction its a guarantee. We won't talk about the hart cause that's silly
Now for the next 4 years dubas inst considering any trade for Matthews unless the players name is Cale or conner..
Just ask him

 

[Golden_Jet]

Thats correct as long as AM34, McDavid, Berard, DP, and Thompson are playing Tim will not win a rocket...its not a prediction its a guarantee. We won't talk about the hart cause that's silly
Now for the next 4 years dubas inst considering any trade for Matthews unless the players name is Cale or conner..
Just ask him

Dubas won’t be there in 4 years.

That’s not a prediction,, a guarantee as you like to say

 

[playasRus]

Is his Ceiling as high as Matthews' though? Maybe I'm wrong but I consider Matthews's season this year to be more of an anomaly than the norm. His past 3 seasons were pretty consistent as far as his pace is concerned. I expect him to rebound next year

I didn't even realize Matthews was having an "off" year.
But skimming the thread, I think the Matthews vs Stutzle debate is pretty unanimously answered well. Head to head, Matthews. Real life situation, Stutzle.

As for trolling for likes/attention, Methot I find is actually hilarious and actually rather well spoken compared to the average Canadian. Does he need any more attention if he's already on TSN? I think he might be a bit sadistic though becaues he really knows how to get the "leafs fanboys" up in arms. And then he just kind of f***s off after creating the chaos lol

 

[Jerkbait]

Dubas won’t be there in 4 years.

That’s not a prediction,, a guarantee as you like to say

I think you might be surprised and falter on your prediction ....the leafs should beat tamap this year thus securing a extension for mr dubas

 

[Choralone]

In answer to the original question: the short answer is no.

The long answer is noooooooooooo.

 

[TkachukNorris79]

Thats correct as long as AM34, McDavid, Berard, DP, and Thompson are playing Tim will not win a rocket...its not a prediction its a guarantee. We won't talk about the hart cause that's silly
Now for the next 4 years dubas inst considering any trade for Matthews unless the players name is Cale or conner..
Just ask him

Who's Berard? We drafted him in the 90s, didn't think he was still playing but good for him, the #1OA finally panned out.

Also with Tage... agreed he should be a rocket contender for years to come but would you have said the same thing 4 years ago when he was 21 and had 7 goals for the Sabres? No, you wouldn't have... and THAT is a guarantee.

The point is that young players the same age as Stutzle tend to improve more often than not. So if Tage is in that conversation now, Stutzle could very well be there 4-5 years from now, considering he will very likely be one of 10 players (TEN!!) players since the lockout to pot 40 in a season by 21 (Jack Hughes should do it this year too). Not sure how on Earth you can guarantee he has no chance, you're kinda making yourself look a little dumb.

Finally, Dubas doesn't need to consider a trade for Matthews if he doesn't want to stay there. He could be gone for absolutely nothing in 15 months.