GDT: Trades & Free Agency -- Off-season edition

[ULF_55]

OEL is actually in a 3rd pair...much easier than playing on top pair against toughest matchup like he did in Vancouver

Close, but he was 2nd. pairing in Vancouver last year, a minute more than Bear.

 

[Apex Predator]

Matthews is right there with him but nobody's ready for that conversation

People have had that conversations. There was a large group that wanted to trade him last year.

 

[Fogelhund]

Matthews is right there with him but nobody's ready for that conversation

You move Marner, in hopes that whatever Shanahan and Tre are seeing as deficiencies in his game, can be fixed by bringing in new bodies to fix the team.

You move Matthews, and you are rebuilding. There is no fixing the team, and you are starting from scratch... you are just hoping that with some changes, he figures it out.

That's the difference in the conversation..

 

[aingefan]

""

As a #8 guy... sure... at league minimum... but not in any other role.

Yeah, player coach for sure.
With conditioning stints player coaching Marlies.
With Muzzin coaching D in the system too.

 

[WTFMAN99]

You move Marner, in hopes that whatever Shanahan and Tre are seeing as deficiencies in his game, can be fixed by bringing in new bodies to fix the team.

You move Matthews, and you are rebuilding. There is no fixing the team, and you are starting from scratch... you are just hoping that with some changes, he figures it out.

That's the difference in the conversation..

1C is basically a prerequisite to do anything in this league.

You want a cup? You need an amazing top 4 or a bonafide stud #1 D

We haven't figured out the defense and the depth up front has been so-so.

 

[mydnyte]

1C is basically a prerequisite to do anything in this league.

You want a cup? You need an amazing top 4 or a bonafide stud #1 D

We haven't figured out the defense and the depth up front has been so-so.

the issue as I see it has been that our Defense offers no threat to the defending team, and they can ignore them almost completely, and focus down low and in front of the net on our forwards, and contain them that much easier as a result.
With no real threat from the defense, other teams have no reason to worry about stopping them, as all they do is pass to the side boards.

 

[WTFMAN99]

the issue as I see it has been that our Defense offers no threat to the defending team, and they can ignore them almost completely, and focus down low and in front of the net on our forwards, and contain them that much easier as a result.
With no real threat from the defense, other teams have no reason to worry about stopping them, as all they do is pass to the side boards.

That's definitely on Tree to fix, Florida doesn't have the true stud # but their top 4 is strong, especially the top 3 of Ekblad, Forsling and Montour. Montour offers the most offense of the 3 but the other 2 aren't useless there either.

Rielly's got a muffin of a shot and after that our group back on defense doesn't offer much.

 

[mydnyte]

That's definitely on Tree to fix, Florida doesn't have the true stud # but their top 4 is strong, especially the top 3 of Ekblad, Forsling and Montour. Montour offers the most offense of the 3 but the other 2 aren't useless there either.

Rielly's got a muffin of a shot and after that our group back on defense doesn't offer much.

he has (had) a decent wrister, and used it well for 1 season, and 1 season only... I've never understood why he stopped shooting the puck. We really need a PP slap shot threat though, heck, I'm desperate enough to let Robertson try the point, as he may have the best slapper on the team (and that is pretty sad when a 5'9" guy has the hardest slap shot on the team)

 

[PromisedLand]

GO BIG or GO HOME

Leaf need Cliff Fletcher back who brought us Dougie Gilmour and Mats Sundin in blockbuster trades.

My trade proposal ... Leafs and NYI's ..

TO NYI:

Mitch Marner ($10,903,000) + Morgan Rielly ($7,500,000) + Joseph Woll ($766,667) + Timothy Liljegren (RFA past $1,400,000) = $20.56 mil total AAV

TO TORONTO:

Matty Barzal ($9,150,000) + Noah Dobson ($4,000,000) + Ilya Sorokin ($8,250,000) + Scott Mayfield ($3,500,000) = $24.9 mil total AAV

Conclusion:

Leafs address all their needs in 1 shot ... Barzal becomes Leafs #2C replacing an aging JT .. Sorokin gives Leafs their proven #1G and Dobson and Mayfield are both RHD filling out the right side.

NYI gain a little Cap space to re-sign Marner long-term and Woll and Liljegren are young and were both drafted by Lou Lam when he was Leafs GM.

Who is with me on this?

NYI IMO loses this and won't do it unless Leafs sweeten the pot with a few picks

just based on the players listed

Barzal (center) > Marner (winger) -> given cap hit and position
Doboson >Rielly (IMO)
Mayfield > Liljegren (at least based on NHL experience)
Sorokin > Woll (based on NHL experience)

 

[notdoneyet]

Here is the current list of NHL forwards making between $9 mil and less then $10 mil AAV.

Players like Kucherov, Aho, Tkachuk, Rantanen, Point, Stone, Barzal & Kaprizov etc. This is the group Marner should be grouped in with contract wise.

View attachment 885191

Marner's next contract should be 8 years @ $9.5 mil AAV which = a pay-cut of nearly $1.5 mil per year to bring him in-line with his comparable group of forwards.

So your now saying nylander is 2.5 million overpaid because he isn’t better than anyone you compared marner to

 

[WTFMAN99]

he has (had) a decent wrister, and used it well for 1 season, and 1 season only... I've never understood why he stopped shooting the puck. We really need a PP slap shot threat though, heck, I'm desperate enough to let Robertson try the point, as he may have the best slapper on the team (and that is pretty sad when a 5'9" guy has the hardest slap shot on the team)

So I toyed with the idea of something like...

Karlsson
Theodore
3rd 2025 SJS

for

Marner (1.903 retained)
Liljegren rights
5th 2024 NSH

I'd look at something like

Matthews right face off circle
Theodore and Nylander on the points
Knies net front

The extra piece after that would be tough, if Domi is back, he would be a decent guy on the left half wall. I would really be asking for Domi, Theodore and Nylander to be moving around a lot though and not be too statics. Knies can push out to the bumper if need be or slide back for net front presence.

Rielly, JT are the primary pieces on PP2

 

[Dreakmur]

The original post was about playing kids, there being more kids to play now, and the worse ways we've surrounded them.

It started with your false claim that Dubas provided us with a great pool of young depth. That somehow turned into you pretending Bertuzzi and Domi were bad signings. Of course we all know that if Dubas made the exact same signings, you'd be all over it and giving him the old hawk tuah.

You haven't really responded to anything. You've largely just dumped on our kids, pretended that having more internal depth is bad, and praised Treliving for his failures.

I'm not questioning our internal depth. I'm denying it's existence.

Yes, I am certainly glad that we didn't screw up pretty obvious 1st and 8th overall picks. And glad Dubas re-signed them.

Just more guys Dubas didn't acquire.....

Not true, and already more than Treliving had.

Very true... and Treliving's 1st pick likely beats all of your imaginary Dubas depth onto this roster.

 

[Mess]

NYI IMO loses this and won't do it unless Leafs sweeten the pot with a few picks

just based on the players listed

Barzal (center) > Marner (winger) -> given cap hit and position
Doboson >Rielly (IMO)
Mayfield > Liljegren (at least based on NHL experience)
Sorokin > Woll (based on NHL experience)

No question there could be some massaging to the overall deal to involve balancing draft picks / prospects as often in the case in trades like this.

This would just be the core/meat of the transaction.

 

[TheDoldrums]

That's definitely on Tree to fix, Florida doesn't have the true stud # but their top 4 is strong, especially the top 3 of Ekblad, Forsling and Montour. Montour offers the most offense of the 3 but the other 2 aren't useless there either.

Rielly's got a muffin of a shot and after that our group back on defense doesn't offer much.

Florida definitely has a stud #1, it’s Forsling

 

[hockeywiz542]

Colorado’s Ross Colton joins Trade Targets as NHL trade market heats up

After two big trades earlier this week, more dominoes may soon fall.

www.dailyfaceoff.com

8. Ross Colton

Center, Colorado Avalanche

Age: 27

Stats: 80 GP, 17 G, 23 A, 40 Pts

Contract: 3 years remaining, $4 million AAV

Scoop: It was less than one calendar year ago, June 28, that the Avs acquired Colton as a cap casualty from the Tampa Bay Lightning. Now, one year later, Colton could be the same for the Avalanche. Colton is coming off a career-best 40-point season, too. It’s just that Colorado has so many hurdles to clear on the cap this summer that Colton may be the odd man out. They have to clear space for Gabriel Landeskog to be activated at some point next season. They aren’t sure about the status of Valeri Nichushkin, who is in Stage 3 of the Player Assistance program after a drug-related issue during the playoffs for the second year in a row. And they’ve also prioritized the re-signing of Jonathan Drouin. The arrival of Casey Mittelstadt at center, who also needs a new deal, makes it easier to move Colton, who should have plenty of trade equity – but the Avs will have to act fast because Colton’s full ‘no-trade’ clause kicks in on July 1. He has no trade protection until then.

 

[jaric1862]

Ross Colton fits this team like a glove.

 

[Dekes For Days]

It started with your false claim that Dubas provided us with a great pool of young depth. That somehow turned into you pretending Bertuzzi and Domi were bad signings.

Actually, what I said in a small portion of my post is that he was "much better at replenishing the pool" than Lou, which is true. And then you pretended that all of our young players and prospects were bad. And then you brought up Domi and Bertuzzi, so I corrected your statements about them and countered your praise of Treliving's failures.

I'm not questioning our internal depth. I'm denying it's existence.

Covering your eyes doesn't make something stop existing.

Treliving's 1st pick likely beats all of your imaginary Dubas depth onto this roster.

Unless Hudson Malinoski has a time machine, that will be pretty hard.

 

[shortfuze]

how many chances do you give a guy? Time to move on, and IF he turns into the next Stralman, well he couldn't do it here..................

He hasn’t even played 200 games yet. Let the kid play. Some defencemen take longer to develop.

 

[BertCorbeau]

He hasn’t even played 200 games yet. Let the kid play. Some defencemen take longer to develop.

I’d replace some with most.. look at coveted free agent Brandon Montour

 

[Smif]

Here is the current list of NHL forwards making between $9 mil and less then $10 mil AAV.

Players like Kucherov, Aho, Tkachuk, Rantanen, Point, Stone, Barzal & Kaprizov etc. This is the group Marner should be grouped in with contract wise.

View attachment 885191

Marner's next contract should be 8 years @ $9.5 mil AAV which = a pay-cut of nearly $1.5 mil per year to bring him in-line with his comparable group of forwards.

What was their cap percentage when they all signed?

 

[Stephen]

10.9m in cap space is not nearly the prize that some pretend it is, especially when it would most likely get wasted or bring back lesser overall impact, and not go towards those other superstars. The only real way that Marner loses is a career-ending injury. There are many, many ways that Toronto loses in this. The risk for Marner is much smaller.

It's like this every year after Marner lays an egg. People forget the emotional gut punch of his little playoff meltdowns and no shows and things return to normal and we start hyping up the boyband again. It's time to take the poster off bedroom walls, donate the jersey to Value Village. Move on.

 

[LeafEgo]

He hasn’t even played 200 games yet. Let the kid play. Some defencemen take longer to develop.

There is a cost to waiting for a defenceman to break out who has been stagnant for years - paying for an RD every tdl to jam into the lineup down the final stretch so Lily can sit in the press box come playoff time.

Lily is a solid asset for many teams to have, and maybe Toronto is actually one of them, but we're sort of forced by timeline not to be.

I'd keep him to play with Benny on the third pairing if that's how it shakes out, but if McCabe can take that spot then cut him loose and don't look back.

 

[Gabriel426]

Colorado’s Ross Colton joins Trade Targets as NHL trade market heats up

After two big trades earlier this week, more dominoes may soon fall.

www.dailyfaceoff.com

8. Ross Colton

Center, Colorado Avalanche

Age: 27

Stats: 80 GP, 17 G, 23 A, 40 Pts

Contract: 3 years remaining, $4 million AAV

Scoop: It was less than one calendar year ago, June 28, that the Avs acquired Colton as a cap casualty from the Tampa Bay Lightning. Now, one year later, Colton could be the same for the Avalanche. Colton is coming off a career-best 40-point season, too. It’s just that Colorado has so many hurdles to clear on the cap this summer that Colton may be the odd man out. They have to clear space for Gabriel Landeskog to be activated at some point next season. They aren’t sure about the status of Valeri Nichushkin, who is in Stage 3 of the Player Assistance program after a drug-related issue during the playoffs for the second year in a row. And they’ve also prioritized the re-signing of Jonathan Drouin. The arrival of Casey Mittelstadt at center, who also needs a new deal, makes it easier to move Colton, who should have plenty of trade equity – but the Avs will have to act fast because Colton’s full ‘no-trade’ clause kicks in on July 1. He has no trade protection until then.

As much as I like him to be a Leafs, he is a bit pricey.

It's like this every year after Marner lays an egg. People forget the emotional gut punch of his little playoff meltdowns and no shows and things return to normal and we start hyping up the boyband again. It's time to take the poster off bedroom walls, donate the jersey to Value Village. Move on.

But if both the player and the team is doing well. It is hard to complain.
Having said that, if they bring them all back and even if they win the President Trophy, and play the worst playoffs team in history in the first round, I still don’t have faith in them winning the round till they win the 4th game. That’s bc of their past history.

 

[ULF_55]

Re: Ross Colton

As much as I like him to be a Leafs, he is a bit pricey.

He's being mentioned as a dump ... so send a cheaper dump back.

Jarnkrok / Kampf

 

[LaPlante94]

10.9m in cap space is not nearly the prize that some pretend it is, especially when it would most likely get wasted or bring back lesser overall impact, and not go towards those other superstars. The only real way that Marner loses is a career-ending injury. There are many, many ways that Toronto loses in this. The risk for Marner is much smaller.

It doesn't have to bring in a player to replace Marners production. It has to bring in players to help out our top 6 produce offence in the playoffs. McDavid played a Game 5 of the Cup finals with Hyman and Foegle for crying out loud. Could you imagine the crying on here if Matthews or Marner ever had to do that. Hell, people cried when Matthews and Marner had to play with Hyman. Matthews is gonna produce no matter what and he showed that playing with 2 guys who made less than Marner combined. Makes the team much harder to match up against and possibly gives Matthews and Nylander easier matchups at times for other teams to adjust, especially if you can get a good 2nd line C in return for Marner and move Tavares to the 3rd line.

For the record, I think Marner will be a better player under Berube and at this point I stopped caring if he stays or goes, but this thinking that we probably wouldn't even be a playoff team and get so much worse just because 1 player is gone is getting a bit ridiculous or that we must bring in a player who can put up 100 points.