What would you have done?

[Ianturnedbull]

How do you know? You're the one making claims based on absolutely nothing that are contrary to what has been reported. Based on reports, Ottawa had another trade lined up, so there's absolutely no reason to think that we could have gotten more.

It is for Toronto, who would miss out on a deal and goalie they wanted. It's clear you just don't like Murray, so just say that, instead of making false claims the Leafs could have extracted more.

Not exactly an accurate description of those goalies, and those weren't our only options. It doesn't really say anything about management, since pretty much 95% of the goalies in the NHL (and all of the ones available) carry some risk where you could make a similar type of negative comment about them.

Not accurate? So why would Dubas trade a 1st to get rid of a "healthy" /"talented" Petr Mrazek?

 

[Leaf Fans]

I like these threads where I can use my imagination, so I let mine run wild. I would have tradded for McDavid@50% for Muzzin and Kerfoot. Then traded Sandin for Makar. The pettioned the NHL to ignore the salary cap and the would agree because of my guile and cunning while negotiating l. The I would add lTom Wilson and Trent Fredrick. Trade Samsonov to Dallas for Oettinger.

Not accurate? So why would Dubas trade a 1st to get rid of a "healthy" /"talented" Petr Mrazek?

He got "change" back on the pick. The Leafs dropped 13 spots and didn't get the extra 3rd or 4th for dropping down.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

How do you know? You're the one making claims based on absolutely nothing that are contrary to what has been reported. Based on reports, Ottawa had another trade lined up, so there's absolutely no reason to think that we could have gotten more.

It is for Toronto, who would miss out on a deal and goalie they wanted. It's clear you just don't like Murray, so just say that, instead of making false claims the Leafs could have extracted more.

Not exactly an accurate description of those goalies, and those weren't our only options. It doesn't really say anything about management, since pretty much 95% of the goalies in the NHL (and all of the ones available) carry some risk where you could make a similar type of negative comment about them.

Im not talking about it getting better for Future Considerations I'm talking about making the deal bigger. forget about those draft picks that seems like a perfect opportunity for an upgrade, I was kinda hoping we would have added to grab a decent depth player to justify this major gamble on Murray

I dont think it's crazy to think there could have been a bigger trade here

and so what if they moved Murray else where. they had to of had a Plan B guy I mean Murray is likely as good as any plan b option

Trade is what it is but I can't help but think someone else could have done better than Dubas. I dont really ever take part in ripping Dubas I think he's had his ups and downs but this move imo is one of his worsts. Hope he proves everyone wrong

 

[Dekes For Days]

Not accurate? So why would Dubas trade a 1st to get rid of a "healthy" /"talented" Petr Mrazek?

He didn't trade a 1st to get rid of anybody. He traded 13 draft slots to start fresh with his goalies.

Im not talking about it getting better for Future Considerations I'm talking about making the deal bigger. forget about those draft picks that seems like a perfect opportunity for an upgrade, I was kinda hoping we would have added to grab a decent depth player

The only depth player Ottawa traded was Brown, who we probably could have got if we wanted, but he wasn't really worth spending a 2nd round pick on for us. If you wish we targeted Brown, then just say that - don't make it into this false claim that we could have gotten more out of this unrelated trade.

and so what if they moved Murray else where. they had to of had a Plan B guy

I'm sure they had a plan B, but they didn't need a plan B. They liked Murray and got a deal they liked. No reason to pass up plan A.

Trade is what it is but I can't help but think someone else could have done better than Dubas.

There is literally zero evidence of that.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

Not accurate? So why would Dubas trade a 1st to get rid of a "healthy" /"talented" Petr Mrazek?

I would have rather given Mrazek a chance to have a bounce back season before paying to dump Mrazek to take on Murray for basically chump change. if Ottawa was desperate the ask should have been higher or try to just include him in a bigger deal where Toronto gets something else we could use.
instead Ottawa moved out a bad contract for a low cost. given Leafs situation Id rather pay a little to get a higher retain of 25%

 

[Dekes For Days]

if Ottawa was desperate

People seem to think Ottawa was a lot more desperate than they were.

instead Ottawa moved out a bad contract for a low cost

1.6m in dead cap for 2 years and 2 draft picks isn't really a low cost.

given Leafs situation Id rather pay a little to get a higher retain of 25%

By all accounts, Ottawa was unwilling to retain more than 25%.

 

[Maple Leaf]

Kachuck wanted sandy beaches and low tax lol

 

[Holymakinaw]

I would have tried hard for Ville Husso and MAF.

 

[Maple Leaf]

I would have tampered and asked McDavid if he wants to come over

 

[Arthur Morgan]

People seem to think Ottawa was a lot more desperate than they were.

1.6m in dead cap for 2 years and 2 draft picks isn't really a low cost.

By all accounts, Ottawa was unwilling to retain more than 25%.

Was there even really another team that wanted Murray? or is that something that they spun so Dubas would take Murray for those low adds? I mean how much more would Ottawa have to of added for that other team to take him?
They chose to send him to a rival team, Pretty clear that the other team wanted more.
Feels like Dubas got played, but hey its your choice to view this as a positive.

We took a negative contract for very minimal adds and helped Ottawa more than they helped us.....

and thats fine in these situations where if they arent willing to give more thats where you walk away. we did Ottawa a favor not the other way around

 

[All Mod Cons]

He didn't trade a 1st to get rid of anybody. He traded 13 draft slots to start fresh with his goalies.

The only depth player Ottawa traded was Brown, who we probably could have got if we wanted, but he wasn't really worth spending a 2nd round pick on for us. If you wish we targeted Brown, then just say that - don't make it into this false claim that we could have gotten more out of this unrelated trade.

I'm sure they had a plan B, but they didn't need a plan B. They liked Murray and got a deal they liked. No reason to pass up plan A.

There is literally zero evidence of that.

He literally traded a 1st round pick. That's undeniably true. He traded a 1st round pick. He got stuff back in return.

To say he "didn't trade a 1st to get rid of anybody" is the biggest lie I've ever seem on this site.

 

[andora]

Before 2020 and pandemic what were the cap projections for the next year and next couple years if they could project that far?

In 2018 were the increases in 2018/19 and 2019/20 accurate to projections?

I look back and wonder if i had the cap as it was, projections in front of me, an incomplete defence, a non long term goaltending situation and a shit load of forwards of all ages and believe i might have had to turn tavares away.

Or at least say this is the number based on what we have now, what we project to be spending already at your position and what we project to spend on defence and goaltending .. that is the number we can work you in at

 

[TheVision]

Had I known Bjorkstrand was available for a 3rd and 4th round pick, I would have certainly kicked tires on that. Jarnkrok and Aube-Kubel were both decent signings, and Samsanov is a guy I thought we should have looked at in season last year; so far not so bad. I really wanted Nick Cousins for the 3rd line. Motte and ZAR are bottom 6 guys we should most certainly be looking at.

 

[kb]

I would have tried hard for Ville Husso and MAF.

Are they honestly better than what the Leafs have now?

Unless you have a Shesterkin or a Vasi, they all have question marks. Personal preference doesn't mean better.

 

[Holymakinaw]

Are they honestly better than what the Leafs have now?

Yes.

 

[Dekes For Days]

To say he "didn't trade a 1st to get rid of anybody" is the biggest lie I've ever seem on this site.

So I assume you believe it's accurate to say that we traded Mrazek for a 2nd round pick?

Was there even really another team that wanted Murray?

Yes, and they were reportedly willing to take 25% retention as well. Which is why it's ridiculous to suggest we could have gotten more, when there's absolutely zero evidence of that.

if they arent willing to give more thats where you walk away. we did Ottawa a favor not the other way around

You don't walk away if you're getting what you wanted. That's ridiculous. We didn't do Ottawa a favour. We helped each other. It's called a trade. We gained a goalie that we wanted and 2 draft picks, and Ottawa got to clear up 3/4 of the cap space they had allocated to him.

 

[Magic Man]

I'd take Samsonov at 1.8M over Husso at 4.75M over 3 years with a 10-team no trade list.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Are they honestly better than what the Leafs have now?

Unless you have a Shesterkin or a Vasi, they all have question marks. Personal preference doesn't mean better.

I think I agree with you about Husso and MAF, but I don't think that goalies are all "voodoo". I don't think i believe that there's only Shest and Vasi and no other goalie. There are good goalies. There are dependable goalies too.

 

[kb]

Yes.

Opinion, not fact.

 

[Mess]

So I assume you believe it's accurate to say that we traded Mrazek for a 2nd round pick?

The Toronto Maple Leafs traded goalie Petr Mrazek and their 1st round pick No. 25 (#25-Sam Rinzel) to the Chicago Blackhawks for the No. 38 pick (#38-Fraser Minten) in the 2022 NHL Draft.

The Leafs didn't retain any of Mrazek's $3.8 million cap hit as the Blackhawks picked up the full contract.

 

[Dekes For Days]

The Toronto Maple Leafs traded goalie Petr Mrazek and their 1st round pick No. 25 (#25-Sam Rinzel) to the Chicago Blackhawks for the No. 38 pick (#38-Fraser Minten) in the 2022 NHL Draft.

The Leafs didn't retain any of Mrazek's $3.8 million cap hit as the Blackhawks picked up the full contract.

Yes, I'm well aware of that. A point was being made to show that you can't just ignore a significant part of the deal when describing it.

 

[Holymakinaw]

Opinion, not fact.

Nah. Fact.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Nah. Fact.

Fleury is going to be 38 next year, and was not good last year in the regular season or playoffs. He was also never an option, as he re-signed with his team before UFA.
Husso only has 64 career NHL games (regular season + playoffs), and while he had a good 40 games in the regular season this year, he had the worst GSAx in the league in the playoffs. He also costs more than Murray and would have cost a 3rd or more to acquire.

It is not fact that these two would have been better options.

 

[Tarmore]

Muzzin wasn't a top pair dman in Toronto ever, always playing behind Morgan Rielly and always on the 2nd pairing. He might have been one in his Stanley Cup days with LA, but then he was paired with Drew Doughty a Norris & Conn Smythe Dman, but that was nearly 10 years ago now.

Last year Jake Muzzin played in only 47 games (missing almost 1/2 a season) produced 3 goals 14 points and was a -6 +/- on the year. Those are clearly not top pairing numbers, and even questionable 2nd pairing to be honest. The best ability for an NHL team is availability, because without that you can't have reliability.

The previous 2 season prior he played in 53 games each. Injury and age and due to his style of play and now mounting concussions, even as 2nd pairing player he is no longer reliable,. He is closer to falling into a bottom pairing player then he is close to playing as a top pairing. Years on his style of play take a large toll on a player's body and his NHL longevity, and his career is slowly nearing its end soon.

At $5.65 mil he can not longer validate his cap hit contribution, and I think a lot of Leaf fans would be comfortable moving on from Jake, thank him for his warrior service, and use that cap space on a younger, better and healthier player.

Lol nice spin on the bolded portion!

20-21 there were 56GP so he played 95% of the games only missing 3 games
19-20 the Leafs played 70 Muzzen did worse for 75% and missed 14 games

Surprised no-one else called you on this.

 

[Havoc]

Surprised no-one else called you on this.

Why waste energy calling him out on that when what follows is true and more important.

Muzzin is now in gamble category as a go-to guy on the backend everything else is just noise whether accurate or inaccurate.