Proposal: Trade Rumours/Proposals PART XXXXX

[Micklebot]

If Pierre Dorion gave Mathieu Joseph, a soon-to-be 26-year old, $2.9M for 4 years and is happy with a 7 goal/82 game pace (and the occasional healthy scratch!) then he's dumber than even I thought.

Or perhaps you are out of touch with what it costs to sign 3rdne wingers and what can realistically be expected of them when both their linemates are oversloted.

Joseph was signed to play with Formenton and Pinto, instead he has Motte and Brassard. Do you think that perhaps that has impacted his production? His sh% is about half his career average, that will likely change, particularly if he gets some linemates that belong on a third line, but his overall production is inline with what he was doing in Tbay before being traded, we are getting what should have been expected given the circumstances,

 

[DaveMatthew]

Or perhaps you are out of touch with what it costs to sign 3rdne wingers and what can realistically be expected of them when both their linemates are oversloted.

Joseph was signed to play with Formenton and Pinto, instead he has Motte and Brassard. Do you think that perhaps that has impacted his production? His sh% is about half his career average, that will likely change, particularly if he gets some linemates that belong on a third line, but his overall production is inline with what he was doing in Tbay before being traded, we are getting what should have been expected given the circumstances,

I think paying $2.9M for a 30 pt 3rd line winger through their 25-29 year old seasons is a very stupid decision for an organization that is not even on the cusp of the playoffs and will likely never be able to spend to the cap limit or buy themselves out of their mistakes.

If they made a gamble thinking this guy had more upside than what he showed in Tampa, based on his end-of-season last year? I can understand it.

But if this is what they realistically expected? Yeah, that's a moron move.

Do I think they're disappointed with how year 1 has turned out? Absolutely.

If we wanted to trade Joseph right now, we'd probably have to attach a draft pick.

 

[BankStreetParade]

He's an easily replaceable player - as made clear by DJ Smith deciding that having him as a healthy scratch is not a problem.

This is really dumb. Players get scratched for behavioural issues all the time, it has nothing to do with how replaceable they are. But I bet if DJ didn't scratch him and somehow the story got out that Joseph played despite missing team meetings and being late to video prep, you'd say the coach was a moron for letting it happen.

 

[DaveMatthew]

This is really dumb. Players get scratched for behavioural issues all the time, it has nothing to do with how replaceable they are. But I bet if DJ didn't scratch him and somehow the story got out that Joseph played despite missing team meetings and being late to video prep, you'd say the coach was a moron for letting it happen.

It doesn't matter what I, or the fans, say.

I think that scratching a player when he's set to play in front of 50+ family and friends is much more likely to backfire on the coach, within the team, than benefit him. It'd be one thing if they were winning. But they're not. They're losing. They atmosphere is already negative. Even if he was late to a meeting, I bet his teammates think it's a dick move that he's not playing tonight. Just brings more negativity.

I mean, even if he was late to a meeting, DJ could have used it as a way to challenge him. "Bring your A game from the first shift or I won't hesitate to staple you to the bench in front of your mom". Maybe he plays like he did at the end of last season and helps us actually win a game.

Instead, we'll see Gambrell and Kelly plod around.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Im sorry, but our lives are boring. We need excitement, regardless if it is manufactured.

Don't you have a 27 year old gf? Wtf

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Unrealistic expectations? You think Ottawa give him $2.9M per season for the next 4 season to score at 7g/29pt/82game pace? Yikes.

Joseph isn't the type of player you protect by keeping him out of the lineup, even if you're looking to trade him. The guy is a dime-a-dozen player, albeit, still quite a bit better than most in our AHL-caliber bottom 6. He's not Mark Stone.

But if that's what they're doing, it's hilarious.

"We want to make a playoff push so we're going to go out and trade for a defenseman (maybe even an upcoming UFA rental!). But in the meantime, as we look for that defenseman, we won't ice our best possible roster and we'll continue to lose games and fall further and further out of the race."

They probably expected Joseph to bring his A game at least half the time.

 

[benjiv1]

FWIW- Haven’t heard Joseph being scratched is trade related, but I guess they could be keeping something on the DL.

 

[Micklebot]

I think paying $2.9M for a 30 pt 3rd line winger through their 25-29 year old seasons is a very stupid decision for an organization that will likely never be able to spend to the cap limit or buy themselves out of their mistakes.

If they made a gamble thinking this guy had more upside than what he showed in Tampa, based on his end-of-season last year? I can understand it.

But if this is what they realistically expected? Yeah, that's a moron move.

It's what third liners cost once they get off their ELC, 2-3 mil a year. Add in the Canadian team tax, and this is what you get.

Even then, Joseph is playing in a really poor situation, you seem adverse to acknowledging that playing with Motte and Brassard is a far cry from what was envisioned this offseason. These things matter, and when circumstances get back to having properly slotted linemates with him we likely will see improvement in production from the line as a whole, but as it stands, his line hasn't really been the problem with the team despite not putting up lots of offense, he and Motte are the only + forwards on the team. +/- is a terrible stat, but the third line isn't costing us games.

 

[DaveMatthew]

It's what third liners cost once they get off their ELC, 2-3 mil a year. Add in the Canadian team tax, and this is what you get.

Doesn't mean it was a smart decision. We could have signed Joseph to a 1-2 year deal. See what we had. He was an RFA. No one forced us to give him 4 years.

Right now it looks like another bad contract we'll be trying to move this summer or next.

Hopefully for our sake, he turns it around when this franchise is reset with new management and coaching.

But really, I'd just love to get inside Dorion's head. "Duclair at 3x$3M? No! Paul at 4x3M? No! Joseph at 4x$2.9M? Yes!"

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Doesn't mean it was a smart decision. We could have signed Joseph to a 1-2 year deal. See what we had. He was an RFA. No one forced us to give him 4 years.

Right now it looks like another bad contract we'll be trying to move this summer or next.

Hopefully for our sake, he turns it around when this franchise is reset with new management and coaching.

But really, I'd just love to get inside Dorion's head. "Duclair at 3x$3M? No! Paul at 4x3M? No! Joseph at 4x$2.9M? Yes!"

Good points. Not sure what you expect to see inside Dorion's head though

 

[Big Muddy]

We haven't had any more updates or news on the Dumba situation. Maybe that means we dodged a bullet? Or, maybe that's what I'm just hoping has happened?

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Or perhaps you are out of touch with what it costs to sign 3rdne wingers and what can realistically be expected of them when both their linemates are oversloted.

Joseph was signed to play with Formenton and Pinto, instead he has Motte and Brassard. Do you think that perhaps that has impacted his production? His sh% is about half his career average, that will likely change, particularly if he gets some linemates that belong on a third line, but his overall production is inline with what he was doing in Tbay before being traded, we are getting what should have been expected given the circumstances,

Production is one thing to look at your favorite stats page but Joseph was in for 25 games and I have been disappointed in his play, not his stats.
I'd like better stats but first I want to see better play. We can look to his line mates for his stats but he owns how he plays to a very large degree.

 

[Masked]

FWIW- Haven’t heard Joseph being scratched is trade related, but I guess they could be keeping something on the DL.

If it was trade related he'd be a late minute healthy scratch. Not announced in the afternoon.

Assen na yo!

 

[Joeyjoejoe]

Vinnie Hinostroza would be a great waiver wire pickup that can play either wing or centre. Has more points that anyone in our bottom 6 despite playing less games that any of them.

 

[DaveMatthew]

Vinnie Hinostroza would be a great waiver wire pickup that can play either wing or centre. Has more points that anyone in our bottom 6 despite playing less games that any of them.

Is he hard?

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Is he hard?

Weird you copied Joey's post and replaced mine? or is this something out of your control .. @Micklebot

I was reading the quoted post and went wait there is no fn way I'd say that

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Watch Joseph for Holl lol

 

[Micklebot]

Weird you copied Joey's post and replaced mine? or is this something out of your control .. @Micklebot

I was reading the quoted post and went wait there is no fn way I'd say that

He probably had two quotes and manually deleted one,. Sometimes the forum glitches and pick the wrong user for the quote when automatically adjusting the html tags in the background.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

He probably had two quotes and manually deleted one,. Sometimes the forum glitches and pick the wrong user for the quote when automatically adjusting the html tags in the background.

so a bug. ok

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Vinnie Hinostroza would be a great waiver wire pickup that can play either wing or centre. Has more points that anyone in our bottom 6 despite playing less games that any of them.

I like hinostroza. Didn’t he also score a hat trick on us once? Dorion is usually on that shit

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

 

[BankStreetParade]

It doesn't matter what I, or the fans, say.

I think that scratching a player when he's set to play in front of 50+ family and friends is much more likely to backfire on the coach, within the team, than benefit him. It'd be one thing if they were winning. But they're not. They're losing. They atmosphere is already negative. Even if he was late to a meeting, I bet his teammates think it's a dick move that he's not playing tonight. Just brings more negativity.

I mean, even if he was late to a meeting, DJ could have used it as a way to challenge him. "Bring your A game from the first shift or I won't hesitate to staple you to the bench in front of your mom". Maybe he plays like he did at the end of last season and helps us actually win a game.

Instead, we'll see Gambrell and Kelly plod around.

If his teammates are pissed that they're losing games then they're definitely pissed that someone is showing up late to/missing meetings. Him doing something stupid that would usually get him scratched but letting it slide because his friends and family are coming is the epitome of player over team. You really think guys like Giroux and Tkachuk subscribe to that belief?

 

[DaveMatthew]

If his teammates are pissed that they're losing games then they're definitely pissed that someone is showing up late to/missing meetings. Him doing something stupid that would usually get him scratched but letting it slide because his friends and family are coming is the epitome of player over team. You really think guys like Giroux and Tkachuk subscribe to that belief?

What makes you think the team is pissed off about losing? They certainly aren't playing like it, especially the top guys. Chabot and Batherson are playing pond hockey while Tkachuk is allergic to his own end. None of them seem to be in any hurry to change.

The "vibe" in the room seems to be much more "let's hang out with our buds and live an NHL lifestyle" than "let's do what it takes to win games". I bet they're on Joseph's side in any sort of "behavioural" situation.

 

[BankStreetParade]

What makes you think the team is pissed off about losing? They certainly aren't playing like it, especially the top guys. Chabot and Batherson are playing pond hockey while Tkachuk is allergic to his own end. None of them seem to be in any hurry to change.

The "vibe" in the room seems to be much more "let's hang out with our buds and live an NHL lifestyle" than "let's do what it takes to win games". I bet they're on Joseph's side in any sort of "behavioural" situation.

It's crazy how you'll crank up the hot take to continue telling the same story rather than just saying "maybe I'm wrong on this..."

So, now, not only are the players not pissed about losing but we also have a country club locker room. I can't wait to see what the next development is in this fairytale you're telling.

 

[slamigo]

How is it that everyone seems to have accepted that Joseph has broken team rules? Nobody has a clue why he is being scratched.