Player Discussion: The Elvis Thread

[Cyclones Rock]

Cleveland is exactly where he needs to go though.

Kalamazoo (ECHL) would probably be more appropriate.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

the options with elvis are:

1. ride it out, hope that a better team in front of him + an offseason to reset can turn it around
2. find a new goaltending coach on top of the things in option #1
3. do #1 or #2, but buy him out in 2ish years if that doesn't work
4. find a trade partner

i don't think the jackets are an "attach an asset to an underperforming player and take back a different bad contract just to move him" kind of organization. i also doubt they'd buy out elvis without seeing if he can bounce back.

that said, i wouldn't rule out a trade if another organization out there believes they can fix him. i wouldn't pay with assets to get him off the books at this point, nor would i want to do a bad goalie/bad contract swap.

 

[thebus88]

Oof. Who could have seen this coming?

Everyone except bus I think.

Things are a lot different if 1 or 2 of those 3 post shots that beat him clean go in, in the 1st period.

He’s still all over the place and gets lucky more often than not. It’s still ridiculously early into the year and his career.

All the things said about Elvis now, we’re said about Steve Mason.

Korpisalo is the better goalie at blocking pucks.

One of these days you're going to have to tell us you're exact relation to Korpi or in what way Elvis ran over your dog.

Hitting the post = being in a position so perfect the shooter can only hit iron

Some some beauty’s to look back on before ya’ll turned on him

 

[DarkandStormy]

(9/21/21)




Not as predictable as what Elvis’ contract and career would look like in the near future….



Really miss the condescending “agent” or “family” comments. It’s almost as if I know more about hockey than essentially all of you.


Guess I should have said a year or 2. Ahead of my time on the 5 goal Merzlikins
jokes though, eh??

Which brings us to the response I got and to current day…..and to current posts…

FROM

TO


hahahahahahaha….Guess you answered your own question DS!!


You’ve clearly been wrong about plenty regarding Elvis.

You have connections within the team??

Tell them they’re idiots!!

After being wrong for 3 seasons, you're now taking a victory lap after 24 and 22 starts, respectively, this season in which Korpisalo is barely a league average goalie. Congrats.

Korpisalo could have tested the market last summer as a UFA and opted to take a 1 year, $1.3m deal (best he would have gotten). Again, weird time to take a victory lap but that's your style I guess.

 

[thebus88]

Why are you even here? Why do you bother with such hoi polloi? It must be such a burden.

Why are you here?? You guys might hate to hear it, but, I live in a state bordering Ohio, and am quite ingrained in the “hockey community” in an area that has a legit history of hockey in the area, and NOBODY GIVES A SHIT OR EVER talks about the Columbus Blue Jackets. I’m fully confident in the idea that I am literally the biggest actual CBJ fan in the state of Michigan, and I’d argue that other than people with family/personal ties to current/past players, I may possibly be the only actual “CBJ fan” in the entire state. That’s why.

Why does it bother you so much that I express my knowledge for the game of hockey, ON A HOCKEY MESSAGE BOARD??

It’s all compounded by the “groupthink gang” that comes together during different times against different people regarding certain subjects. I was a CLEAR target regarding all the Elvis talk in the past, and much of my tone/delivery of my opinions that people didn’t like, was simply a RESPONSE to people attempting to literally mock what I, and ANYBODY without jaded glasses could see, on a game by game basis, even when he was putting up the shutouts.

I was flat out told I was a TROLL and WRONG. Was I??

 

[Xoggz22]

(9/21/21)




Not as predictable as what Elvis’ contract and career would look like in the near future….



Really miss the condescending “agent” or “family” comments. It’s almost as if I know more about hockey than essentially all of you.


Guess I should have said a year or 2. Ahead of my time on the 5 goal Merzlikins
jokes though, eh??

Which brings us to the response I got and to current day…..and to current posts…

FROM

TO


hahahahahahaha….Guess you answered your own question DS!!


You’ve clearly been wrong about plenty regarding Elvis.

You have connections within the team??

Tell them they’re idiots!!

This is exactly why no one takes you seriously or interacts in any sort of constructive way. You want respect? Earn it by communicating as an adult and not a 12 year old with the nananananana attitude. Self serving gets you no where.

 

[thebus88]

After being wrong for 3 seasons, you're now taking a victory lap after 24 and 22 starts, respectively, this season in which Korpisalo is barely a league average goalie. Congrats.

Korpisalo could have tested the market last summer as a UFA and opted to take a 1 year, $1.3m deal (best he would have gotten). Again, weird time to take a victory lap but that's your style I guess.

I’m not up and down on players so drastically like a lot of you guys are around here. I also don’t live and die by the stats. The ability or quality of the players don’t change anywhere near as drastically as many of you guys like to believe and express, whether it’s year to year, month to month, game to game, or period to period. I focus on the BIG PICTURE and the FULL body of work that I have seen.

This idea that Elvis was the better goalie in 19-20 is BOGUS. I don’t care about the SV% or the GAA, or the shutouts that just made his statistics seem better than his actual play. You and others do/did. Korpisalo had a better wins/loss record, played in more regular season games, AND STARTED AND WON A PLAYOFF SERIES!!

He played in 55 games after that, before getting hip surgery, that we have no idea how long was bothering him.

 

[Fro]

This is exactly why no one takes you seriously or interacts in any sort of constructive way. You want respect? Earn it by communicating as an adult and not a 12 year old with the nananananana attitude. Self serving gets you no where.

So much this.

Wait

SO much "this"

 

[thebus88]

This is exactly why no one takes you seriously or interacts in any sort of constructive way. You want respect? Earn it by communicating as an adult and not a 12 year old with the nananananana attitude. Self serving gets you no where.

I talk serious on here plenty and go into detail into ACTUAL hockey “analysis” just as much as anybody else.

I also joke or use humor in here just as much. Some people here have senses of humor and get where I’m coming from with most things, sorry if you others don’t like my delivery. What I’m not sorry for is the “I told you so” aspect of this, AS YOU GUYS WOULD BE DOING (AND DID) THE SAME THING if the roles were reversed.

 

[thebus88]

This is exactly why no one takes you seriously or interacts in any sort of constructive way. You want respect? Earn it by communicating as an adult and not a 12 year old with the nananananana attitude. Self serving gets you no where.

And the reason I don’t take many of you guys seriously is because you have expressed the idea that Elvis Merzlikins is a great goalie.

So we’re even.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Why are you here?? You guys might hate to hear it, but, I live in a state bordering Ohio, and am quite ingrained in the “hockey community” in an area that has a legit history of hockey in the area, and NOBODY GIVES A SHIT OR EVER talks about the Columbus Blue Jackets. I’m fully confident in the idea that I am literally the biggest actual CBJ fan in the state of Michigan, and I’d argue that other than people with family/personal ties to current/past players, I may possibly be the only actual “CBJ fan” in the entire state. That’s why.

Why does it bother you so much that I express my knowledge for the game of hockey, ON A HOCKEY MESSAGE BOARD??

It’s all compounded by the “groupthink gang” that comes together during different times against different people regarding certain subjects. I was a CLEAR target regarding all the Elvis talk in the past, and much of my tone/delivery of my opinions that people didn’t like, was simply a RESPONSE to people attempting to literally mock what I, and ANYBODY without jaded glasses could see, on a game by game basis, even when he was putting up the shutouts.

I was flat out told I was a TROLL and WRONG. Was I??

I’m not bothered by anything. I’m just wondering why you would choose to participate in a group discussion with people whose opinions/thoughts/discussions are so bad/wrong/flawed. What is the joy for you in suffering through page after page of know-nothing posts by know-nothing posters?

 

[majormajor]

Now we know what it's like when the metaphorical blind squirrel thinks he's good at finding nuts.

 

[Xoggz22]

And the reason I don’t take many of you guys seriously is because you have expressed the idea that Elvis Merzlikins is a great goalie.

So we’re even.

It's unfortunate that only you get your "humor" and I don't care how much you feel you are "right", the "I told you so" is simply never going to get you very far. Certainly not in my circles and I can disagree with anyone on here and still feel I try to hold a constructive discussion about it.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

I’m fully confident in the idea that I am literally the biggest actual CBJ fan in the state of Michigan, and I’d argue that other than people with family/personal ties to current/past players, I may possibly be the only actual “CBJ fan” in the entire state. That’s why.

you're definitely not the only CBJ fan in the entire state, lol. cmon man.

Why does it bother you so much that I express my knowledge for the game of hockey, ON A HOCKEY MESSAGE BOARD??

I was flat out told I was a TROLL and WRONG. Was I??

mixing in random all-caps words and double question marks in a message saying you're not a troll is, independent of your actual message, going to come across as trolling.

This idea that Elvis was the better goalie in 19-20 is BOGUS. I don’t care about the SV% or the GAA, or the shutouts that just made his statistics seem better than his actual play.

it's one thing to say that goalie stats are prone to larger variance and that short sample sizes can be heavily skewed.

it's another to say "the idea that player A was better than player B is bogus because i'm dismissing all the empirical results saying that player A was better"

I talk serious on here plenty and go into detail into ACTUAL hockey “analysis” just as much as anybody else.

I also joke or use humor in here just as much.

people joke on here all the time. i don't think most of those people would say that their humor constantly creates conflict. perhaps it's less about everyone else's sensibilities and more about your own tact.

it's like that saying: you run into a jerk in the morning, you ran into a jerk. run into jerks all day? well… you know the rest.

 

[thebus88]

I’m not bothered by anything. I’m just wondering why you would choose to participate in a group discussion with people whose opinions/thoughts/discussions are so bad/wrong/flawed. What is the joy for you in suffering through page after page of know-nothing posts by know-nothing posters?

When I (or anybody else using the term) say “you people”, it’s always directed to a distinct/select group of people who feel a certain way I disagree with, NOT ALL people. Unfortunately, we have people who will FOCUS on the most unimportant aspects of posts, or misrepresent/misinterpret them, while passing over or ignoring all the actual substance or points that people are attempting to make, while at the same time attempting to discredit said opinions by they themselves focusing on the wrong things.

Plenty of people have felt the same way I have about many different things, Elvis included. It’s not my place to “lump” them in with me and how I like to express my opinions or arguments. And yes, many times people are reluctant to speak out with “unpopular” opinions for all types of different reasons, and this thread is a perfect example. Handful of people almost reluctantly expressing hesitancy or questioning the Elvis extension when it occurred.

 

[EspenK]

So here are the alternatives:

1)Keep him and hope he regains his form.
2)Trade him and take the least bad return offered.
3)Waive him and send him to Cleveland to see if he can regain form.(or hope some team claims him)
4)Buy him out.

Anyway you objectively look at this mess there are no real good alternatives.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

When I (or anybody else using the term) say “you people”, it’s always directed to a distinct/select group of people who feel a certain way I disagree with, NOT ALL people.

You posted this:

“It’s almost as if I know more about hockey than essentially all of you.”

You’re saying now that I’ve misinterpreted that? Ok.

You think people are focusing on the “wrong parts” of your posts? Try only posting the “right parts.”

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

So here are the alternatives:

1)Keep him and hope he regains his form.
2)Trade him and take the least bad return offered.
3)Waive him and send him to Cleveland to see if he can regain form.(or hope some team claims him)
4)Buy him out.

Anyway you objectively look at this mess there are no real good alternatives.

You’re talking about Elvis here?

 

[thebus88]

you're definitely not the only CBJ fan in the entire state, lol. cmon man.


mixing in random all-caps words and double question marks in a message saying you're not a troll is, independent of your actual message, going to come across as trolling.


it's one thing to say that goalie stats are prone to larger variance and that short sample sizes can be heavily skewed.

it's another to say "the idea that player A was better than player B is bogus because i'm dismissing all the empirical results saying that player A was better"


people joke on here all the time. i don't think most of those people would say that their humor constantly creates conflict. perhaps it's less about everyone else's sensibilities and more about your own tact.

it's like that saying: you run into a jerk in the morning, you ran into a jerk. run into jerks all day? well… you know the rest.

Only other thing I should add is a connection to Ohio/Columbus in some way. Other than being a “transplant” from Ohio or a personal connection to a player or worker, idk dude. The point I was trying to make, based on a question posed to me, is that nobody within 100 miles of me is talking CBJ hockey.

Double question marks and me capitalizing words for humor or emphasis should have no bearing on taking anything in any sort of way. Really though, double question marks??

That’s not to say I haven’t “trolled” for reactions before (as almost everyone else does in their own way), but, what I’m adamantly pushing against, and what did occur, is that saying Korpisalo was better than Elvis, in itself, was judged and looked at as “trolling” because of what the “numbers” and “statistics” were, and that is ridiculous.

Why is (or was) it “ok” to say Elvis was a better goalie, yet, I’m all these terrible things for saying Korpisalo is (and has always been) the better goalie??

 

[cbjthrowaway]

So here are the alternatives:

1)Keep him and hope he regains his form.
2)Trade him and take the least bad return offered.
3)Waive him and send him to Cleveland to see if he can regain form.(or hope some team claims him)
4)Buy him out.

Anyway you objectively look at this mess there are no real good alternatives.

worth noting that option #1 here:
- doesn't prevent a future buyout; in fact, makes it more favorable
- could help him regain enough value to be traded
- could include a change in goaltending coach + a better team in front of him

going with option 1 (for the time being) makes options 2 and 4 more feasible down the road if option 1 itself doesn't work out. and this org would never pay a guy $5m to play in the minors.

 

[CBJx614]

worth noting that option #1 here:
- doesn't prevent a future buyout; in fact, makes it more favorable
- could help him regain enough value to be traded
- could include a change in goaltending coach + a better team in front of him

going with option 1 (for the time being) makes options 2 and 4 more feasible down the road if option 1 itself doesn't work out. and this org would never pay a guy $5m to play in the minors.

Our last buyout worked so well

Sucks paying someone to not be here that would actually help our current roster

 

[thebus88]

You posted this:

“It’s almost as if I know more about hockey than essentially all of you.”

You’re saying now that I’ve misinterpreted that? Ok.

You think people are focusing on the “wrong parts” of your posts? Try only posting the “right parts.”

“Essentially”. Essentially gives me an out, no?? Semantics again. Unimportant.

Let’s think though, what was that “know more about hockey” comment a response to??

Oh that’s right, a comment about “Korpi’s agent”, a personal attack (that was parroted) referencing me. Why those are allowed, still not sure, jokes and humor right??

I warned people this would happen, and people doubled down thinking it wouldn’t. You guys sure can dish it out, but, can’t take it back.

 

[thebus88]

You’re talking about Elvis here?

 

[cbjthrowaway]

Double question marks and me capitalizing words for humor or emphasis should have no bearing on taking anything in any sort of way. Really though, double question marks??

That’s not to say I haven’t “trolled” for reactions before (as almost everyone else does in their own way), but, what I’m adamantly pushing against, and what did occur, is that saying Korpisalo was better than Elvis, in itself, was judged and looked at as “trolling” because of what the “numbers” and “statistics” were, and that is ridiculous.

so, to be clear:
1. you've trolled before
2. you're using troll vernacular/style in earnest posts 'for humor or emphasis'

…this is an internet message board. doing those things will be read as trolling 100 times out of 100. that's just the reality of it.

Why is (or was) it “ok” to say Elvis was a better goalie, yet, I’m all these terrible things for saying Korpisalo is (and has always been) the better goalie??

there's nothing wrong with saying that you prefer one player to another. there's really no 'right' or 'wrong' when it comes to vibes/feelings, you know?

but elvis has been, prior to this season, the better goalie by any objective measure. that doesn't mean he's necessarily a more talented goalie (or better investment as a hockey asset).

	Elvis (2019-22)	Korpi (2018-22)
GP	120	119
Record	48-44-20	45-43-15
GAA	2.88	3.14
SV%	.913	.897
GSAA	+18.8	-38.7

i get that korpi's injury has played a role there. i don't think it's unreasonable to point that out and, as you said, say that players don't change much year-over-year, but circumstances do.

on that note, though, elvis was a very good goalie in 19-20 and 20-21. since then, he experienced a massive loss, had some injuries on top of that, has the added pressure of his contract and became a father. does he not get the same benefit of the doubt that korpi did with the hip injury?

i don't think it's wrong to say that you feel that he doesn't. but it's also reasonable to think that elvis can potentially turn it around, or that he was, at the time, the right goalie to invest in.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

Our last buyout worked so well

Sucks paying someone to not be here that would actually help our current roster

the wennberg buyout is generally fine since he was under 26. in hindsight, he'd be kind of a perfect fit for this roster (as flawed as he is) as a pass-first, responsible center.

last one before that was, what, scott hartnell? also largely fine, although he did retire the following year.

an elvis buyout wouldn't be ideal – i don't think they'd actively pursue it – but it is an out if they think that he needs to go and find that the price to move him in a trade is too high. like if a team says "give us a first to take on elvis's deal" – there's a certain point where losing the first doesn't sting as much as the future cap space lost to the buyout, but neither option is ideal.

my main point is that, by keeping him around, they increase the likelihood that he either turns it around (and either sticks on the roster or becomes a positive trade asset), and regardless of whether or not he does, the buyout math eventually becomes less painful either way.