Player Discussion Mitch Marner

[Gary Nylund]

Treliving misused $20 million, imagine what he could do with an extra $10 million.

I don't think cap space is valuable unless used correctly and our board has way too much faith in GMs (not just Treliving) to use it correctly.


I don't think they are a majority, mind you, they may be, but I think they are the loudest.

The same people who want Marner gone are the same people who wanted Nylander gone and now say how great he is.

These people are just miserable and always need something to complain about.

Nylander and Matthews can't handle round 2 either if you are using that as a sample size.

The first 4 games count.

I guess if the team was really serious they wouldn't have signed the 65 point winger either, but they did.

I'll finish by saying, if they can improve, then move him, but moving him just because seems silly.

What was your opinion on moving 2 of our worst playoff performers Hyman and Kadri?

This argument that our GM is too dumb to make use of cap space is pretty weak. I mean if you think that's true then it really doesn't matter whether he keeps Marner or not as we're doomed anyway so what do you care?

It's pretty clear that the majority wants him gone.

The same people ... that might be the most overused phrase ever, it's almost always incorrect and this time is no exception.

Nylander and Matthews haven't been great, but their performance hasn't dropped off in the playoffs to the extent that Marner's has, not even close.

You don't move him "just because", you move him because he's not worth anywhere close to his cap hit in the playoffs.

I was fine with moving Kadri because he couldn't control his emotions in the playoffs. I was fine with letting Hyman walk because it seemed like he wasn't worth what EDM paid him. With the benefit of hindsight, I'd do things differently but does that have to do with Marner?

I think they will be fully entitled to lose their minds in that scenario. Maybe common sense will prevail and everyone will agree that moving on is the right outcome (honestly, probably more so for the player than the team).

Yes, I do believe you're probably right. The kid seems so mentally fragile, another year in this town might just break his psyche to the point where he'll never be able to recover.

 

[Gabriel426]

I think they will be fully entitled to lose their minds in that scenario. Maybe common sense will prevail and everyone will agree that moving on is the right outcome (honestly, probably more so for the player than the team).

That’s what I have been saying, why would MM wants to be back?
He just can’t handle the pressure, it is really that simple. I really don’t think MM got the mental fortitude to come back next season and pulls a Willie and turn the opinions. I can see MM at his best if he is playing else where, probably a non Hockey market.

Looking at the Panthers Vs Oilers, anyone still think having a top heavy team build with THREE 11mil fowards will work is delusional. If McD and Drai can’t do it for the Oilers, nobody can. You need to well balance team just look at the past few SC champs.

 

[notbias]

This argument that our GM is too dumb to make use of cap space is pretty weak. I mean if you think that's true then it really doesn't matter whether he keeps Marner or not as we're doomed anyway so what do you care?

I think he has the ability, he failed last year pretty badly.

It's pretty clear that the majority wants him gone.

Like I said, I see a lot of people screaming about it, but just because they whine the most doesn't mean they are the majority.

The same people ... that might be the most overused phrase ever, it's almost always incorrect and this time is no exception.

Nylander and Matthews haven't been great, but their performance hasn't dropped off in the playoffs to the extent that Marner's has, not even close.

Nylander has the worst performance in the playoffs, his just doesn't drop off because he hasn't been as good in the regular season.

You don't move him "just because", you move him because he's not worth anywhere close to his cap hit in the playoffs.

Okay, well the last time a player was forced to be moved, our current GM basically ruined a franchise for a decade.

I was fine with moving Kadri because he couldn't control his emotions in the playoffs. I was fine with letting Hyman walk because it seemed like he wasn't worth what EDM paid him. With the benefit of hindsight, I'd do things differently but does that have to do with Marner?

I was curious about the overlap, a lot of people who wanted Kadri and Hyman here want Marner gone, that's all, curiosity.

 

[BrannigansLaw]

That’s what I have been saying, why would MM wants to be back?
He just can’t handle the pressure, it is really that simple. I really don’t think MM got the mental fortitude to come back next season and pulls a Willie and turn the opinions. I can see MM at his best if he is playing else where, probably a non Hockey market.

Looking at the Panthers Vs Oilers, anyone still think having a top heavy team build with THREE 11mil fowards will work is delusional. If McD and Drai can’t do it for the Oilers, nobody can. You need to well balance team just look at the past few SC champs.

Funny part is, Draisaitl is a generational playoff performer and only paid 8.5 million dollars. Meanwhile some think we can win by running it back paying four career losers 11 million dollars each by bringing in Berube lmao.

 

[Gabriel426]

Funny part is, Draisaitl is a generational playoff performer and only paid 8.5 million dollars. Meanwhile some think we can win by running it back paying four career losers 11 million dollars each by bringing in Berube lmao.

They also think if only we had better goaltending and our league minimum depth score more goals, and defence plays better, we would be right there with Panthers and in the SC Finals.

For some winning the Cup with MM is more important than winning the Cup.

 

[notbias]

Funny part is, Draisaitl is a generational playoff performer and only paid 8.5 million dollars. Meanwhile some think we can win by running it back paying four career losers 11 million dollars each by bringing in Berube lmao.

People worry about the cap WAYYYYY too much.

Edmonton has like 6.5 million in dead cap right now.

Whatever savings you think there is on Draisaitl's contract, it isn't 6.5

 

[BrannigansLaw]

People worry about the cap WAYYYYY too much.

Edmonton has like 6.5 million in dead cap right now.

Whatever savings you think there is on Draisaitl's contract, it isn't 6.5

Yeah we worry about the cap because we don’t have bargain/high value players like Draisaitl, Hyman, Bouchard, etc.

We have 4 grossly overpaid embarrassments taking up almost half the cap followed by 90 percent garbage.

 

[Racer88]

People worry about the cap WAYYYYY too much.

Edmonton has like 6.5 million in dead cap right now.

Whatever savings you think there is on Draisaitl's contract, it isn't 6.5

The cap prevents us from getting much better defence and a top notch goal tender. It simply does not work especially when the 4 guys eating all the cap fail to show up at the critical times in the playoffs. People want to blame the lower paid players and that’s a joke

 

[notbias]

Yeah we worry about the cap because we don’t have bargain/high value players like Draisaitl, Hyman, Bouchard, etc.

We have 4 grossly overpaid embarrassments taking up almost half the cap followed by 90 percent garbage.

Nothing we have is as bad as Nurse

The cap prevents us from getting much better defence and a top notch goal tender. It simply does not work especially when the 4 guys eating all the cap fail to show up at the critical times in the playoffs. People want to blame the lower paid players and that’s a joke

We spent $20 million last year on crap, that prevented it, not the cap.

We have $20 million again and hope they learned to make better choices this year.

 

[Racer88]

When are people going to admit that no team in the entire cap era has given 50% of the cap to 4 soft entitled similar forwards especially one who thinks fans look at them like Gods. Does he not realize how stupid that comment made him sound and why his entitlement is getting so much hate. Until that attitude is removed from the team tgey will go nowhere

 

[BrannigansLaw]

Nothing we have is as bad as Nurse



We spent $20 million last year on crap, that prevented it, not the cap.

We have $20 million again and hope they learned to make better choices this year.

Not gonna make any difference who they sign. This core won’t win crap if they run it back.

 

[Racer88]

Nothing we have is as bad as Nurse



We spent $20 million last year on crap, that prevented it, not the cap.

We have $20 million again and hope they learned to make better choices this year.

What about every year the money your guy Dubas spent on crap…….especially his scrap heap goal tending projects ……how did that work out

 

[BrannigansLaw]

What about every year the money your guy Dubas spent on crap…….especially his scrap heap goal tending projects ……how did that work out

Not just money. High draft picks too.

Trading Marleau for our 1st and Foligno for a 1st were two masters courses taught at Dumbas U.

 

[Racer88]

Not just money. High draft picks too.

Trading Marleau for our 1st and Foligno for a 1st were two masters courses taught at Dumbas U.

Ya I forgot about those gems

 

[notbias]

What about every year the money your guy Dubas spent on crap…….especially his scrap heap goal tending projects ……how did that work out

Wasn't good enough either, I've always said Dubas failed.

Acceptable answer?

Not gonna make any difference who they sign. This core won’t win crap if they run it back.

Why post or watch? You enjoy wasting time?

 

[BrannigansLaw]

Ya I forgot about those gems

The same GM that thought signing Matt Murray and Petr Mrazek were legitimate solutions to our weak ass goaltending.

The guy’s resume is just chock full of hits.

Anyway, Marner sucks. Trade him.

 

[Racer88]

Wasn't good enough either, I've always said Dubas failed.

Acceptable answer?



Why post or watch? You enjoy wasting time?

I think that’s a fair answer so if Dubas is crap and Tre hasn’t been very impressive so far ( I’m not a Tre Fan either) what do we do……who is the problem?
I’m sure you want to win as bad as I do but it’s never going to happen with the make up of this core. I wish Tre would have dealt Marner before his no move kicked in but I doubt Shanny would have allowed it

 

[BrannigansLaw]

Wasn't good enough either, I've always said Dubas failed.

Acceptable answer?



Why post or watch? You enjoy wasting time?

Because maybe one day I expect this team to not be icing a living fossil for 11 million AAV?

 

[Gabriel426]

Nothing we have is as bad as Nurse



We spent $20 million last year on crap, that prevented it, not the cap.

We have $20 million again and hope they learned to make better choices this year.

You are really starting to lose it. Just take a break from this thread, it is for your own mental health.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I think he has the ability, he failed last year pretty badly.

Like I said, I see a lot of people screaming about it, but just because they whine the most doesn't mean they are the majority.

Nylander has the worst performance in the playoffs, his just doesn't drop off because he hasn't been as good in the regular season.

Okay, well the last time a player was forced to be moved, our current GM basically ruined a franchise for a decade.

I was curious about the overlap, a lot of people who wanted Kadri and Hyman here want Marner gone, that's all, curiosity.

If our GM "has the ability", why are worried about him not using it wisely?

It's a clear majority but you don't think so that's fine, no point in discussing it further.

Nylander has outplayed Marner in the playoffs, especially in recent years. But if you don't see it that way then that's fine, no point in discussing it further.

You should make up your mind about what you think about our GM, it's hard to understand your opinions when you're sucking and blowing at the same time.

Trying to analyze "overlap" is futile when you consider there are millions of Leaf fans, that's also why the "it's the same people" phrase is really dumb and you should stop using it.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Funny part is, Draisaitl is a generational playoff performer and only paid 8.5 million dollars. Meanwhile some think we can win by running it back paying four career losers 11 million dollars each by bringing in Berube lmao.

When you put it like that, I have to say that running it back sounds pretty dumb. I wonder what the counter argument is, that Marner kills penalties maybe?

People worry about the cap WAYYYYY too much.

Edmonton has like 6.5 million in dead cap right now.

Whatever savings you think there is on Draisaitl's contract, it isn't 6.5

LOL. I don't even know what to say to this other than I think it's time for you to get some rest.

 

[notbias]

If our GM "has the ability", why are worried about him not using it wisely?

Because he doesn't consistently use it correctly and he ruined another franchise by using it incorrectly.

It's a clear majority but you don't think so that's fine, no point in discussing it further.

Like I said, the whiners are the loudest, it may seem like that, but who knows if it is.

We can leave this.

Nylander has outplayed Marner in the playoffs, especially in recent years. But if you don't see it that way then that's fine, no point in discussing it further.

Tampa = Marner
Florida = They all sucked
Boston = Nylander

You should make up your mind about what you think about our GM, it's hard to understand your opinions when you're sucking and blowing at the same time.

Our GM is terrible, my opinion doesn't change there, but I am optimistic.

Trying to analyze "overlap" is futile when you consider there are millions of Leaf fans, that's also why the "it's the same people" phrase is really dumb and you should stop using it.

Was curious, that's all.

If you take the "it's the same people" phrase as anything other than a general statement, it is dumb and you should stop commenting on it.

There is a big overlap between knuckle draggers here and people who hate Marner, this isn't new.

LOL. I don't even know what to say to this other than I think it's time for you to get some rest.

Worrying about an overpay of a couple of million is nothing to worry about, this is two years in a row where teams had over $6 million in dead cap in the finals.

Try using some critical thinking (which may be hard) and think about this.

 

[Gabriel426]

People worry about the cap WAYYYYY too much.

Edmonton has like 6.5 million in dead cap right now.

Whatever savings you think there is on Draisaitl's contract, it isn't 6.5

The cap is part of the NHL.

Any contracts can become dead cap or bargain.
MM’s contract would be consider a bargain if he produces like McD in the regular season and Drai in playoffs. On the other hand, even Lilly’s contract can be consider a waste and dead cap if Lilly can’t even crack the lineup.

Cap space is important and to think it is not is just foolish.
There were/are only 4 teams that ever have/had two or more players with over 10mil. And two of those teams did it bc they were rewarding their top guys after winning Cups.
Prior to Habs and Price, no teams had won a playoffs round with a 10mil plus player.
Vegas was the only team to win with a 10mil plus player. This might soon change.
Panthers is the only team that got two 10mil plus players to make it to the SCF.

These are facts.

That’s why fans care about the Cap.

I agree that it is how you use it that matters more than just having cap space. But if you don’t have the cap space, what can you use?

I don’t know why you believe that Tre signings were bad. Bert and Domi are fine and most likely will resign. Reaves was over by 350k but he does bring jump to the team when he is in the lineup. Kampf was an unnecessary resign as Laf was still on the team. Resigning Sammy was not a choice as there were no goalies available. The idea to sign Kling is right, just that Kling got injured and never recovered. Getting Benoit was very smart.
All those are pretty good signings.

You are really starting to argue for the sake of arguing with other posters instead of having discussions

Like I said, you are starting to lose it. Take a few days away from this thread, you need a break.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Ever? lol, he is the 2nd most important on the current team. Fortunately I won’t be able to prove we wouldn’t make the playoffs without Mitch because he isn’t going anywhere next year. Now the year after could be a strong maybe he leaves and then we will see. lol!

"Second most important"?

Most important generally goes #1C, #1D, #1G (not necessarily in that order). Goals are generally considered more important than assists, so even just in that category he's fourth. And Domi showed that Mitch may be only the third most important RW on the team.

 

[notDatsyuk]

The last two playoffs nylander and matthews both were terrible

Yet still much better than Mitch.