OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: Congrats to KC, but Kelce was the real winner winning Swift

[JTG]

For me, I think if we can run the football at will and keep our defense rested, they will win football games. We have to control the line of scrimmage offensively, and if we can, it will buy Pickett some time and open things up. I think it's priority #1 this offseason.

 

[MrBrightside]

I mean, yes, I think ILB and S will be addressed in free agency as they aren't premium positions that you'd generally want to invest your top draft capital. But I also don't think you can roll into 2024 with the idea that rookies will start at CB, LT, C, and WR, so they'll need to add in free agency to those positions as well and there's one so much cap space to go around.

For me, I think if we can run the football at will and keep our defense rested, they will win football games. We have to control the line of scrimmage offensively, and if we can, it will buy Pickett some time and open things up. I think it's priority #1 this offseason.

That you, Mike T?

 

[WickedWrister]

I mean, yes, I think ILB and S will be addressed in free agency as they aren't premium positions that you'd generally want to invest your top draft capital. But I also don't think you can roll into 2024 with the idea that rookies will start at CB, LT, C, and WR, so they'll need to add in free agency to those positions as well and there's one so much cap space to go around.


That you, Mike T?

Some names being thrown around in this article. Seems like this FA class has a lot more LB and Safety depth than the draft.

Steelers 2024 Free Agent Wish List - Defense

Just as we did for the offensive side of the ball yesterday, I’ve put together a list of defensive free-agent options the Pittsburgh Steelers could or should consider when free agency opens up next week. Some are based on players I want to see the team sign, while others are here because of...

steelersdepot.com

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Some names being thrown around in this article. Seems like this FA class has a lot more LB and Safety depth than the draft.

Steelers 2024 Free Agent Wish List - Defense

Just as we did for the offensive side of the ball yesterday, I’ve put together a list of defensive free-agent options the Pittsburgh Steelers could or should consider when free agency opens up next week. Some are based on players I want to see the team sign, while others are here because of...

steelersdepot.com

Guess Devin White hasn't worked out either.

Looks like he got benched in the playoffs.

Not a good look.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

Once again, GP, who gets way less targets, has more 100 yard games in only two years (6) than DJ has in his entire career (5)!

In fact, GP, in the same offense with the same damn QBs, put up five 100 yard games just this past season.

So GP already has as many 100 yard games this past season as DJ has in his career.

GP has had the same QBs throwing him the ball as DJ, with less targets.

But keep bending the logic that it’s the QBs fault DJ is the only #1 WR to likely ever go 36 games without posting 100 yards.

So the guy you are white knighting for:

- went an entire season without a TD
- has a current streak of 36 games without 100 yard game
- quit on his team
- assaulted his Qb
- went after a coach and had to be carried away by B Jones
- was confronted by a team leader and the argument got so heated Watt and CH had to pull them apart
- constantly pouts on the sideline like a child

This is the guy you think this team needs to keep to be winners again?

The f***?

In order to be winners they need an actual Qb nothing else matters until then. However if you want KP or whoever to have any chance of success you need actual nfl Wr. We are blaming wr for not having td when his starting qb has 13 in 26 starts. The idea he can get to 25 in 17 games is crazy to some on this board.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

For me, I think if we can run the football at will and keep our defense rested, they will win football games. We have to control the line of scrimmage offensively, and if we can, it will buy Pickett some time and open things up. I think it's priority #1 this offseason.

That’s exactly what the plan is. They don’t trust KP to throw it 30 times a game. Maybe by 2027 he will be ready

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

In order to be winners they need an actual Qb nothing else matters until then. However if you want KP or whoever to have any chance of success you need actual nfl Wr. We are blaming wr for not having td when his starting qb has 13 in 26 starts. The idea he can get to 25 in 17 games is crazy to some on this board.

GP has 9 TD since he came into the league (once again on way less targets), so he is finding his way into the end zone.

Is GP secretly playing with another QB DJ isn't?

Garrett Wilson is playing with one of the worst QB situations in the league in a putrid offense that had the worst EPA in the last 25 years!

They were literally ranked dead last at 766 out of 766 teams in that span!

Wilson has still managed crazy things like getting Tds (7) and 100 yard games (5) over the last two years.

Only DJ can go an entire season without a TD and 36 games (and counting) without 100 yard game.

Maybe because he's too busy quitting on his teammates and coaches.

When he's not fighting them of course.

To the point, your excuses are nothing but bullshit.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

Wilson was targeted over 300 times in those 2 seasons DJ 240. The difference between them is 2 tds and 500 yard over those 2 seasons.
GP had 190 targets ocer the last 2 seasons over 100 this season. The offense with Kp can not feed 2 wr and a te
Lizard was the 2nd most targeted wr for tge jets and he didn’t crack 50. Their te was the 2nd most targeted player

 

[Peat]

If you have crappy Qb play your skill position players will suffer TJ has more sacks than we has td passes. DJ with a real qb is scary

But Pickens and Freiermuth have suffered less than Johnson. Muth had a really stinky season last year but he still had 2 TDs with Pickett and a 100 yard game.

I don't think it's been a walk in the park for the skill players with this offence but Diontae Johnson is absolutely the least in sync with it. So why is he an absolute must keep guy rather than a case of talent who'd need replacing if he went but who is expendable in the right scenario?

Ok, let's hear everyone's preferred order of positions for each of the first four picks and why.
Example-
Rd. 1- RT- too expensive in ufa, moves Jones back to his natural position, solidifies line, blah blah blah.
Feel free to be player specific.

A Surprise Free Agent, LB Jerome Baker Could Provide Answer At One Of Steelers' Biggest Needs

UPDATE: Per the official NFL transaction report for Tuesday, Baker was released by the Dolphins due to a failed physical. Baker is recovering from wrist surgery. Baker had wrist surgery on Jan. 8, 2024, which he shared on Twitter. When i step out on the field I give it all for my brothers and...

steelersdepot.com

I honestly don't know what right now. I haven't really studied how deep you can still get players in each position. I'm worried they could out of OL positions the team needs before 51 so I guess them first - might be a good time to trade back in the 1st to pick up extra help - but I wouldn't be mad if it was a CB or even WR if Johnson goes.

They really need to reduce their need list in FA, which looks a lot stronger on the defensive side of the ball.

 

[MrBrightside]

But Pickens and Freiermuth have suffered less than Johnson. Muth had a really stinky season last year but he still had 2 TDs with Pickett and a 100 yard game.

I don't think it's been a walk in the park for the skill players with this offence but Diontae Johnson is absolutely the least in sync with it. So why is he an absolute must keep guy rather than a case of talent who'd need replacing if he went but who is expendable in the right scenario?



I honestly don't know what right now. I haven't really studied how deep you can still get players in each position. I'm worried they could out of OL positions the team needs before 51 so I guess them first - might be a good time to trade back in the 1st to pick up extra help - but I wouldn't be mad if it was a CB or even WR if Johnson goes.

They really need to reduce their need list in FA, which looks a lot stronger on the defensive side of the ball.

Who said he’s a “Must keep?” You keep saying that and no one else is. You support Pickett - why is he a must keep?

It’s interesting that Johnson has a substantially better season than Muth did last year yet you cherry picked a meaningless stat from one game in Cincinnati to argue Johnson doesn’t fit and Muth does.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Wilson was targeted over 300 times in those 2 seasons DJ 240. The difference between them is 2 tds and 500 yard over those 2 seasons.
GP had 190 targets ocer the last 2 seasons over 100 this season. The offense with Kp can not feed 2 wr and a te
Lizard was the 2nd most targeted wr for tge jets and he didn’t crack 50. Their te was the 2nd most targeted player

The difference is Wilson plays in literally the worst offense in the last 25 years and still can put up 100 yard games.

You keep dancing around the obvious and we both know why so I’m not playing that game.

Find me even a single #1 WR in the last 30 years that has gone 36 games without a 100 yard game.

Find me just one.

This is historically bad and you keep trying to pretend it’s not real with stupid ass excuses.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Wilson was targeted over 300 times in those 2 seasons DJ 240. The difference between them is 2 tds and 500 yard over those 2 seasons.
GP had 190 targets ocer the last 2 seasons over 100 this season. The offense with Kp can not feed 2 wr and a te
Lizard was the 2nd most targeted wr for tge jets and he didn’t crack 50. Their te was the 2nd most targeted player

The difference is Wilson plays in literally the worst offense in the last 25 years and still can put up 100 yard games.

You keep dancing around the obvious and we both know why so I’m not playing that game.

Find me even a single #1 WR in the last 30 years that has gone 36 games without a 100 yard game.

This is historically bad and you keep trying to pretend it’s not real with stupid ass excuses.

And this is the dude who now owns the dubious record for most catches in a season without a TD.

A record that will stand for generations I suspect.

Now he’s working on another dubious record we will likely never see broken in our lifetimes.

How anyone thinks this guy is essential to this offense is mind boggling.

 

[WickedWrister]

I've already said my piece on DJ and while I do think it makes some sense to trade a non-essential impending UFA, it would hurt our depth in the short term and replacing him in the aggregate like some are suggesting is no small task. More inclined to just let him play out his contract and draft a WR this year and/or next. Unless the offer is too good to pass up.

Mentioned this site before, but one of my favorite tools during draft season is Grindingthemocks. Receives periodic updates up until the draft and it just got one yesterday. Top 50 prospects

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

The difference is Wilson plays in literally the worst offense in the last 25 years and still can put up 100 yard games.

You keep dancing around the obvious and we both know why so I’m not playing that game.

Find me even a single #1 WR in the last 30 years that has gone 36 games without a 100 yard game.

Find me just one.

This is historically bad and you keep trying to pretend it’s not real with stupid ass excuses.

Try not to waste keystrokes on this guy. He was trying to argue that DJ was just as good as Diggs

 

[Peat]

I've already said my piece on DJ and while I do think it makes some sense to trade a non-essential impending UFA, it would hurt our depth in the short term and replacing him in the aggregate like some are suggesting is no small task. More inclined to just let him play out his contract and draft a WR this year and/or next. Unless the offer is too good to pass up.

Mentioned this site before, but one of my favorite tools during draft season is Grindingthemocks. Receives periodic updates up until the draft and it just got one yesterday. Top 50 prospects

View attachment 830490

I agree it's a risk trying to replace him in the aggregate but

a) The more I look at his numbers with Pickett, the less of a risk it feels
b) What is lost if it goes wrong?

This is probably a lost season for the Steelers before it starts. Plan A is to rescue the career of a struggling prospect at QB. That's a low odds plan. Plan B involves hoping a high end backup is actually a starter. That plan also stinks. I'd totally get putting their best foot forward if they'd just had a great season, if we were talking starting a contention window, but that's real unlikely.

Right now, most times, the best outcome for the Steelers is they managed to plaster over the gaps on the OL/Secondary and are really truly just a QB away. Why not take the opportunity to hit the WR gap now rather than wait for it to develop?

Trying to do their best by Pickett? Good reason to think Pickett might want to see the back of him in his heart of hearts.
Trying to do their best by Johnson? Again, reason to think he might want out.
Trying to do their best the rest of the offence? Johnson's a better distraction on the field than who they probably pick up in the pass game, but he's not a great blocker for the rush game. Plus off field distraction. Harris made enough comments that you got to think that stuff matters to some of them.
Trying to do their best the next QB? Well, that involves re-upping him. Which maybe Khan does, and maybe he doesn't.

That's one of the things that gets me about this discussion. I see people shying away from the idea of trading him due to the risks of not adequately replacing him next season, but who here really believes the Steelers have a shot of doing anything worthy of note next season?


Also if Frazier is really outside of the top 50 prospects that'll be amazing but uh boy do I have my doubts about that one.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

Try not to waste keystrokes on this guy. He was trying to argue that DJ was just as good as Diggs

I said Diggs in Minnesota and DJ with Ben put up similar numbers Diggs didn’t really explode until he got with Allen

 

[WickedWrister]

I agree it's a risk trying to replace him in the aggregate but

a) The more I look at his numbers with Pickett, the less of a risk it feels
b) What is lost if it goes wrong?

This is probably a lost season for the Steelers before it starts. Plan A is to rescue the career of a struggling prospect at QB. That's a low odds plan. Plan B involves hoping a high end backup is actually a starter. That plan also stinks. I'd totally get putting their best foot forward if they'd just had a great season, if we were talking starting a contention window, but that's real unlikely.

Right now, most times, the best outcome for the Steelers is they managed to plaster over the gaps on the OL/Secondary and are really truly just a QB away. Why not take the opportunity to hit the WR gap now rather than wait for it to develop?

Trying to do their best by Pickett? Good reason to think Pickett might want to see the back of him in his heart of hearts.
Trying to do their best by Johnson? Again, reason to think he might want out.
Trying to do their best the rest of the offence? Johnson's a better distraction on the field than who they probably pick up in the pass game, but he's not a great blocker for the rush game. Plus off field distraction. Harris made enough comments that you got to think that stuff matters to some of them.
Trying to do their best the next QB? Well, that involves re-upping him. Which maybe Khan does, and maybe he doesn't.

Like pretty much every player, I guess it all depends on the trade compensation. I'm not mortally opposed to the idea of trading him. I just think it's unlikely we get the kind of return that fans would want. He's in the final year of his contract and has seen declining performance in some pretty key metrics. Like I don't know if we get more than a random day 3 pick.

If we let him walk next year we could also be due a compensatory pick, although I'm not sure exactly how high it would be. Ranges from as high as the late 3rd to the 7th. There's some formula based on salary, playing time, pro bowls and what caliber of FA's the Steelers sign in that same period. Something to consider.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

I agree it's a risk trying to replace him in the aggregate but

a) The more I look at his numbers with Pickett, the less of a risk it feels
b) What is lost if it goes wrong?

This is probably a lost season for the Steelers before it starts. Plan A is to rescue the career of a struggling prospect at QB. That's a low odds plan. Plan B involves hoping a high end backup is actually a starter. That plan also stinks. I'd totally get putting their best foot forward if they'd just had a great season, if we were talking starting a contention window, but that's real unlikely.

Right now, most times, the best outcome for the Steelers is they managed to plaster over the gaps on the OL/Secondary and are really truly just a QB away. Why not take the opportunity to hit the WR gap now rather than wait for it to develop?

Trying to do their best by Pickett? Good reason to think Pickett might want to see the back of him in his heart of hearts.
Trying to do their best by Johnson? Again, reason to think he might want out.
Trying to do their best the rest of the offence? Johnson's a better distraction on the field than who they probably pick up in the pass game, but he's not a great blocker for the rush game. Plus off field distraction. Harris made enough comments that you got to think that stuff matters to some of them.
Trying to do their best the next QB? Well, that involves re-upping him. Which maybe Khan does, and maybe he doesn't.

That's one of the things that gets me about this discussion. I see people shying away from the idea of trading him due to the risks of not adequately replacing him next season, but who here really believes the Steelers have a shot of doing anything worthy of note next season?


Also if Frazier is really outside of the top 50 prospects that'll be amazing but uh boy do I have my doubts about that one.

Ya this is what make me laugh every time I read someone freaking out about losing Johnson.

They have literally not won a playoff game since this dude came into the league, but losing him somehow dooms them to… not win a playoff game again?

 

[Peat]

Like pretty much every player, I guess it all depends on the trade compensation. I'm not mortally opposed to the idea of trading him. I just think it's unlikely we get the kind of return that fans would want. He's in the final year of his contract and has seen declining performance in some pretty key metrics. Like I don't know if we get more than a random day 3 pick.

If we let him walk next year we could also be due a compensatory pick, although I'm not sure exactly how high it would be. Ranges from as high as the late 3rd to the 7th. There's some formula based on salary, playing time, pro bowls and what caliber of FA's the Steelers sign in that same period. Something to consider.

Fair enough if you don't see getting more than a day 3 pick. If that's how it went I'd probably be against it. I'm 50-50 on what sort of return you could get. There's no doubting he has the talent to tear things up and it's not a strong WR free agency, particularly with Evans re-upping before it even begins. But every reason people can bring up for thinking its okay to let him go is obviously a reason for teams not to look at him.

I did consider the compensatory pick angle but I think there's a good chance the Steelers mightn't get there. The Steelers are getting 131m of cap space next off-season as things stand. I know they'll fill some of that with kicking the can down the road and extending guys like Harris/Freiermuth, but it feels like the Steelers might spend a lot that summer. Which, insofar as I understand it, likely torpedoes getting compensatory pciks hard.

 

[xlm34]

I’m guessing Poyer may have taken a step back or something, but in general it’s going to be so easy for the Steelers to find an upgrade at safety in free agency.

 

[WickedWrister]

Fair enough if you don't see getting more than a day 3 pick. If that's how it went I'd probably be against it. I'm 50-50 on what sort of return you could get. There's no doubting he has the talent to tear things up and it's not a strong WR free agency, particularly with Evans re-upping before it even begins. But every reason people can bring up for thinking its okay to let him go is obviously a reason for teams not to look at him.

I did consider the compensatory pick angle but I think there's a good chance the Steelers mightn't get there. The Steelers are getting 131m of cap space next off-season as things stand. I know they'll fill some of that with kicking the can down the road and extending guys like Harris/Freiermuth, but it feels like the Steelers might spend a lot that summer. Which, insofar as I understand it, likely torpedoes getting compensatory pciks hard.

I think it's too early to project right now. That figure looks huge because we only have 22 guys under contract for 2025, and I believe it's the differential in the caliber of FA's you sign vs. lose, not just raw spending. Like some guys qualify as CFA's (compensatory free agents) and other's don't. James Daniels is also a FA in 2025, not sure if he qualifies for us.

 

[WickedWrister]

I’m guessing Poyer may have taken a step back or something, but in general it’s going to be so easy for the Steelers to find an upgrade at safety in free agency.

Yeah, filling the holes we have at LB and S with FA's this year seems like a no brainer. I honestly like the way this draft and FA class seems to suit our biggest needs.

It's a shame we don't need a veteran RB this year. Saquon, Henry, Jacobs, Pollard, Ekeler, Swift etc are all available and aren't going to command much.

 

[WickedWrister]

Ya this is what make me laugh every time I read someone freaking out about losing Johnson.

They have literally not won a playoff game since this dude came into the league, but losing him somehow dooms them to… not win a playoff game again?

This got me thinking, Cam Heyward and Chris Boswell are the only players on our roster with playoff wins (as Steelers)?

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Ya this is what make me laugh every time I read someone freaking out about losing Johnson.

They have literally not won a playoff game since this dude came into the league, but losing him somehow dooms them to… not win a playoff game again?

I've said this before: DJ is a guy you do not "build around" or keep at all costs. He's not a franchise player. Move on if he's not happy here.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

This got me thinking, Cam Heyward and Chris Boswell are the only players on our roster with playoff wins (as Steelers)?

Seven years is a long ass time in sports.

Seven years ago Guentzel was in his rookie year and about to tie the rookie playoff scoring record, helping the Pens lift b2b cups.

Now he’s getting traded because Pens are finally facing the reality it’s been over for years.