Roster Building XX: How Many Patents Does Your GM Have?

[Svechhammer]

I still have to wonder if we aren't big game hunting right now. Tkachuk? That would offset the loss of Guentzel and Necas.

Tkachuk - Aho - Jarvis
Svech - Kuzy - Marchessault

That could be a potent top 6

about Marchy....

https://x.com/i/web/status/1799045535149821994

But yeah if we end up with Brady Tkachuk, that makes what is going on ok, but barring that, I'd rather just pay Guentzel

 

[Brock Anton]

Wait for years to land a “big fish”, finally get one, then refuse to give out the contract needed to keep them.

Can’t wait to see us finish runner-up for whichever big name ends up on the market in an attempt to replace Guentzel.

 

[Daeavorn]

In order to get Jake to sign here we're going to have to pay him comparable to somebody on a bad team that will pay him a lot more than we will.

Also, Jake has to want to sign here. He can say whatever he wants to the media but we still don't know what's going on in his mind.

I also agree with BBA. Jake didn't help us get any farther than we got last year.

I do not think he's the be all end all that makes our team great and will get us over the hump.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

FUS and Jarvis taking a step will save the offense.

I'm worried about the d. They're effectively losing 3 top 4 defensemen with Burns being the oldest player in the League.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Weird take given how Jake Guentzel has a cup and scores like a top five player in the playoffs since he has entered the league..

View attachment 880289

You misunderstand my point.

This is not a knock on Jake, it's a statement of how the team is currently configured. We don't have and elite talent like Crosby, Malkin, Kucherov, McKinnon, McDavid.

We don't have the size and physicality of of a team like Vegas or even Florida.

Our PP has failed in the playoffs many years now, including this one.

Of course any team can use a player like Jake Guentzel, but my point is that with the top 6 already being small and/or more perimeter players, is it the right make-up overall?

Now, if the team keeps Jake and makes other changes to adds skill and size to the top 6 on top of that, that's another story.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

This year we lost because we had to play the worst defensive player in the league instead of Pesce and the resulting promoted play of what should have been our 3rd line left our goalie on an island far too often, which was further complicated because he turned into a sieve. On top of that, Burns turned into the slow 40 year old player we were worried would show its head and made things difficult for even out top defensive pair. For the first time in a long time, goal scoring was NOT the reason we bowed out. Yes, the PP was a mess, but its been a mess for a very long time, through a variety of players who have success on it elsewhere to the point where you have to admit its due to a problem with the system and not the players.

Our NET PP% was 13.9%. The worst of any team that made it to the 2nd round. Not being able to make teams pay with a man advantage was a problem. The "system" wasn't telling players to stand around and not go to the net (Coaches said it publicly).

I'm not saying the system is great, but the same system that had the 2nd best PP% in the NHL over 82 games suddenly didn't stop working. The players on the ice own the biggest piece of that.

Guentzel leaving puts goal scoring back at the top of our needs going forward. Simply put, we don't have enough of it, especially when defenses tighten up in the playoffs and we aren't allowed the open space to work that we are used to in the regular season (looking at you, Necas). Guentzel fixed a lot of those issues, and its a serious problem for us if he leaves.

Goals in the playoffs this year:
Jarvis: 5
Aho: 4
Necas: 4 (2 EN)
Guentzel: 4 (1 EN)
Noesen: 4
Kuznetsov: 4

Like I said, I'd love to keep Guentzel, but understand if the team wants to go in a different direction.

 

[Unsustainable]

Maybe they are considering getting bigger and more physical vs smaller and skilled.

 

[chaz4hockey]

I don't get some of the takes re: Guentzel. This team didn't go as far WITH Guentzel this year than they did without Guetnzel last year. It wasn't his fault or anything, just that it didn't get us over the hump. I'd love to keep him though, as adding more talent is always a great thing, but it has to be more than just Jake.

Maybe the team is looking at it like "We had a bunch of talented, but small guys/guys who play small/play on the perimeter" who don't get it done in the playoff (Aho, Jarvis, Necas, TT) so Guentzel adds more of that. Maybe they think the team needs to go in a different direction?

They purposely went after guys with more size/guys that go to the dirty areas) the last few years (Tkachuk, Meier, Marchment, and even Bunting, who didn't work out). Unfortunately, those guys aren't always easy to acquire.

Fair points but I’d suggest TY versus LY’s result comes down to 3 key items:
1) opponent (Rangers much better than Jersey…Canes were lucky to play Devils LY),
2) Burns significant decline (not only defensively but he was awful on the PP with shots ending up in Jersey or Va most of the time),
3) Freddie’s play deteriorating.

Even ignoring the first two, if we had LY’s Freddie we get to the Conference Finals with a better D with Pesce back.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

The problem with the idea that we'll "go for someone else" is how we're going to acquire them.

Are we going to pay the big bucks that the team never pays? Or trade for them using the prospects that we either no longer have (due to the Guentzel trade) or aren't willing to give up?

 

[chaz4hockey]

In order to get Jake to sign here we're going to have to pay him comparable to somebody on a bad team that will pay him a lot more than we will.

Also, Jake has to want to sign here. He can say whatever he wants to the media but we still don't know what's going on in his mind.

I also agree with BBA. Jake didn't help us get any farther than we got last year.

I do not think he's the be all end all that makes our team great and will get us over the hump.

FWIW: I think Jake is smart enough to realize that even with a discount he will still get big $/life changing money . That will be a much better situation than what happened to Columbus’ big free agent signing who took the most $$$. Add to it that the Triangle is a great place for a family and it would be a no brainer for me.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Fair points but I’d suggest TY versus LY’s result comes down to 3 key items:
1) opponent (Rangers much better than Jersey…Canes were lucky to play Devils LY),
2) Burns significant decline (not only defensively but he was awful on the PP with shots ending up in Jersey or Va most of the time),
3) Freddie’s play deteriorating.

Even ignoring the first two, if we had LY’s Freddie we get to the Conference Finals with a better D with Pesce back.

Sure, to get to the finals you need to have everything working, which is why it's so difficult to get there. That's the point I'm making.

We are likely losing Pesce and Skjei. Burns is going to be another year older. Andersen is going to be another year older.

Maybe the team feels the money needs to be spent elsewhere, because putting a bunch of money into Guentzel, means we' are going to have just as big, if not bigger problems on D and goaltending and the end result may not be better.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

Canes are 12.2% net PP in the playoffs in this era. 74 game sample size. I can't wrap my head around the idea that a coach, whoever is in charge, is so dumb or stubborn to have not tweaked things strategically to try improve it.

We've seen them try pretty much every combination of players to make it work. We've seen half-walls of Aho/Teravainen, Teravainen/Svechnikov, Necas/Aho, Jarvis/Aho and Aho/Svechnikov. I distinctly remember Faulk and Hamilton on the same unit being tried in a must win game against Boston in 2019. Skjei somehow ended up at the point of the 1st unit in 2024.

Harsh truth: the players don't execute. They need someone that does.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

The problem with the idea that we'll "go for someone else" is how we're going to acquire them.

Are we going to pay the big bucks that the team never pays? Or trade for them using the prospects that we either no longer have (due to the Guentzel trade) or aren't willing to give up?

True, but the same argument you are making (in bold) applies to Guentzel. Just because we acquired him at the deadline, it doesn't change that.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

True, but the same argument you are making (in bold) applies to Guentzel. Just because we acquired him at the deadline, it doesn't change that.

Yeah, it was more of a complaint about the team's philosophy than wanting Guentzel specifically. If history is any indication, Guentzel probably isn't even chasing "the big bucks." We've probably just made an offer that isn't close to being competitive compared to what he'd make in FA.

And when he signs a reasonable deal with another team, we'll pick up two 15 goal guys for the same price, then wonder why our 1st/2nd line gets killed in the playoffs.

 

[Stickpucker]

I don't get some of the takes re: Guentzel. This team didn't go as far WITH Guentzel this year than they did without Guetnzel last year. It wasn't his fault or anything, just that it didn't get us over the hump. I'd love to keep him though, as adding more talent is always a great thing, but it has to be more than just Jake.

Maybe the team is looking at it like "We had a bunch of talented, but small guys/guys who play small/play on the perimeter" who don't get it done in the playoff (Aho, Jarvis, Necas, TT) so Guentzel adds more of that. Maybe they think the team needs to go in a different direction?

They purposely went after guys with more size/guys that go to the dirty areas) the last few years (Tkachuk, Meier, Marchment, and even Bunting, who didn't work out). Unfortunately, those guys aren't always easy to acquire.

We got further with MacAttack than we did with Svech *hmmm*

 

[hblueridgegal]

Harsh truth: the players don't execute. They need someone that does.

They seem so slow or hesitant to shoot compared to the ones who do it well. Sometimes, it looks like they don't want to be the one who makes a mistake.

Or, we get the clown show in which they never even get to a set up any kind.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

We got further with MacAttack than we did with Svech *hmmm*

Hey, you might be on to something. In this year's playoffs, Svech had 2 goals in 11 games:

0 5v5 goals
1 6v5 goal (our goalie pulled)
1 PP goal

Same number of goals as Martinook, TT and Orlov, and two less than Noesen and Kuznetsov.

 

[Stickpucker]

Maybe they are considering getting bigger and more physical vs smaller and skilled.

There are a few penis jokes lurking in this post.

 

[ElmCityGuy]

I saw this...

Elias Lindholm reportedly turning down both a:- 8 x $9M contract from the Flames and a - 7 x $7M contract from the Canucks.

No word on if he has been tested for smoking crack.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

Feels like Lindholm is going to get Klingberg'd

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Or maybe he just doesn't want to play in Canada

 

[chaz4hockey]

Hey, you might be on to something. In this year's playoffs, Svech had 2 goals in 11 games:

0 5v5 goals
1 6v5 goal (our goalie pulled)
1 PP goal

Same number of goals as Martinook, TT and Orlov, and two less than Noesen and Kuznetsov.

He was physical though which helped but the overall point is solid—-a #2 overall pick needs to produce more.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

3 year Marchessault deal is much more palatable than an 8 year JG deal

 

[TheBigLetowski]

Am I the only one who thinks we need to get nastier up front? At least bigger. Marchy doesn't do anything for me. Good scorer, but so was JG. How do we get Buch from Stlouis?

 

[cptjeff]

Am I the only one who thinks we need to get nastier up front? At least bigger. Marchy doesn't do anything for me. Good scorer, but so was JG. How do we get Buch from Stlouis?

Pittsburgh has a guy that would fit that bill. Banting? Blunting? It'll come to me...