Training Camp 2023

[SolidSnakeUS]

I read through that list and think to myself, knowing the coach and the front office, not sure why their list would be this large. Why try for a chance if you know you're already not good enough for Torts? Even if you're better than most, you're still not as good as a washed up vet.

 

[GapToothedWonder]

The hand-wringing and consternation about imagined pairings and blockers is comical. Training camp hasn't started nor have an lines/rushes been created (rookie scrimmages just don't count). Relax people ffs. Let it play out before riling yourselves up into a tizzy. #Breathe

Theres always got to be one.

"Stop having opinions on the Flyers on this website specifically developed to have opinions on thr Flyers"

 

[Beef Invictus]

If you're rebuilding, there's no need to rush players.
And if you want to obtain assets, you have to play Atkinson et al.

Foerster is competing with 26 year old Allison for the 3RW spot, not Atkinson. Either Atkinson or Tippet will be 2LW.
Zamula will make the team and play, Torts likes him.

With players like Andrae, Attard, Ginning, Grans, it's about showing you're NHL ready - in that case they'll find a spot - but if you're a mediocre performer in LHV, what's the point of giving you NHL PT?

Same holds for Lycksell, Brink, Desnoyers and Wisdom.

Does anyone seriously believe that adding Staal and Hathaway, and keeping Seeler, is about trying to make the playoffs? I mean do you think they will move the needle?

They're not rebuilding.

 

[Magua]

They're not rebuilding.

They’re rebuilding their culture.

 

[deadhead]

Seeler was 6th among D-men in minutes played. Now does that sound like he has a lock on a job, anymore than Hagg did?

In the interview with Briere, he says Torts is excited to be coaching young players, they just don't want to be forced to play a prospect who isn't NHL ready.

Last year they gave Bellows (24) a chance to win a job, Lemieux (26), after MacEwen (26).
All gone. So is J Cates (25). They were cycling through "last chance" players.
Hayes, TDA, Provorov, JVR, Brown and Braun are all gone.

Tippett, Cates and Frost all (23), were given starting jobs. As well as York (21).
And of course, TK (25), Farabee (22) and Hart (24) were established starters.

Allison (25) played 60 games, Laczynski (25) 32 games despite subpar play.
Zamula (22), played 14 games, Ersson (23) 12 games, Foerster (21) got a 8 game cameo, as did Lycksell (23).

 

[Beef Invictus]

Seeler was 6th among D-men in minutes played. Now does that sound like he has a lock on a job, anymore than Hagg did?

In the interview with Briere, he says Torts is excited to be coaching young players, they just don't want to be forced to play a prospect who isn't NHL ready.

Last year they gave Bellows (24) a chance to win a job, Lemieux (26), after MacEwen (26).
All gone. So is J Cates (25). They were cycling through "last chance" players.
Hayes, TDA, Provorov, JVR, Brown and Braun are all gone.

Tippett, Cates and Frost all (23), were given starting jobs. As well as York (21).
And of course, TK (25), Farabee (22) and Hart (24) were established starters.

Allison (25) played 60 games, Laczynski (25) 32 games despite subpar play.
Zamula (22), played 14 games, Ersson (23) 12 games, Foerster (21) got a 8 game cameo, as did Lycksell (23).

Briere can say it all he wants, Tortorella's own actions speak volumes more. Words are nothing without action backing it up. The only way youth plays is if there is no choice. It's the same as it has always been.

 

[BillDineen]

Sam Sedley is listed as 6ft, 192lbs vs elite prospects which has him at 5'10, 154lbs. I assume he has grown since they listed those stats.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

Seeler >> Staal at this point in their careers. That’s even counting a dead cat bounce for Staal last year.

Staal is the one I’m going to go nuts about.

 

[deadhead]

Seeler >> Staal at this point in their careers. That’s even counting a dead cat bounce for Staal last year.

Staal is the one I’m going to go nuts about.

Staal is interesting, I mean unless you think the Panthers are grossly incompetent, he played 18:50 minutes a night in the POs v Gudas 14:45 at ES. Now some of that is L/R (Ekblad and Montour are RH), but if he was as bad as advertised, huh? They could have always traded for Seeler.

Staal has made $60M over his career, doubt he signed with a bad team for $1.1M because he needed the money. So either he sees this as an entry into coaching, or there's a handshake agreement to try and move him at the TDL to a playoff team.

 

[macleish1974]

Seeler >> Staal at this point in their careers. That’s even counting a dead cat bounce for Staal last year.

Staal is the one I’m going to go nuts about.

Poor goalie, who ever that shall be. I expect Carter Hart will have a psychotic reaction when getting shelled every game.



OK. It is derivative Jeff Beck and the Yardbirds, but it was a song we played as loud as our car "stereo" would play. Every garage band in New Castle County from Newark to Claymont played it. Who ever played it the best usually would win the Battle of the Bands contests. Of course, if the lead singer in any band sounded/looked remotely like Mike Jagger..........

 

[blackjackmulligan]

Seeler was 6th among D-men in minutes played. Now does that sound like he has a lock on a job, anymore than Hagg did?

In the interview with Briere, he says Torts is excited to be coaching young players, they just don't want to be forced to play a prospect who isn't NHL ready.

Last year they gave Bellows (24) a chance to win a job, Lemieux (26), after MacEwen (26).
All gone. So is J Cates (25). They were cycling through "last chance" players.
Hayes, TDA, Provorov, JVR, Brown and Braun are all gone.

Tippett, Cates and Frost all (23), were given starting jobs. As well as York (21).
And of course, TK (25), Farabee (22) and Hart (24) were established starters.

Allison (25) played 60 games, Laczynski (25) 32 games despite subpar play.
Zamula (22), played 14 games, Ersson (23) 12 games, Foerster (21) got a 8 game cameo, as did Lycksell (23).

what matters more, actions or words?

Its not about how many minutes Seeler played. He should have been moved for a pick. Yes he has a lock for a top 6 spot as he should. To remotely deny that is comical.

They didn't give bellow much of shot. The coach wasn't even consulted on that waiver claim. He had him buried pretty much. He didn't want him.

Also the cameo the Forest received should have led to him finishing the year out on the Flyers.

Was Ersson a choice to play or due to circumstances?

They don't want to be forced to play a prospect is code for we want to sneak in the playoffs. As pointed out many times the "prospects" on D are 23/24 years old

Staal is interesting, I mean unless you think the Panthers are grossly incompetent, he played 18:50 minutes a night in the POs v Gudas 14:45 at ES. Now some of that is L/R (Ekblad and Montour are RH), but if he was as bad as advertised, huh? They could have always traded for Seeler.

Staal has made $60M over his career, doubt he signed with a bad team for $1.1M because he needed the money. So either he sees this as an entry into coaching, or there's a handshake agreement to try and move him at the TDL to a playoff team.

flyers had/have no interest in moving seeler.

Or there is a handshake agreement to not move him as he wants stability his last year or 2.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

Staal is interesting, I mean unless you think the Panthers are grossly incompetent, he played 18:50 minutes a night in the POs v Gudas 14:45 at ES. Now some of that is L/R (Ekblad and Montour are RH), but if he was as bad as advertised, huh? They could have always traded for Seeler.

Staal has made $60M over his career, doubt he signed with a bad team for $1.1M because he needed the money. So either he sees this as an entry into coaching, or there's a handshake agreement to try and move him at the TDL to a playoff team.

I will refrain from attempting to say I know why someone wanted another $1.1 MM to play hockey. Maybe he wanted a new Lambo. Maybe he just likes playing. Maybe he’s a hardcore Tortorella guy. I have no idea and zero basis to speculate.

Marc Staal has sucked for years now. The Panthers were a top-heavy team that couldn’t get it together in the regular season and then randomly got hot at exactly the right time. If Staal existing on the ice for 18:50/night for a month trumps multiple years of data we have that says he’s cooked, then there’s no point to considering hockey as a serious topic. I’m more open to that idea than you might think.

 

[deadhead]

Training camp roster is out.
Camp invites (non-AHL players):
Matt Brown, signed to AHL contract
Jonathon Fauchon
Sam Sedley

Barkley listed at 161, up from 154 when drafted
Avon 6'0 190
Grendron 5'10 187
Wisdom 6'0 200
Andrae at 5'9 194
Ginning 6'4 215
Samson 6'3 205

Some others haven't been updated, Lycksell isn't 163 lbs and TK isn't 175 lbs.

 

[Bunch of Jurcos]

Are any of the kids going to make the roster this year? Would love to keep an eye on them when I get the chance to catch a game this year.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

Are any of the kids going to make the roster this year? Would love to keep an eye on them when I get the chance to catch a game this year.

Considering Torts loves bad vet players and loves fighters and grinders, I'm going to say not many. Keep an eye on things, but don't expect the world from this bottom feeder of a team.

 

[Bigkarl]

Staal is interesting, I mean unless you think the Panthers are grossly incompetent, he played 18:50 minutes a night in the POs v Gudas 14:45 at ES. Now some of that is L/R (Ekblad and Montour are RH), but if he was as bad as advertised, huh? They could have always traded for Seeler.

Staal has made $60M over his career, doubt he signed with a bad team for $1.1M because he needed the money. So either he sees this as an entry into coaching, or there's a handshake agreement to try and move him at the TDL to a playoff team.

Or maybe he wants to continue playing and the Flyers were the only team that offered him a contract.

 

[deadhead]

Training camp will decide, though I think kids lose ties, go to AHL, then have to earn their promotion.
But like last year, some will come up early, others after the TDL to gauge their readiness for 2024-25.
And what are the odds they make it through a season with zero injuries?

I think in most cases they don't want players to come up and play limited minutes, they'd rather have them play top 6 minutes in LHV than 8 minutes a night on the 4th line. An exception might be players like Desonyers or Avon, who are bottom six energy types at the NHL level.

Torts is not fixated on veterans, he's always played kids when ready, but he is fixated on demanding that players play physical, back check and block shots - even offense first players, while not expected to be Selke candidates, can't cherry pick or glide back on defense. He didn't ask Frost to hit people, but he wanted him in position on the back check to use his stick to break up plays.

 

[tnfrs]

Or maybe he wants to continue playing and the Flyers were the only team that offered him a contract.

the way danny explained it was marc staal's agent that reached out the Flyers first to say Marc was interested, so Staal either wanted to play for Torts or he thinks he'll have the best chance of getting playing time here or both. Im guessing theres an agreement to move Staal at the deadline and the trade off is a year's worth of teaching Sanheim how to use his long-ass bones more effectively

 

[JojoTheWhale]

"Kids lose ties"

Yep. Hard agree. Illustrative of a shit process.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Staal is interesting, I mean unless you think the Panthers are grossly incompetent, he played 18:50 minutes a night in the POs v Gudas 14:45 at ES. Now some of that is L/R (Ekblad and Montour are RH), but if he was as bad as advertised, huh? They could have always traded for Seeler.

Staal has made $60M over his career, doubt he signed with a bad team for $1.1M because he needed the money. So either he sees this as an entry into coaching, or there's a handshake agreement to try and move him at the TDL to a playoff team.

He's not interesting. He's f***ing bad.

There is no way you are new to the idea of people with money desiring more money.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Are any of the kids going to make the roster this year? Would love to keep an eye on them when I get the chance to catch a game this year.

Lol no of course not

 

[Beef Invictus]

.
But like last year, some will come up early, others after the TDL to gauge their readiness for 2024-25.

This never f***ing happened. You just completely make shit up. Take a hint: when you have to just make up alternate realities and pretend they happened to justify your stance on management, it's a bad stance.

 

[blackjackmulligan]

Training camp will decide, though I think kids lose ties, go to AHL, then have to earn their promotion.
But like last year, some will come up early, others after the TDL to gauge their readiness for 2024-25.
And what are the odds they make it through a season with zero injuries?

I think in most cases they don't want players to come up and play limited minutes, they'd rather have them play top 6 minutes in LHV than 8 minutes a night on the 4th line. An exception might be players like Desonyers or Avon, who are bottom six energy types at the NHL level.

Torts is not fixated on veterans, he's always played kids when ready, but he is fixated on demanding that players play physical, back check and block shots - even offense first players, while not expected to be Selke candidates, can't cherry pick or glide back on defense. He didn't ask Frost to hit people, but he wanted him in position on the back check to use his stick to break up plays.

is that not the coaches fault for not putting them in a position to succeed?

Why can't you have a skilled "kid" line as you 4th line? i mean they are rebuilding and all.

Lol no of course not

do you think the co-gm/coach watched those rookie games? My take is if he did it already puts the Forest behind the 8-ball. If he didn't then no harm I suppose.

 

[Beef Invictus]

is that not the coaches fault for not putting them in a position to succeed?

Why can't you have a skilled "kid" line as you 4th line? i mean they are rebuilding and all.


do you think the co-gm/coach watched those rookie games? My take is if he did it already puts the Forest behind the 8-ball. If he didn't then no harm I suppose.

Even if he did watch he'd be valuing the wrong things anyway. So no good can come of it.

 

[deadhead]

"Kids lose ties"

Yep. Hard agree. Illustrative of a shit process.

If a kid can't clearly beat out a mediocre veteran like Staal or Allison or Laczynski (at 26, they're now bottom six veterans like MacEwen last season), better that they start the season in the AHL.

Poehling at 24 really no different than say Lycksell at 24.

There's a group of players who will play b/c of contracts, Couts, Atkinson, Risto, Sanheim, Laughton.
There's another group b/c you want to build their TDL value, Walker, Hathaway, Seeler.
And obviously no one is beating out TK, Farabee, Frost, Tippett and York.

Other than Foerster, there is no prospect in training camp who is clearly "NHL ready."
It's up to these kids to open eyes in practice, then carry that over to exhibition games.