Speculation: Vancouver Canucks are asking for Kadri + Bozak or Kadri + Gardiner for Luongo

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just my opinion with no factual evidence but....

i believe boston will be in trouble relying on Tuukka Rask as their goto guy.. i dont think he is number one material.. i recall a few games where he stunk it up while thomas was injured/unable to play

also i believe vancouver may run into the same problem with schneider after they trade luongo

also if the leafs were able to add luongo it would do wonders in developing Riemer

not easy being a young goalie with the added pressure of carrying the team on your back

I recall a few games where Lundqvist stunk it up too, of course there isn't much point in relying on a small sample size to draw conclusions. Do you think there's any case where a young goalie can step out and succeed? It seems like you're positing that it's impossible given your desire to bet against two of the best young goalies in the league.

In the only "semi-full" season he played during Thomas' injuries he put up a 0.931 and went 22-12-5.

But, they're your beliefs, just trying to show the other side.
 
Show me a list of "goalies given up on too early by teams". (I would rather not see Reimer's name on that one in a year or two).

Also show me a list of "goalies that were highly rated but flopped after getting traded".

Lots of lists out there but wouldn't use them for deciding trades.
 
remember how 'elite' a bluechip dman dion was after his rookie season?
...you mean when he was scoring more in his second and third seasons than in his first, and about as much in his fourth and seventh (most recent) seasons, while at the same time developing into a better defensive player?
 
Kadri is somebody i'm 100% fine with trading since he's been converted to a winger there is no spot for him. We have Kessel Lupul JVR macarthur Kuliemin Frattin all ahead of him. If he gets traded to vancouver then he has Sedin, Burrows, Booth, Raymond Higgins, ahead of him. There is simply no chance of a breakout from him because there is no ice time.
 
I recall a few games where Lundqvist stunk it up too, of course there isn't much point in relying on a small sample size to draw conclusions. Do you think there's any case where a young goalie can step out and succeed? It seems like you're positing that it's impossible given your desire to bet against two of the best young goalies in the league.

In the only "semi-full" season he played during Thomas' injuries he put up a 0.931 and went 22-12-5.

But, they're your beliefs, just trying to show the other side.

yeah i hear ya, im just saying that its very possible both goalies will not be able to perform like they did in the past not having someone to step in and help out..i use riemer as an example.. when he went through some rough patches last year it would have been great for him to have someone like luongo or thomas to step in and win a few games to take the pressure off him.. instead gusto would come in and the leaf nation ship would just keep sinking adding to the already immense pressure on the kid, eventually that shipped crashed :( vancouver and boston are both tough markets like toronto
 
Jimmy Murphy ‏@MurphysLaw74:

Interesting Flyers in Luongo rumors now. Reliable source told me prior to Burke firing they would be 3rd team in a 3-way trade for Lou to TO
 
I've long been of the opinion that, barring a significant change caused by the new CBA (in this regard it helped a bit, but not a lot), Luongo's contract makes him worth very little in trade (like Komi and Lombardi plus a 3rd kind of value, which was never popular, but that was my opinion). One of my main points was that if he were a UFA today he wouldn't receive anything close to what his deal currently is. Well, I decided to look at the top 10 salaries for goalies (plus Luongo) including their age when the contract starts (but not the year when it was signed, so Fleury looks much better than Quick 'cause it happened ages ago), the total expected salaries for playing years (if they have backdiving stuff at the end I took the salary out of the total and included a cap years column so you'll know it's there), the average salary per playing year, and the number of years.

Code:
Name-----	Age	Total	Avg.	Yrs	CapYrs
Rinne----	29	49.00	7.00	7	
Quick----	27	49.00	7.00	7	3
Lundqvist	26	41.25	6.88	6	
Bryzgalov	31	47.50	6.79	7	2
Luongo	33	40.28	6.71	6	3
Kiprusoff	32	33.50	6.70	5	1
Price----	25	39.00	6.50	6	
Ward-----	27	37.80	6.30	6	
Miller---	30	31.25	6.25	5	
Fleury	24	35.00	5.00	7

The Luongo deal shown is not his entire deal, just what the Leafs (or anyone else) would be taking on. All contracts assume the world plays out exactly as intended where they play the full salary years and retire away the cap years (Quick is a bit odd in this case, but since he's got three super cheap years I don't see him expecting to play for that even if he's only in his mid-30's). This is unlikely to be the case, but I find the cap years included skew the AAV picture and years by a ton and taken out you see the market fairly clearly.

Looking at the chart, he'd be paid at the going rate for elite goalies (6.71 instead of 7.00), but already 33 (not on the list, but Thomas is a good example of a guy who got about 1-1.5 less than market for already being old when he signed). That's an overpayment, but looking at Bryzgalov and even what Kipper got years ago, it's hardly a large one. Meaning, IMO if was a UFA right now, he'd probably get something not too far off this deal, which really kind of boggles my mind and wasn't what I expected.

Now, you can spin potentialities a lot of ways and probably more that make it a bad contract than a good one, but that'd be true of trying to ink just about any UFA goalie too.

That doesn't mean I'd include any of Gardiner, Reilly, or a future 1st, and Kadri would be quite painful, but I don't see where a potential elite goalie is coming from otherwise anytime soon (if you believe in Reimer, fair enough, but I'm not sold). Sure, there's always a chance you can steal Bernier and he pans out or you pick the right Anderson type or acquire a Lehner type young guy before he make the league and adjusts quickly (just had OTT goalie on the brain there), but those are pretty much pipedreams in comparison to the reality of Luongo's availability and track record. You could trade for Luongo and draft a future star goalie next year and he'd easily fit into Luongo's salary timetable (back-up in 3-4 years, with a 1-2 year audition before starting). Developing young goalies takes forever.

So yesterday I would've called Burke (or Nonis) lots of mean names if they'd traded Kadri and Bozak for Luongo, today I'd probably grit my teeth a bit about losing Kadri and just keep my fingers crossed for Luongo's health and stability. :D
 
Nonis quote....

"We are not going to be tearing apart our reserve lists...":handclap:

We can stop the Gillis fantasy threads now,the dream is over and now his nightmare can begin. Luongo has no value.Game,set and match. Deal with it.
 
I remember another certain declining goaltender who signed with the Leafs, albeit as a free agent, at the ripe old age of 37 and was pretty awesome for us for 3 of his 4 years.
 
Tsn is reporting now that Paul Holmgren of the Flyers has said he has no interest in Luongo "it made him chuckle", back to a two horse race.
 
Tsn is reporting now that Paul Holmgren of the Flyers has said he has no interest in Luongo "it made him chuckle", back to a two horse race.

No surprise there. No way Phili trading for Lou with Briz contract on hands (and they will not buy him out for the very same reasons Van will not buyout Lou).
 
Tsn is reporting now that Paul Holmgren of the Flyers has said he has no interest in Luongo "it made him chuckle", back to a two horse race.

It's not a race. Not for that contract. Truth will come out when Luongo starts on the Nucks bench.
 
Tsn is reporting now that Paul Holmgren of the Flyers has said he has no interest in Luongo "it made him chuckle", back to a two horse race.

I would bet my house that one of the Canucks upper management guys leaked that out to garner some more interest in Luongo, this is a two horse race turning into not a race at all...Even Nonis has said he's not trading any of our top end reserves. Good luck to Vancouver getting rid of a 5 million dollar back-up. And make no mistake when Luongo starts on the bench his value will continue to dip.
 
Luongo flying out to Vancouver. Any chance this had of being resolved quickly is out the window. This will drag out all year and into the next off season.
 
Just think this guy was a rookie doing this...this guy has so much potential and to think we would have to give this up for a couple of good years of goaltending.





Gardiner is going to be a stud for the next 10-15 years. Book it!
 
I would bet my house that one of the Canucks upper management guys leaked that out to garner some more interest in Luongo, this is a two horse race turning into not a race at all...Even Nonis has said he's not trading any of our top end reserves. Good luck to Vancouver getting rid of a 5 million dollar back-up. And make no mistake when Luongo starts on the bench his value will continue to dip.

I agree, the Nucks have a hard dose of reality about to sink in.

I gotta say, I really am glad Burke didn't do any cap circumventing or ridiculous long term contracts right now.
 
I would bet my house that one of the Canucks upper management guys leaked that out to garner some more interest in Luongo, this is a two horse race turning into not a race at all...Even Nonis has said he's not trading any of our top end reserves. Good luck to Vancouver getting rid of a 5 million dollar back-up. And make no mistake when Luongo starts on the bench his value will continue to dip.

Yes, why not wait a few games. Once the reality of seeing Luongo on their bench kicks in try will start to squirm a little. Give a little faith to Reimer. Let him try to show how he is back to form.
 
if the rumored kadri + bozak + 2nd is true, then thats a good deal for both teams.
 
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