What Roster changes do you make if Marner doesn't waive?

[hotpaws]

You wait until free agent frenzy is over, just like they did to get Domi and Bert………

I had no issues with Domi/Bert this year but we'll need better to win a cup and we're not going to find them waiting for potential bargains after the top ufa's have been picked through .

I'm just as frustrated as anyone with the lack of playoff success and i wish i had an easy solution for our problems especially a magic wand that could turn back the clock 6yrs so we could have avoided hiring Dumbass who created this mess but the truth is the team now has to play the cards that were dealt and make the best out of the situation without making it worse with short sighted moves just to appease the angry mob .

 

[Vivaldi]

Not a Leafs fan but I think you should take advantage of Chicago having the cap space they do and have them buy out Tavares after his bonus. If you come to him I doubt he'd rather play for 900k for a team that doesn't want him than get his pick of contenders who'd line up to pay him 4-6 mil and his 10 mil buyout cap hit doesn't impact Chicago at all, just saves them money if they decide to be under the cap. Something like Tavares, Liljegren, 2nd for Jones, letting Chicago get out from Jones' contract while getting back a pretty high end defenseman who has been buried on a tanking team and could thrive surrounded with talent in a good system. Then get one of DeMelo/Roy/Tanev/Pesce/Carrier to slot with Rielly and have a balanced top 4 of Rielly-Roy (for example)/McCabe-Jones. Leafs remind me a lot of the Caps when we kept trying to compete with Mike Green + pile of random dudes on defense and as a result it didn't matter how good Ovechkin or Backstrom were.

 

[rumman]

I had no issues with Domi/Bert this year but we'll need better to win a cup and we're not going to find them waiting for potential bargains after the top ufa's have been picked through .

I'm just as frustrated as anyone with the lack of playoff success and i wish i had an easy solution for our problems especially a magic wand that could turn back the clock 6yrs so we could have avoided hiring Dumbass who created this mess but the truth is the team now has to play the cards that were dealt and make the best out of the situation without making it worse with short sighted moves just to appease the angry mob .

You don’t have to wait, you make your fair offers to the respective agents and wait, let them seek better deals elsewhere, if they truly want to play here they’ll sign here…….

 

[ToneDog]

I had no issues with Domi/Bert this year but we'll need better to win a cup and we're not going to find them waiting for potential bargains after the top ufa's have been picked through .

I'm just as frustrated as anyone with the lack of playoff success and i wish i had an easy solution for our problems especially a magic wand that could turn back the clock 6yrs so we could have avoided hiring Dumbass who created this mess but the truth is the team now has to play the cards that were dealt and make the best out of the situation without making it worse with short sighted moves just to appease the angry mob .

Hopefully Tre is smarter than the previous GM and realizes this team is not close to winning the cup and has a plan to build one. Look at where the Rangers are since they wrote that memo to their fans.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

I had no issues with Domi/Bert this year but we'll need better to win a cup and we're not going to find them waiting for potential bargains after the top ufa's have been picked through .

I'm just as frustrated as anyone with the lack of playoff success and i wish i had an easy solution for our problems especially a magic wand that could turn back the clock 6yrs so we could have avoided hiring Dumbass who created this mess but the truth is the team now has to play the cards that were dealt and make the best out of the situation without making it worse with short sighted moves just to appease the angry mob .

Why do you categorize people who want Marner traded as "the angry mob"? It's pure 100% logic to want his playoff underperformance relative to his crazy cap hit gone.

 

[ToneDog]

Not a Leafs fan but I think you should take advantage of Chicago having the cap space they do and have them buy out Tavares after his bonus. If you come to him I doubt he'd rather play for 900k for a team that doesn't want him than get his pick of contenders who'd line up to pay him 4-6 mil and his 10 mil buyout cap hit doesn't impact Chicago at all, just saves them money if they decide to be under the cap. Something like Tavares, Liljegren, 1st for Jones, letting Chicago get out from Jones' contract while getting back a pretty high end defenseman who has been buried on a tanking team and could thrive surrounded with talent in a good system. Then get one of DeMelo/Roy/Tanev/Pesce/Carrier to slot with Rielly and have a balanced top 4 of Rielly-Roy (for example)/McCabe-Jones. Leafs remind me a lot of the Caps when we kept trying to compete with Mike Green + pile of random dudes on defense and as a result it didn't matter how good Ovechkin or Backstrom were.

Buying out Tavares won't save you much cap space and trading the last year of Tavares' contract for 6 more years of Seth Jones' contract is a fireable offence.

 

[hotpaws]

Why do you categorize people who want Marner traded as "the angry mob"? It's pure 100% logic to want his playoff underperformance relative to his crazy cap hit gone.

never mentioned Marner and i have to believe Leaf fans are angry over another early exist even if they want to re-sign him

my point was many fans want change and i do as well if it makes sense and the team better , change for the sake of change probably won't end well

 

[57 Years No Cup]

never mentioned Marner and i have to believe Leaf fans are angry over another early exist even if they want to re-sign him

my point was many fans want change and i do as well if it makes sense and the team better , change for the sake of change probably won't end well

Well HP the status quo sure hasn't worked...

 

[hotpaws]

You don’t have to wait, you make your fair offers to the respective agents and wait, let them seek better deals elsewhere, if they truly want to play here they’ll sign here…….

sure they could try that but the chances the top ufa's will come here for millions less are ?

 

[rumman]

sure they could try that but the chances the top ufa's will come here for millions less are ?

If your going to buy a car and yhe price is unrealistic do uou still buy that car or look elsewhete? I know what I’d do………

 

[hotpaws]

Well HP the status quo sure hasn't worked...

who's advocating for the status quo ?

i want

- Tavares traded
- Mitch either traded for a fair return or re-signed
- revamped D core
- better depth with an eye towards tougher/grittier players who can also chip in offensively

do i expect the team can acquire all these pieces in one of season with no picks and limited assets to deal ? nope but i do believe they can get a few

 

[57 Years No Cup]

who's advocating for the status quo ?

i want

- Tavares traded
- Mitch either traded for a fair return or re-signed
- revamped D core
- better depth with an eye towards tougher/grittier players who can also chip in offensively

do i expect the team can acquire all these pieces in one of season with no picks and limited assets to deal ? nope but i do believe they can get a few

We all want this team to win my friend. Once again, the only thing we disagree on is getting Marner re-signed. IMO his attitude, demeanor, and especially his non aggressive playing style (especially in the playoffs) is the biggest detriment to this team. Do I wanna give him up for nothing? No, only as a last resort, but still we would have the cap space he commands at minimum to explore the other options you've suggested.

 

[IPS]

Why do you categorize people who want Marner traded as "the angry mob"? It's pure 100% logic to want his playoff underperformance relative to his crazy cap hit gone.

I always say it - where was all this defense for Marner while the series was going on? His staunch supporters went completely MIA during the series. Only a couple weeks later they show up again when the games are out of people's short term memory.

Who honestly gives a shit about what he does in the regular season anymore?

 

[PROUD PAPA]

who's advocating for the status quo ?

i want

- Tavares traded
- Mitch either traded for a fair return or re-signed
- revamped D core
- better depth with an eye towards tougher/grittier players who can also chip in offensively

do i expect the team can acquire all these pieces in one of season with no picks and limited assets to deal ? nope but i do believe they can get a few

What in your opinion would represent a fair return?

 

[hotpaws]

What in your opinion would represent a fair return?

a D with upside like Power from Buff , or a pkg of futures like Wright/Seattle's 1st/quality D prospect from the Kraken , these are just off the top of my head so i don't need to get into an argument about exact value , i'm just giving you an rough idea of what i'd want back

Mitch is still fairly young , he's a 90 plus point play driving winger who's good defensively , i'm not giving him away without getting value back regardless if the alternative is we overpay to keep him .

 

[ToneDog]

a D with upside like Power from Buff , or a pkg of futures like Wright/Seattle's 1st/quality D prospect from the Kraken , these are just off the top of my head so i don't need to get into an argument about exact value , i'm just giving you an rough idea of what i'd want back

Mitch is still fairly young , he's a 90 plus point play driving winger who's good defensively , i'm not giving him away without getting value back regardless if the alternative is we overpay to keep him .

Mitch is a one dimensional player who's game does not translate into the payoffs. We cannot afford to overpay him at this point after making the same mistake with Nylander. Yeah Tavares coming off the books will help but the 3 amigos at $36m makes me want to vomit.

I'll take 80 cents on the dollar and not have to see him ragging the puck around the perimeter looking to pass. It will never work for this guy in the playoffs.

 

[hotpaws]

Mitch is a one dimensional player who's game does not translate into the payoffs. We cannot afford to overpay him at this point after making the same mistake with Nylander. Yeah Tavares coming off the books will help but the 3 amigos at $36m makes me want to vomit.

I'll take 80 cents on the dollar and not have to see him ragging the puck around the perimeter looking to pass. It will never work for this guy in the playoffs.

he'd translate just fine with the right players around him just like other finesse players have and i could also shit on Mathews for not being a playoff performer , does that mean you've given up on him as well ?

 

[ToneDog]

he'd translate just fine with the right players around him just like other finesse players have and i could also shit on Mathews for not being a playoff performer , does that mean you've given up on him as well ?

Matthews is a goal scorer, bigger body, and can fight through checks but I have also said I would move all 3 because they are me first players. Matty and Nylander are also signed long term. Marner is a pending UFA that I have seen enough to know that I am not willing to pay him anything near his ask.

 

[hotpaws]

Matthews is a goal scorer, bigger body, and can fight through checks but I have also said I would move all 3 because they are me first players. Matty and Nylander are also signed long term. Marner is a pending UFA that I have seen enough to know that I am not willing to pay him anything near his ask.

there's quite a few teams with cap space so while you may not want to pay his ask we won't be getting better value chasing ufa's to replace him

 

[ULF_55]

It's gonna be:

? - Matthews - marner (re-signed)
? - ? / Tavares (re-signed) - Nylander
? - Tavares / ? - ?
? - Kampf - ?

IMO in order of likelyhood

1. Knies
2. Jarnkrok
3. McMann
4. Holmberg
5. NewSigning
6. NewSigning
7. Roberts
8. Kampf
9. Reaves

Grebyonkin / Minten / Cowan

marner gets a raise
Tavares gets a Malkin deal.

? <=== these have to be the difference makers
They don't have to be scoring guys, they have to be glue guys.

Stars are in place, the glue isn't.
Coaching has to address the PP.
Players have to address the PK.

They need some ELSC players to make an impact, and not an impact as in getting votes for ROTY or all-star appearances, but impact as in no walkovers. Impact as in a timely goal here or there. Impact as in no freebies as in 2 on nothing breaks when the bench is a mess.

 

[Evilhomer]

he'd translate just fine with the right players around him just like other finesse players have and i could also shit on Mathews for not being a playoff performer , does that mean you've given up on him as well ?

I don't see it as being much different than Panarin in New York. His playoff numbers have never been spectacular, but I don't think anyone would say that a team can't win with Panarin on it.

 

[thewave]

I always say it - where was all this defense for Marner while the series was going on? His staunch supporters went completely MIA during the series. Only a couple weeks later they show up again when the games are out of people's short term memory.

Who honestly gives a shit about what he does in the regular season anymore?

Exactly.

Nobody can say WN didn't try. Matthews won us a game and got injured. Mitch was taking shots from a mile out to pad his corsi and ditching the puck every 3 seconds while never fighting for a puck.

Nobody can unsee that. The crying or the glove toss as well.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Bottom line no matter who you fancy between 4 of them TEAM can only afford 2 of them and that's it .. Matty is clearly da best player by far of da 4 and one of top 5 guys in nhl and our #1 pick so bottom line he is staying .. JT is clearly da 4th wheel and not keeping up to playoff pace with massive CAP hit so everyone can agree he is gone but bottom line he ain't going anywhere else so we are stuck with him for 1 more year .. so whether team moves Willy or Mitch 2024/25 season is a total write-off for playoffs .. it is only in 2025/26 season where we can get down to 2 forwards with 10+M CAP hit .. Mitch has 1 year left so he is easiest guy to move on from now as no other team in playoffs is gonna want him .. only teams looking to make playoff gates will be interested .. and get an asset or two back to help in a retool

 

[thewave]

Bottom line no matter who you fancy between 4 of them TEAM can only afford 2 of them and that's it .. Matty is clearly da best player by far of da 4 and one of top 5 guys in nhl and our #1 pick so bottom line he is staying .. JT is clearly da 4th wheel and not keeping up to playoff pace with massive CAP hit so everyone can agree he is gone but bottom line he ain't going anywhere else so we are stuck with him for 1 more year .. so whether team moves Willy or Mitch 2024/25 season is a total write-off for playoffs .. it is only in 2025/26 season where we can get down to 2 forwards with 10+M CAP hit .. Mitch has 1 year left so he is easiest guy to move on from now as no other team in playoffs is gonna want him .. only teams looking to make playoff gates will be interested .. and get an asset or two back to help in a retool

MM is an entitled, spoiled whiney baby of a player who is slow and getting slower. Its WN and Matthews. I looked at MM in camp and posted here looked out of shape. He lost a step this year and sucked to start the season again. He got married and played a bunch of Fortnite. He wasn't fit to start the season and is getting slower.

We need to drop that immature non playoff performer like a bad habit.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

MM is an entitled, spoiled whiney baby of a player who is slow and getting slower. Its WN and Matthews. I looked at MM in camp and posted here looked out of shape. He lost a step this year and sucked to start the season again. He got married and played a bunch of Fortnite. He wasn't fit to start the season and is getting slower.

We need to drop that immature non playoff performer like a bad habit.

He is a good kid who is always happy and truly wants to help his teams .. he plays Fortnight with my kid still .. but that is not a crime that these kids love da game .. there are many many kids in show who play da game like crazy too .. you and I may not like it .. I certainly didn't when my kids lived at home as they play very very late into night .. he was never a fast A to B skater ever .. but he is top 3 in world in edgework which means he skate in a phone booth in either end of ice .. where he has always had problems is when game gets played as an UP DOWN fast paced back and forth game through neutral zone .. these games typically occur in playoff hockey and he really can't contribute as much in those types of games except on D and even then he can't play net front due to his lack of strength