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OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: Congrats to KC, but Kelce was the real winner winning Swift

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bigdaddyk88 said:
Wr is the mist dependent position in football AB did nothing without ben here
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He did nothing with Landry Jones, who wasn't even NFL caliber. But it was pretty clear what turned the Steelers into one of the NFL's best offenses- they were regularly in the bottom half until AB became elite.

AB was a top 5 WR of all time in his prime, Roethlisberger wasn't even a top 5 QB of his era.
 
WickedWrister said:
I agree to the extent that we need to be planning for the future at WR anyway given DJ's UFA status and ARob probably getting released soon.

We are pretty good at drafting WR even if I do think a lot of that was having a franchise QB capable of elevating his receivers. Pickens looking like a bonafide stud with poor QB play disproves that a little though.

Don't fact check me, but I also think we've spent more Day 1 and 2 picks on WR than any other team in the league over the last 15 odd years. So while we do have a good hit rate at the position, we are also just absolutely addicted to drafting them lol.

Speaking of, latest mock has us taking Xavier Worthy out of Texas in the 2nd.



steelersdepot.com

Mock Draft Monday – Pittsburgh Steelers 2024 Mock Draft: February 26

The Pittsburgh Steelers’ season is in the books following their first-round exit in the playoffs. The team has transitioned to the offseason where the pre-draft process ramps up as Pittsburgh looks to bolster its roster in hopes of having a better opportunity to compete in the postseason next...
steelersdepot.com steelersdepot.com
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The thing with drafting WRs is that we should be leveraging the ability to find them to create a way to recuperate picks for them. Once guys get to DJ's contract/age/experience, they should be flipping them.

Mr Jiggyfly said:
The Bengals aren’t the Steelers.

The Steelers let Plex walk right after Ben’s rookie season, because Ward was already getting paid.

There is literally zero history to show they will pay two WR big long term contracts concurrently in the FA era.

Even going back to Thigpen, they let him walk even though he was a pro bowl receiver coming off the best season for a Steelers WR in over a decade.

He never got that rare third long term deal.

Only two guys in 31 years of the modern free agency era have gotten those deals from the Steelers.

Again, why is DJ so special that he deserves it?

Must be his rare ability to go 30+ games without a 100 yard game.
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The Mike Wallace - AB situation. Wallace was offered money. He said no. Literally offered the same contract to AB. Thank God Wallace rejected their offer.
 
I am curious how open they are to keeping Broderick on the right side and if that is something they are cool with long term. This draft I believe it's going to be easier to find a LT than a really good right. If we want a RT, we may have to move up depending how they start falling. Massive tackle prospects in this draft. Multiples 6'5+ with insane measurable. This is the biggest class of tackles I can remember.

MrBrightside said:
Spending this much time discussing how well an outside WR blocks in the run game rather than the 1203 more important things a WR does is something else. Just play Myles Boykin then.
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This is actualy prime post-season/pre-draft discussion :laugh:
 
bigdaddyk88 said:
The article states colbert didn’t rule out bringing plex back and wilson was going ti colpete with EL
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That was GM talk, not reality. You know how I’m so sure, Ward was due up for an extension that off-season as well.

If they wanted Plex back, they would have signed him and let Ward walk.

www.espn.com

Steelers' Ward to report to camp; new deal expected

Hines Ward is reporting to camp and ending his holdout at the urging of head coach Bill Cowher, sources close to the team and player told ESPN's Chris Mortensen.
www.espn.com www.espn.com

Ward signed that rare long third term deal in Sept 05.

So again do all the math here and Plex is full of shit.

Zero chance both guys would have been signed to 25m plus deals concurrently back then.
 
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bambamcam4ever said:
He did nothing with Landry Jones, who wasn't even NFL caliber. But it was pretty clear what turned the Steelers into one of the NFL's best offenses- they were regularly in the bottom half until AB became elite.

AB was a top 5 WR of all time in his prime, Roethlisberger wasn't even a top 5 QB of his era.
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Hate the guy all you want, but the bolded is simply not true.

After 2 all-time greats (Brady/Manning), and then another HoFer in Brees, he's solidly in the next two by almost any metric you can think of except dismissed allegations.
 
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JTG said:
I am curious how open they are to keeping Broderick on the right side and if that is something they are cool with long term. This draft I believe it's going to be easier to find a LT than a really good right. If we want a RT, we may have to move up depending how they start falling. Massive tackle prospects in this draft. Multiples 6'5+ with insane measurable. This is the biggest class of tackles I can remember.
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Everything Tomlin and the beat reporters so far have said about this points to yes.

Which really annoys me as the potential for this to backfire is huge. Dotson mk2 would suck.

One thing I would point out is that Smith's OL have been stupidly athletic. Obviously some of that is coincidence as he didn't get to pick players he inherited, but that's been part of what makes the system go. How many of the OL prospects aren't just massive, but also very quick, remains to be seen.
 
Peat said:
Everything Tomlin and the beat reporters so far have said about this points to yes.

Which really annoys me as the potential for this to backfire is huge. Dotson mk2 would suck.

One thing I would point out is that Smith's OL have been stupidly athletic. Obviously some of that is coincidence as he didn't get to pick players he inherited, but that's been part of what makes the system go. How many of the OL prospects aren't just massive, but also very quick, remains to be seen.
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Well this kind of gets tied into the Najee convo

Arthur Smith leads the world in outside zone runs the last few years.

Najee's worst skill is running outside the tackles.

The OL is coached by someone who teaches a completely different mode of blocking scheme/technique and the OL talent is 3/5 guys who don't fit the new scheme.

Go figure.
 
Buddy Bizarre said:
Well this kind of gets tied into the Najee convo

Arthur Smith leads the world in outside zone runs the last few years.

Najee's worst skill is running outside the tackles.

The OL is coached by someone who teaches a completely different mode of blocking scheme/technique and the OL talent is 3/5 guys who don't fit the new scheme.

Go figure.
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Harris' stats were strongest in outside zone tho - Comparing Steelers Run Scheme With Arthur Smith's In Tennessee

To me the fit lots stronger than you're saying.
 
I think the tough thing when evaluating where Ben ranks among QBs of his era is what is his "era"? Does Mahomes count as well?

I think Brees, Manning, Rodgers and Brady are all inarguable and were definitely a part of Ben's era. After that, I don't particularly see anyone who has a better case for #5 than Ben. But if you start including anyone who played in the same years as Ben, then Mahomes would clearly rank above him as well.
 
MrBrightside said:
I mean, there's just no quantifiable argument that this is true.
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Quantifiably Rivers had slightly better career stats, weird comment to make. But from watching them play he was more accurate and had better anticipation. And his stats aren't juiced from having AB to mask his decline.

But it's odd how people are claiming Roethlisberger was a clear top 5 QB when he was 5th at very best, probably a bit below.
 
Empoleon8771 said:
I think the tough thing when evaluating where Ben ranks among QBs of his era is what is his "era"? Does Mahomes count as well?

I think Brees, Manning, Rodgers and Brady are all inarguable and were definitely a part of Ben's era. After that, I don't particularly see anyone who has a better case for #5 than Ben. But if you start including anyone who played in the same years as Ben, then Mahomes would clearly rank above him as well.
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Mahomes is a different era to me. The guys you list only had a couple of years overlap him when they were near their peaks.
 
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Peat said:
Mahomes is a different era to me. The guys you list only had a couple of years overlap him when they were near their peaks.
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Yeah I think this is the correct take. But yeah, Ben comes in firmly at #5 overall. I don't see an argument for him higher than that, nor do I see an argument for anyone else over him for the #5 spot.

I think if you'd extend the era in either way, you could put Farve over Ben if you went earlier or Mahomes over Ben if you went later. But I think both of those are stretching what "era" means.
 
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bambamcam4ever said:
Quantifiably Rivers had slightly better career stats, weird comment to make. But from watching them play he was more accurate and had better anticipation. And his stats aren't juiced from having AB to mask his decline.

But it's odd how people are claiming Roethlisberger was a clear top 5 QB when he was 5th at very best, probably a bit below.
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Their stats are basically the same.

www.behindthesteelcurtain.com

Crunching the Numbers: Comparing two remaining quarterbacks from the class of 2004

There are only a handful players who were selected in 2004 remaining in the NFL.
www.behindthesteelcurtain.com www.behindthesteelcurtain.com

Add in the postseason difference, this isn't hard.
 
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