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The New and really Improved , Kyle Dubas Discussion Thread

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zeke said:
You agree that getting 105pts in 56gms would be pretty much impossible, correct

So why are you pretendjng that Kyle not beating 105pts last year in a 56gm schedule is a legitimate criticism?
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I'm sensing some reading comprehension issues here.

Not sure I want another visit to the Zeke Vortex today, but.......saying

egd27 said:
When they actually achieve more than 105 points over an 82 game season while playing the full NHL then they will have improved on their best season ever.

Trying to use "pace" in a 56 game season against the same 6 teams over and over again is not even remotely the same.
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is not criticizing "Kyle" for not beating 105pts last year in a 56gm schedule.

How did you possibly come to think that was what was being said?
 
egd27 said:
I'm sensing some reading comprehension issues here.

Not sure I want another visit to the Zeke Vortex today, but.......saying

is not criticizing "Kyle" for not beating 105pts last year in a 56gm schedule.

How did you possibly come to think that was what was being said?
Click to expand...

You are tho.

You are claiming Dubas hasn't improved the team because he hasnt beaten 105pts. That's a criticism.

Yet you admit that it's impossible to beat 105pts in a 56gm season.
 
Pookie said:
for the record, I’m not discounting them at all.

what I am asking is whether there is any proof that Dubas can either use them effectively or build a team that can.

so far, no one can answer that to the affirmative.

can you?
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in theory analytics sound good but in reality it doesn't work especially for the leafs because playoff hockey is different from season hockey. We don't have enough sample size to build great analytics so the only way to do it is to create a "look-alike" audience and build models around that which is bs anyways.
 
egd27 said:
Yes, it would have.

Hopefully they get a full 82 game season in and can have a legitimate shot at exceeding 105 points.
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"Shot at...."??
Not crushing that record this year will be seen as extremely disappointing I would think.
 
Does it matters if Dubas got the Leafs to 115pts in the regular season and yet another 1st round exits?
If Dubas got the Leafs to 98pts in the regular season and Leafs loss in the 2nd round, he will instantly become the best Leafs GM since Quinn. No questions asked.
I understand the discussions if Dubas is no longer the GM but for crying our loud, Dubas is still the GM and his legacy will change the moment Leafs win a round.
 
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m1ker said:
in theory analytics sound good but in reality it doesn't work especially for the leafs because playoff hockey is different from season hockey. We don't have enough sample size to build great analytics so the only way to do it is to create a "look-alike" audience and build models around that which is bs anyways.
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But if the excuse is always goaltending being a huge factor to determine Win or Lose, then why bother.
To me it is like showing stats to clients,when under performing, to prove that I did the work.....but if I am making money for my clients, I only show them the balance. Results speak louder than any stats. So far, the Leafs are not getting playoffs results.
 
The CyNick said:
But they were paid by the inexperienced GM like they were elite of the elite. Unfortunate franchise altering mistake.
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So you are saying those players are not worthy of their contracts, and/or they would be better players if they were paid less?

Would you trade one of the tradeable double digits (Matthews/marner) for a lessor player making 3 million less?
 
ULF_55 said:
So you are saying those players are not worthy of their contracts, and/or they would be better players if they were paid less?

Would you trade one of the tradeable double digits (Matthews/marner) for a lessor player making 3 million less?
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I know you know this, but the idea is trading marner for a similar player making 3 million less. Because he is at least 3 million overpaid. Then that 3m can go to improving the team.

but I'm not saying anything you don't already know and understand.
 
Canadian Finn said:
I know you know this, but the idea is trading marner for a similar player making 3 million less. Because he is at least 3 million overpaid. Then that 3m can go to improving the team.

but I'm not saying anything you don't already know and understand.
Click to expand...

Why would another team trade you a marner equivalent making 3 million less?

A team could realistically trade you a lessor player making less and perhaps throw in some other asset(s).
 
Man these conversations have really gone off the rails. Your stupid, no your stupid is what every thread is turning in to. Painful to read. Time for a break.
 
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zeke said:
You are tho.

You are claiming Dubas hasn't improved the team because he hasnt beaten 105pts. That's a criticism.

Yet you admit that it's impossible to beat 105pts in a 56gm season.
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No Zeke I'm stating that no team has exceeded the 105 point season.

It may be a criticism to your sensitive nature when it comes to Dubas, to a rational person it's just a fact.

And of course the team wasn't going beat 105 in 56 games, just another in a long line of examples of you trying to misrepresent a comment.
 
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zeke said:
You are tho.

You are claiming Dubas hasn't improved the team because he hasnt beaten 105pts. That's a criticism.

Yet you admit that it's impossible to beat 105pts in a 56gm season.
Click to expand...
You leave out the part where they didn't play 3/4 of the league.
 
ULF_55 said:
So you are saying those players are not worthy of their contracts, and/or they would be better players if they were paid less?

Would you trade one of the tradeable double digits (Matthews/marner) for a lessor player making 3 million less?
Click to expand...

I wouldn't be in this position, so it's moot.

But yes, I would trade anyone on this team. The scenario you laid out is pointless because it would depend on the player. I would trade both for MacKinnon.
 
egd27 said:
You're expecting a 105 + point season ?
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Shouldn't everyone expect that as a minimum now that Dubas has removed the stench of Lou's incompetence ?
It is his team now right? No more blaming Lou.
 
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m1ker said:
in theory analytics sound good but in reality it doesn't work especially for the leafs because playoff hockey is different from season hockey. We don't have enough sample size to build great analytics so the only way to do it is to create a "look-alike" audience and build models around that which is bs anyways.
Click to expand...

Begs the question then, why invest in it?

And if you do, how do you know we are maximizing the return?

Dubas has won as many playoff rounds as John Ferguson Jr did.

Or if you want to compare playoff qualifying teams.... we have a much more expensive coaching and analytic infrastructure with the same result as a Phil Kessel and Vesa Toskala led group.
 
egd27 said:
When they actually achieve more than 105 points over an 82 game season while playing the full NHL then they will have improved on their best season ever.

Trying to use "pace" in a 56 game season against the same 6 teams over and over again is not even remotely the same.

But at least you're consistent.
Click to expand...

Though it's not as if Dubas' had any choice in that matter. His team could only perform within the structures set by the league - which one season involved limiting the number of GP and the other both GP and opponents. Seems unfair to dismiss results completely due to things beyond the control of the team.
 
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Wait. what's going on in here?

Are we gonna start talking about how Matthews got lucky he won the Rocket with his regression from 47 to 41 goals?
This is all jokes in here right?
 
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