What Roster changes do you make if Marner doesn't waive?

[Fogelhund]

Toronto generally under Shanahan has never spent big money in free agency, I think the most we have spent under Dubas/Shanhan was the Jarnkrok contract in terms of years and $ spent. Treliving generally gives out term and money in FA which is scary.

Would like to see what the team could do with a real d-core that can move the puck and defend well with a solid goaltending, I think Toronto is going to give out one big contract to either Zadorov (big mistake), Roy, Walker, Pesce, Montour Skeij.

We kind of spent big money on Tavares in Free Agency.

 

[Torontonian]

We kind of spent big money on Tavares in Free Agency.

Somehow forgot about Tavares lol. At the time it was a no brainer, I think giving out big $ and term to players that aren't elite like the JTS/Panarins/Petroangelos of the world is really risky.

 

[IPS]

It's still getting lost on people that one of the main selling points of trading Marner is to change the culture of the team.

Him wearing an A isn't good for any room. This guy's looked at a leadership figure yet sets his own standard in the playoffs that it's acceptable to avoid contact and puck battles. That sets a brutal example for the guy's coming up, what's it say to the rest of the guys when one of your designated leaders and highest paid players on the team plays that way? With the injuries to Matthews and Nylander he was the guy who we were leaning on to step up and he did the opposite, the character just ain't here with this player and it's time to cut bait, the return is secondary, changing the culture is 1st and foremost.

 

[ACC1224]

I am saying they won't happen because if they did, the management group would be beyond incompetent and with the spotlight on them so brightly and everyone knowing what needs to be done, doing nothing is not an option

Not all scenarios apply exclusively to 'the management'.

I get the close mindedness of it but expecting your opinion to be 100% universally agreed upon is a little immature.

 

[HockeyVirus]

Not all scenarios apply exclusively to 'the management'.

I get the close mindedness of it but expecting your opinion to be 100% universally agreed upon is a little immature.

Where did I say everyone needs to agree with me?

I said everyone knows what needs to be done and not doing it is a failure on management. In that scenario I become worried about the future of the Leafs with this group at the helm

 

[tmlms13]

Punt

It's only when we have the lowest expectations do the leafs succeed. 1993, 1998, 2013, 2017

Yes 2 were first round exits but we didn't think we'd be anywhere near the playoffs at the start of those years

 

[thewave]

We don't have a pick until the 5th round next year. Tanking for a top pick isn't going to help.

Who in their right mind would do that to this team? Oh nvm. Unreal. Honestly overlooked that.

 

[ACC1224]

Where did I say everyone needs to agree with me?

I said everyone knows what needs to be done and not doing it is a failure on management. In that scenario I become worried about the future of the Leafs with this group at the helm

Saying they are 'beyond incompetent' if they don't do what you like suggests they need to agree with you.

 

[arso40]

“Obviously you leave no stone unturned and listen to everything that comes across your desk”

That’s sound business acumen.

We’re supposedly moving him to reallocate cap space on the team. What’s the difference if he walked and you signed a player versus traded him for a player this summer? Especially if you like the player you can sign more than what you get backed into a corner by a making a deal where the player you’re moving has a NMC?

We don’t have a 1st this year. Why trade a player that can help you this year for cap space that may not help you this year. If something comes across your desk that makes sense, short term, medium term and long term, sure. Do it.

We don't need him that's why you make the trade does it make our forward group different and possibly weaker? Sure , but we're trading from a strength to sure up a weakness while managing an asset we can't afford to keep its the right call

 

[HockeyVirus]

Saying they are 'beyond incompetent' if they don't do what you like suggests they need to agree with you.

I am saying if after the last round of negotiations with Marner went, they are utterly incompetent if they enter camp either without Marner traded or extended. Giving Marner that much leverage in season is a fireable offense.

You don't need to agree with me, but you are wrong if you don't

 

[Tak7]

I am saying if after the last round of negotiations with Marner went, they are utterly incompetent if they enter camp either without Marner traded or extended. Giving Marner that much leverage in season is a fireable offense.

You don't need to agree with me, but you are wrong if you don't

****Last 2 negotiations - his ELC was contentious too, surrounding his entry level bonuses (can't recall whether it was level A or B at this point), but seems like that really set the path for how ugly the 2nd negotiations were

 

[HockeyVirus]

****Last 2 negotiations - his ELC was contentious too, surrounding his entry level bonuses (can't recall whether it was level A or B at this point), but seems like that really set the path for how ugly the 2nd negotiations were

Exactly. Nylander never negotiated in bad faith, he turned out to be right he was being low balled. Marner was offered an overpayment up front and still chose to drag the team through the media for the entire summer in order to get 6 years instead of 8.

You would need to be completely incompetent at your job to give a guy like Marner that much leverage. It can't happen. Either extend him and make change elsewhere or trade him.

That Marner deal would be a major distraction. Nylander was professional about it. Marner's camp already showed they are not professional. The day Matthews extended his agent was crying in the papers about his worth. Just a completely avoidable disaster.

 

[Tak7]

Exactly. Nylander never negotiated in bad faith, he turned out to be right he was being low balled. Marner was offered an overpayment up front and still chose to drag the team through the media for the entire summer in order to get 6 years instead of 8.

You would need to be completely incompetent at your job to give a guy like Marner that much leverage. It can't happen. Either extend him and make change elsewhere or trade him.

That Marner deal would be a major distraction. Nylander was professional about it. Marner's camp already showed they are not professional. The day Matthews extended his agent was crying in the papers about his worth. Just a completely avoidable disaster.

How different does this entire situation play out if Marner is made to sit out the way Nylander did?

As an RFA, the Leafs had all the leverage, and if the offer sheet threat was actually "real", he would have signed one in the summer when Dreger was twerking for him and Columbus.

 

[francis246]

I really think Morgan Rielly is gonna end up being the guy traded. I think they are going to try and rebuild the defense

 

[ACC1224]

I really think Morgan Rielly is gonna end up being the guy traded. I think they are going to try and rebuild the defense

With a baby on the way I would think it's highly unlikely he waives.

 

[ACC1224]

How different does this entire situation play out if Marner is made to sit out the way Nylander did?

As an RFA, the Leafs had all the leverage, and if the offer sheet threat was actually "real", he would have signed one in the summer when Dreger was twerking for him and Columbus.

Marner chose to negotiate and sign before camp, Nylander chose to sit out to get his money, he wasn't forced to.

Dubas made a ton of mistakes with these RFA signings. Caving to Nylander was the first, not accepting Marners offer of 8.5x8 was second and then signing Matthews before Marner was 3rd.

 

[Fogelhund]

With a baby on the way I would think it's highly unlikely he waives.

Maybe he'd waive for Detroit.... I'm not sure much else. I think Tess's family is in Windsor.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

Now let's see.... what could be a better example of acting like a "petulant child" than someone putting the "haha" emoji under posts about Marner they don't agree with....

 

[ACC1224]

Maybe he'd waive for Detroit.... I'm not sure much else. I think Tess's family is in Windsor.

Yeah possibly.

 

[ULF_55]

marner will decide if he wants to be traded.

Leafs and he agreed to a contract and are bound by that contract.

Most important contract this year is Berube's.

Holding our breath until marner accepts a trade will just reduce the number of Leafs fans.

EDIT:

And this is about the line-up with marner in it.

 

[ACC1224]

marner will decide if he wants to be traded.

Leafs and he agreed to a contract and are bound by that contract.

Most important contract this year is Berube's.

Holding our breath until marner accepts a trade will just reduce the number of Leafs fans.

If only a bunch would take that option.

If there was ever a herd that could use thinning out it's Leaf Nation.

 

[francis246]

With a baby on the way I would think it's highly unlikely he waives.

you never know! Maybe he'd accept a trade to Vancouver or somewhere out west or to Detroit to be closer to Windsor. But I feel like Morgan has been here the longest, he might be the most open to change.

 

[ACC1224]

you never know! Maybe he'd accept a trade to Vancouver or somewhere out west or to Detroit to be closer to Windsor. But I feel like Morgan has been here the longest, he might be the most open to change.

I guess we'll know by September. I'd never complain about a long summer but I think we're going to be in for one this year.

 

[ULF_55]

I'm really curious about the line-up with marner, but as I've said all along.

? - Matthews - marner
? - ? - Nylander
McMann - Tavares - ?

Knies, Holmberg, Jarnkrok, Kampf, Robertson, Reaves, Dewar, Gregor
Minten, Cowan, Marlies

Just for discussion ... 2 guys are gone. For argument sake ... Kampf and Robertson

NewGuy1 - Matthews - marner
Knies - NewGuy2 - Nylander
McMann - Tavares - Jarnkrok
Dewar/Gregor/Holmberg/Reaves/Minten/Marlies

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Stop this "Marner is a victim" BS. He ain't.

I don't see him as a victim but rather quite lucky to steal so much money from Shanny/Dubie .. he just lacks da necessary skills to compete in playoff hockey