What Roster changes do you make if Marner doesn't waive?

[57 Years No Cup]

He is a good kid who is always happy and truly wants to help his teams .. he plays Fortnight with my kid still .. but that is not a crime that these kids love da game .. there are many many kids in show who play da game like crazy too .. you and I may not like it .. I certainly didn't when my kids lived at home as they play very very late into night .. he was never a fast A to B skater ever .. but he is top 3 in world in edgework which means he skate in a phone booth in either end of ice .. where he has always had problems is when game gets played as an UP DOWN fast paced back and forth game through neutral zone .. these games typically occur in playoff hockey and he really can't contribute as much in those types of games except on D and even then he can't play net front due to his lack of strength

Stop this "Marner is a victim" BS. He ain't.

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

Hopefully Tre is smarter than the previous GM and realizes this team is not close to winning the cup and has a plan to build one. Look at where the Rangers are since they wrote that memo to their fans.

I think he may have realized it during the course of the year. He didn't really spend much at the deadline because he probably thought it would be a waste of picks if they went big game hunting. BTW...which of the big gamers that got sold this year turned out to be great additions? They hardly ever do and that was Dubas undoing. You can't have players play for 20 games and meld together into a great team. The Butch Goring's of the world are very rare....it usually ends up like Edmonton getting Henrique....badly.

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

I don't see it as being much different than Panarin in New York. His playoff numbers have never been spectacular, but I don't think anyone would say that a team can't win with Panarin on it.

I would agree. But in saying that I would also point out that the Rangers core isn't a bunch of Panarin's...so they can handle having 1 or 2...not 3 or 4 of them like we do.

 

[Trapper]

I would agree. But in saying that I would also point out that the Rangers core isn't a bunch of Panarin's...so they can handle having 1 or 2...not 3 or 4 of them like we do.

This is key right here.
Put Matthews on Vegas with Stone, Pietro, Theodore, etc. different story.
Put him here with Nylander,JT and Marner, well we know the story.
Eichel, Reinhart, Montour couldn’t make the playoffs in Buffalo. Now Eichel has a Cup, Reinhart and Montour in the Conference finals.
It’s the sum of the parts. This collection is not good together in the post season. If you want success, you have to change.

 

[ToneDog]

I think he may have realized it during the course of the year. He didn't really spend much at the deadline because he probably thought it would be a waste of picks if they went big game hunting. BTW...which of the big gamers that got sold this year turned out to be great additions? They hardly ever do and that was Dubas undoing. You can't have players play for 20 games and meld together into a great team. The Butch Goring's of the world are very rare....it usually ends up like Edmonton getting Henrique....badly.

Guentzel was good. Wennberg scored the OT winner in game #3. Walker was good for Colorado.

You also can't give up assets on a yearly basis and watch them walk for nothing. In a few years you will find yourself where the Leafs are today, with little in the prospect pool.

Meanwhile Dallas has Wyatt Johnson and Stankoven playing in their top 6 with Jamie Benn. Dallas drafts well and is still playing. Leafs had 3 picks this summer and are golfing and enjoying their cottages.

 

[seanlinden]

I would agree. But in saying that I would also point out that the Rangers core isn't a bunch of Panarin's...so they can handle having 1 or 2...not 3 or 4 of them like we do.

Quoted for truth.

The problem for the Leafs isn't one individual, it's that they had 3, and now have 4 guys who are all paid $11m or more.

4 of the top 12 contracts in the league play for the Leafs. Filter that to forwards, it's 4 of the top 9. We have almost as many $10.9m or more forwards as the rest of the league combined!

 

[Evilhomer]

Guentzel was good. Wennberg scored the OT winner in game #3. Walker was good for Colorado.

You also can't give up assets on a yearly basis and watch them walk for nothing. In a few years you will find yourself where the Leafs are today, with little in the prospect pool.

Meanwhile Dallas has Wyatt Johnson and Stankoven playing in their top 6 with Jamie Benn. Dallas drafts well and is still playing. Leafs had 3 picks this summer and are golfing and enjoying their cottages.

It turns out that Dallas made the best deadline acquisition of any team: Tanev. He may only score one point in the entire playoffs and he will still be the most valuable addition any team made.

 

[United35]

I would target mid tier free agents.

Wouldn’t do big term or dollars.

There are lots of decent depth players available. By no means do I think we’re signing players and instant cup contenders. I think we tread water this year and 21.90 becomes available next summer.

Obviously you leave no stone unturned and listen to everything that comes across your desk but selling good assets for Pennie’s on the dollar is ludicrous imo and then we’re trying to figure out how to get them.

 

[arso40]

I would target mid tier free agents.

Wouldn’t do big term or dollars.

There are lots of decent depth players available. By no means do I think we’re signing players and instant cup contenders. I think we tread water this year and 21.90 becomes available next summer.

Obviously you leave no stone unturned and listen to everything that comes across your desk but selling good assets for Pennie’s on the dollar is ludicrous imo and then we’re trying to figure out how to get them.

So get nothing for 16 but cap space? Bad asset management I rather penny's on the dollar then nothing he can fill a need in a trade for someone who can be apart of the now and the future and we can recoup some draft capital walking him to free agency we can't do we won't get much for the captain but mitch has value

 

[thewave]

So get nothing for 16 but cap space? Bad asset management I rather penny's on the dollar then nothing he can fill a need in a trade for someone who can be apart of the now and the future and we can recoup some draft capital walking him to free agency we can't do we won't get much for the captain but mitch has value

You cant win in a cap league by losing players for nothing. The team that builds the best asset pool and keeps the cap balanced, has the best shot.

 

[Fogelhund]

Assuming we keep Marner for a second, which is what this thread is about.... Resigning most of our RFA's and Domi ($3.5) and Jones as a 3rd stringer... I see about $10 mil in cap space, without trading someone like Kampf, or Jarnkrok. We would absolutely NEED two RD, and a goalie.... that could be tough.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

Q: What Roster changes do you make if Marner doesn't waive?​

A: Not enough to accomplish anything.

 

[thewave]

Assuming we keep Marner for a second, which is what this thread is about.... Resigning most of our RFA's and Domi ($3.5) and Jones as a 3rd stringer... I see about $10 mil in cap space, without trading someone like Kampf, or Jarnkrok. We would absolutely NEED two RD, and a goalie.... that could be tough.

May as well tank the season if we keep him. Seriously mean that. Put the worst tender in and coach to tank for a top pick.

 

[LeafGrief]

Captain: Matthews
Alternates: Rielly, Nylander, McCabe

Changes to the actual roster? Uh, don't think it really matters tbh. On D I'm happy with Rielly, McCabe, and Benoit. Lyubushkin is welcome back if it's a 1-2m deal for 1 or 2 years. Liljegren gets 1m'ish as a 7D or gets traded.

Up front I sign Domi to 4m or less for 4y. Bertuzzi can go if he wants more then 4.5m or 5y. I like most of our depth forwards, I see no reason to move on from Kampf or Jarnkrok at their price tags, but don't really care either. Dewar is worth keeping, Robertson isn't, as a 13th forward who can inject offense to the lineup I think he's useful.

Goalie is far and away our biggest need, Woll is an intriguing young player but just cannot stay healthy. I'd go big game hunting here, but without the cap space from Marner I don't know what we can do.

For the most part, I think next year is a retool year regardless of whether Marner is back or not. We're waiting out the final year of JT and that cap space will really help us inject some life into our depth and 2nd tier of talent. And for the love of all that is hockey, we need to spend a big chunk of money on a real goalie, no more shoestrings and hope in net.

 

[United35]

So get nothing for 16 but cap space? Bad asset management I rather penny's on the dollar then nothing he can fill a need in a trade for someone who can be apart of the now and the future and we can recoup some draft capital walking him to free agency we can't do we won't get much for the captain but mitch has value

“Obviously you leave no stone unturned and listen to everything that comes across your desk”

That’s sound business acumen.

We’re supposedly moving him to reallocate cap space on the team. What’s the difference if he walked and you signed a player versus traded him for a player this summer? Especially if you like the player you can sign more than what you get backed into a corner by a making a deal where the player you’re moving has a NMC?

We don’t have a 1st this year. Why trade a player that can help you this year for cap space that may not help you this year. If something comes across your desk that makes sense, short term, medium term and long term, sure. Do it.

 

[Fogelhund]

May as well tank the season if we keep him. Seriously mean that. Put the worst tender in and coach to tank for a top pick.

We don't have a pick until the 5th round next year. Tanking for a top pick isn't going to help.

** our first round pick is top ten protected, which isn't going to happen soo...

 

[HockeyVirus]

IDK we need changes. How are we going to add a starting goalie and 2 top 4 dmen, and two top 6 players with 18M in cap space and no draft picks?

I don't see a scenario where Marner isn't dealt unless teams are like nah we don't want him

 

[ACC1224]

IDK we need changes. How are we going to add a starting goalie and 2 top 4 dmen, and two top 6 players with 18M in cap space and no draft picks?

I don't see a scenario where Marner isn't dealt unless teams are like nah we don't want him

If you can't see a scenario you aren't looking.

 

[HockeyVirus]

If you can't see a scenario you aren't looking.

50% of the cap in 4 guys with so many holes to fill after management acknowledged the group needs changes. It's not happening.

I will accept next year is not a contention year but a retool year as we wait for JT salary to fall off the books, but we know for certain he will re-sign here and for a lot cheaper so not an issue. They will not let Marner hold all the cards like they did with Nylander after Mitch's history negotiating with us.

If Marner starts training camp without an extension in place, fire literally everyone

 

[ACC1224]

50% of the cap in 4 guys with so many holes to fill after management acknowledged the group needs changes. It's not happening.

I will accept next year is not a contention year but a retool year as we wait for JT salary to fall off the books, but we know for certain he will re-sign here and for a lot cheaper so not an issue. They will not let Marner hold all the cards like they did with Nylander after Mitch's history negotiating with us.

If Marner starts training camp without an extension in place, fire literally everyone

The point was there are many scenarios, you just don't like them.

 

[HockeyVirus]

The point was there are many scenarios, you just don't like them.

I am saying they won't happen because if they did, the management group would be beyond incompetent and with the spotlight on them so brightly and everyone knowing what needs to be done, doing nothing is not an option

 

[ToneDog]

We don't have a pick until the 5th round next year. Tanking for a top pick isn't going to help.

Isn't the first top 10 protected?

 

[Fogelhund]

Isn't the first top 10 protected?

Yes... but we aren't tanking on purpose to get a top ten pick... that's just unrealistic.... The coach won't want that, the players won't... barring some spectacular injuries, which you don't hope for, I don't think this team can be that bad, and would never be on purpose.

 

[ToneDog]

Yes... but we aren't tanking on purpose to get a top ten pick... that's just unrealistic.... The coach won't want that, the players won't... barring some spectacular injuries, which you don't hope for, I don't think this team can be that bad, and would never be on purpose.

100% they are not tanking but that is what poster proposed. I thought the same as you and looked up our first. Since it is protected we could tank in theory but not in the real world.

 

[Torontonian]

I would target mid tier free agents.

Wouldn’t do big term or dollars.

There are lots of decent depth players available. By no means do I think we’re signing players and instant cup contenders. I think we tread water this year and 21.90 becomes available next summer.

Obviously you leave no stone unturned and listen to everything that comes across your desk but selling good assets for Pennie’s on the dollar is ludicrous imo and then we’re trying to figure out how to get them.

Toronto generally under Shanahan has never spent big money in free agency, I think the most we have spent under Dubas/Shanhan was the Jarnkrok contract in terms of years and $ spent. Treliving generally gives out term and money in FA which is scary.

Would like to see what the team could do with a real d-core that can move the puck and defend well with a solid goaltending, I think Toronto is going to give out one big contract to either Zadorov (big mistake), Roy, Walker, Pesce, Montour Skeij.