What Roster changes do you make if Marner doesn't waive?

[arso40]

I’m betting the core 5 are already working in a plan to get Berube fired if he is mean to them and hold them accountable


Management has also thought to run this same mess back for the last 8 years so I have little faith in them (Shanny the puppet master)

Who of the core 5 would be doing such a thing? Matthews or Marner?

 

[Racer88]

Who of the core 5 would be doing such a thing? Matthews or Marner?

All 5

 

[Confucius]

What changes can they make with no money? Beyond Walker or Roy in for Brodie maybe Stolarz or Brossoit in for Sammy. Thats kind of it. Can't afford to keep Bert or Boosh which won't kill them but they will need to replace them with something. Its bleak but with Sammy gone and Brodie out of the top 4 they can actually have a better year. But then 8 more years trying to build around zero value contracts. Run it back.

We have 12 ufa rfas that alone is 30 million, there is another 12 million in players that can be traded. True Mathews and William are getting a raise but the cap went up. There will be plenty of changes.

 

[arso40]

All 5

Negative

 

[ToneDog]

We have 12 ufa rfas that alone is 30 million, there is another 12 million in players that can be traded. True Mathews and William are getting a raise but the cap went up. There will be plenty of changes.

We are -2m after their increases and salaries should be rising due to the cap rising. It is going to cost you more to keep the same roster let alone get one as good unless we add Cowan and/or Minten or Tre finds a couple of Benoits.

 

[nuck]

We have 12 ufa rfas that alone is 30 million, there is another 12 million in players that can be traded. True Mathews and William are getting a raise but the cap went up. There will be plenty of changes.

Changes for the positive I meant. The RFAs all make nothing so anything they do with them won't have a measurable effect on roster building. Two more league minimum caliber players and Lily and Nick need small raises. Gio and Timmins or their replacements won't raise the play.

The cap bump wont quite cover Willie's deal so with Matthews that's about $3M less they have to spend. Say they keep Domi then Bert is gone. You could hope someone like Nicky or McMann could take those minutes but I don't think they bet the season on it so they will find a cheaper vet. One of Boosh or Edmundson would stay and Brodies replacement will cost his salary plus a bit more. And they will still need to add another vet for somewhere around $2M.

Brodie's replacement will move the needle as might Sammy's because the money in those two deals isn't chicken feed but the rest seems like rearranging deck chairs. I have seen nothing about Jarnkrok and Kampf being on the move except for a few optimistic haters on this board. I'm not sure if there is a return coming or a sweetener sent to ditch them but they are maybe the wild card because that's another $4.5M so potentially that allows two defensive adds that aren't scrubs.

Earlier in the year I felt they could bring Brodie back on the cheap to play lower in the lineup but he played top pairing minutes poorly so.... does that mean he is done or do you gamble that he will ramp it up with easier minutes?

I agree there will be plenty of changes but we probably won't be high fiving. They resigned Kampf last summer with a NT so the idea they would get rid of ALL the low performers isn't consistent.

 

[rumman]

We have 12 ufa rfas that alone is 30 million, there is another 12 million in players that can be traded. True Mathews and William are getting a raise but the cap went up. There will be plenty of changes.

Until they move pieces of the core, changing the supporting cast is irrelevant, that’s been proven every year this core has been here. Treating one’s dandruff doesn’t cure their athletes foot……..

 

[Tak7]

Marner chose to negotiate and sign before camp, Nylander chose to sit out to get his money, he wasn't forced to.

Dubas made a ton of mistakes with these RFA signings. Caving to Nylander was the first, not accepting Marners offer of 8.5x8 was second and then signing Matthews before Marner was 3rd.

Yep, agreed.

The contracts looked awful at the time, and have progressively looked worse as we've moved further beyond the time they were signed.

 

[Confucius]

Until they move pieces of the core, changing the supporting cast is irrelevant, that’s been proven every year this core has been here. Treating one’s dandruff doesn’t cure their athletes foot……..

Approximately 16 players can’t change anything? And here I thought it was a team game.

 

[Trapper]

Approximately 16 players can’t change anything? And here I thought it was a team game.

We don’t have to change 16. Start with 1. That’s easier.

 

[rumman]

Approximately 16 players can’t change anything? And here I thought it was a team game.

Has changing the players around the core came anywhere close to working? I rest my case………

 

[Confucius]

We don’t have to change 16. Start with 1. That’s easier.

Well whatever we get for Mitch, will have a tall order to fill. 2nd round minimum. Should be interesting.

 

[Trapper]

Well whatever we get for Mitch, will have a tall order to fill. 2nd round minimum. Should be interesting.

I would be looking for a long term 2C solution and prospect/1st in a Marner trade. We are going to have to replace Tavares sooner rather than later. You aren’t getting that big D for Marner but quality guy behind Matthews, best bet.

Then we can look at a Theodore (Vegas needs to shed) and Montour to rebuild that D. Plus a goalie. That should form a new core nucleus.

 

[Racer88]

We have 12 ufa rfas that alone is 30 million, there is another 12 million in players that can be traded. True Mathews and William are getting a raise but the cap went up. There will be plenty of changes.

30 million to replace 12 players isn’t a lot of money, so yes you are right they can do lots of changes but they will be of the bargain bin players like they have done the last 6 years and we all know how that has turned out. I respect your loyalty to them but unless we can change the makeup of the core things will never change. At 28ish theses guys are what they are and individually on other teams they may well make good contributions but collectively all on one team they are not going to get it done

Changes for the positive I meant. The RFAs all make nothing so anything they do with them won't have a measurable effect on roster building. Two more league minimum caliber players and Lily and Nick need small raises. Gio and Timmins or their replacements won't raise the play.

The cap bump wont quite cover Willie's deal so with Matthews that's about $3M less they have to spend. Say they keep Domi then Bert is gone. You could hope someone like Nicky or McMann could take those minutes but I don't think they bet the season on it so they will find a cheaper vet. One of Boosh or Edmundson would stay and Brodies replacement will cost his salary plus a bit more. And they will still need to add another vet for somewhere around $2M.

Brodie's replacement will move the needle as might Sammy's because the money in those two deals isn't chicken feed but the rest seems like rearranging deck chairs. I have seen nothing about Jarnkrok and Kampf being on the move except for a few optimistic haters on this board. I'm not sure if there is a return coming or a sweetener sent to ditch them but they are maybe the wild card because that's another $4.5M so potentially that allows two defensive adds that aren't scrubs.

Earlier in the year I felt they could bring Brodie back on the cheap to play lower in the lineup but he played top pairing minutes poorly so.... does that mean he is done or do you gamble that he will ramp it up with easier minutes?

I agree there will be plenty of changes but we probably won't be high fiving. They resigned Kampf last summer with a NT so the idea they would get rid of ALL the low performers isn't consistent.

Yup unless they can unload one of Marner or Tavares next year is going to be another throw away year

 

[Confucius]

Has changing the players around the core came anywhere close to working? I rest my case………

Just for giggles, suppose we don’t make the playoffs next year so that would be the 1st time in what 7 years? Does Treliving get shown the door?

 

[rumman]

Just for giggles, suppose we don’t make the playoffs next year so that would be the 1st time in what 7 years? Does Treliving get shown the door?

the goal imo shouldn’t be just making the playoffs, it should be going deep into the later rounds. Leaf management and a good portion of the fan base appear quite content with having a good regular season and going out in the first round, I believe this is a failure and expect more from them, but that’s just me. Tre’s in no danger imo of losing his job if they fail to qualify for the playoffs next season, Shanahan’s not so safe under that scenario……..

 

[Confucius]

the goal imo shouldn’t be just making the playoffs, it should be going deep into the later rounds. Leaf management and a good portion of the fan base appear quite content with having a good regular season and going out in the first round, I believe this is a failure and expect more from them, but that’s just me. Tre’s in no danger imo of losing his job if they fail to qualify for the playoffs next season, Shanahan’s not so safe under that scenario……..

So we should expect deep runs. Well I certainly will if we trade Marner, a lot of people claim he is the problem. I’m just saying if Tre. Trades him and then we don’t even qualify, what a joke that would be.

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

the goal imo shouldn’t be just making the playoffs, it should be going deep into the later rounds. Leaf management and a good portion of the fan base appear quite content with having a good regular season and going out in the first round, I believe this is a failure and expect more from them, but that’s just me. Tre’s in no danger imo of losing his job if they fail to qualify for the playoffs next season, Shanahan’s not so safe under that scenario……..

I am sure if you had a poll asking if fans would prefer either another first rd exit or a year or maybe 2 of not making the playoffs in order to reload...fans would most likely take the reload. Playing an extra 2 weeks at the end of the year is not all that exciting around here.

 

[Confucius]

I am sure if you had a poll asking if fans would prefer either another first rd exit or a year or maybe 2 of not making the playoffs in order to reload...fans would most likely take the reload. Playing an extra 2 weeks at the end of the year is not all that exciting around here.

Getting the backpeddling together already are we? lol!

 

[rumman]

I am sure if you had a poll asking if fans would prefer either another first rd exit or a year or maybe 2 of not making the playoffs in order to reload...fans would most likely take the reload. Playing an extra 2 weeks at the end of the year is not all that exciting around here.

I think plenty here ate happy with the status quo, but if it takes a step back to go forward I’m all for it…….

 

[Racer88]

So we should expect deep runs. Well I certainly will if we trade Marner, a lot of people claim he is the problem. I’m just saying if Tre. Trades him and then we don’t even qualify, what a joke that would be.

I think it would just show that it’s going to take a few years to undo all the damage Dubas has done

 

[JT AM da real deal]

I mean this in the nicest way Sir, but why do you make excuses for him like he's too small, too slow, etc? Can't he work on those things, to a point?

With utmost respect there is only so much any of us can do with innate strength .. it is given to you at birth .. sure he could try to change his stride to extend his hips and lengthen his extensions but ask any player how hard that is to do after age 10 .. i recommended this approach to Paul when Mitch was 6 as I knew it was an issue .. but Paul stuck with approach of Mitch's skating coach which focused on his edgework and guess what he made da show and got his money so they got what they wanted .. I do believe there are too many people on here blaming Mitch for almost everything .. to me you should blame Shanny/Dubie for not properly assessing Mitch's core skills which do not line up with his CAP .. but again NHL pays for points only largely .. think of yourself if you were Mitch .. every year in Toronto there are about 10-20 kids playing AAA out of 300 or so who have a shot at da show .. Mitch was one of 8 TO kids so far who made da show highlighted by McJesus .. he succeeded massively with what he has already made from hockey and good for him

 

[Trapper]

So we should expect deep runs. Well I certainly will if we trade Marner, a lot of people claim he is the problem. I’m just saying if Tre. Trades him and then we don’t even qualify, what a joke that would be.

Then I would seriously have to ask why are we even committing to Matthews/Nylander and hired Berube.
Colorado has been without Landeskog and MacKinnon still put up 140 and made the playoffs.
Tampa played almost an entire year with Kucherov.
Everyone can go then.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

With utmost respect there is only so much any of us can do with innate strength .. it is given to you at birth .. sure he could try to change his stride to extend his hips and lengthen his extensions but ask any player how hard that is to do after age 10 .. i recommended this approach to Paul when Mitch was 6 as I knew it was an issue .. but Paul stuck with approach of Mitch's skating coach which focused on his edgework and guess what he made da show and got his money so they got what they wanted .. I do believe there are too many people on here blaming Mitch for almost everything .. to me you should blame Shanny/Dubie for not properly assessing Mitch's core skills which do not line up with his CAP .. but again NHL pays for points only largely .. think of yourself if you were Mitch .. every year in Toronto there are about 10-20 kids playing AAA out of 300 or so who have a shot at da show .. Mitch was one of 8 TO kids so far who made da show highlighted by McJesus .. he succeeded massively with what he has already made from hockey and good for him

Fair enough. He can bring his skills to another team that will overpay for his regular season points that doesn't care how his skillset doesn't transfer to the playoffs. I want the Leafs to win a Cup and his cap hit combined with his lack of playoff skillset make that impossible.

 

[Nineteen67]

With utmost respect there is only so much any of us can do with innate strength .. it is given to you at birth .. sure he could try to change his stride to extend his hips and lengthen his extensions but ask any player how hard that is to do after age 10 .. i recommended this approach to Paul when Mitch was 6 as I knew it was an issue .. but Paul stuck with approach of Mitch's skating coach which focused on his edgework and guess what he made da show and got his money so they got what they wanted .. I do believe there are too many people on here blaming Mitch for almost everything .. to me you should blame Shanny/Dubie for not properly assessing Mitch's core skills which do not line up with his CAP .. but again NHL pays for points only largely .. think of yourself if you were Mitch .. every year in Toronto there are about 10-20 kids playing AAA out of 300 or so who have a shot at da show .. Mitch was one of 8 TO kids so far who made da show highlighted by McJesus .. he succeeded massively with what he has already made from hockey and good for him

He really should have been a figure skater. He could be a world champion.