Player Discussion Mitch Marner - On Hiatus

[Gary Nylund]

The bigger question is Marner a good enough player to invest in. To date, playoff style hockey has been too tough for him. He’s not alone, collectively this core has underperformed in almost every big game situation: home game 6 on Sunday afternoon, JTs return to Long Island….0 success, all failure.

Exactly. Is he worth investing in is indeed the question.

For me, this question is easy to answer. If your a team who's not realistically hoping to go deep in the playoffs, Marner is a great player who's well worth investing in. If however you're a team that is hoping to go deep, the answer is an emphatic no f***in way.

 

[StevenB]

Just a corporate thing to say. Interesting they were in town. How did you know they were top guys?

He told me his position, googled it and saw a picture of the guy I was speaking to. He was the only person that I met, he said the rest of the people that came with him were waiting at the airport.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Oh yeah, let's cry about mandatory assists Mitch missed. That's a new one.

Mitch is 50 point player without Matthews but you dare to complain Mitch could parasite more? Interesting take.

edit: no need to call Mitch names!

I think his point is that Marner is totally dependent on other players to carry him.

 

[francis246]

I think his point is that Marner is totally dependent on other players to carry him.

Lol this is bull crap. Is this the level we are scooping down to now?

You can think a player is ineffective in the playoffs without diminishing who he is as a player.

Marner is still an amazing talent. He is extremely creative offensively and does create a ton of chances for his linemates, it’s why they all want to play with him (especially in the regular season).

In the playoffs he’s ineffective because he just straight refuses to go to the dirty areas, but he doesn’t need anyone to carry him. Neither does Matthews, neither does Nylander. The only guy that does is Tavares. He legit needs one of Nylander or Marner. He cannot drive a line on his own anymore.

 

[notDatsyuk]

How much do you honestly think they will save by signing Marner July 1, 2024 as opposed to June 2025? If he signs, he most likely gets between Willie and Matty. Tre paniced and signed Willie when he should have waited and it cost him $1.5mx8.

Had Marner signed for closer to 8.5m than 11m, he might still be in Leafs plans. At $12m, see yeah.

I thought the fact that Tre waited until Willy was midway through his best season was what cost him $1.5Mx8.

This is the first time I've heard it called the other way.

 

[francis246]

Oh yeah, let's cry about mandatory assists Mitch missed. That's a new one.

Mitch is 50 point player without Matthews but you dare to complain Mitch could parasite more? Interesting take.

edit: no need to call Mitch names!

May I remind you, Mitch scored 97 points and was the first out of the big three to score 90 points and he didn’t even play with Matthews at that point yet. Again, if you’re gonna hate on a guy, at least bring facts. Mitch is not a 50 point guy.

He’s a consistent 90 point guy, that’s just a fact. His play in the playoffs needs a HUGE improvement, but stop the cap.

 

[Nineteen67]

I don't understand how anyone who follows this team could want Marner back.

There's not enough dope in the world to get me to that level. No matter how much I smoke I just don't see it. Bringing Marner back is a bad idea no matter how you slice it.

They can't afford his salary.

He has a piss poor attitude. Despite wearing an "A" he demonstrates poor leadership through his immature media interactions. His refusal to accept personal accountability, instead blaming everyone else, makes him a cancer in the dressing room.

And he stinks in the playoffs when it matters most.

I could go on. But I see no reason to admonish Marner beyond my own amusement or those foolish to read anything I have written. The point is that anyone with half a brain and two eyes can see trading Marner is a necessity.

If I can see it so can everyone else.

You don’t even need NHL experience to see that. Some people tend to forget what they saw and what they knew after witnessing the lack of compete in the playoffs.

Again, he’s not alone and we may find out that Matthews is an even bigger fraud.

 

[ACC1224]

May I remind you, Mitch scored 97 points and was the first out of the big three to score 90 points and he didn’t even play with Matthews at that point yet. Again, if you’re gonna hate on a guy, at least bring facts. Mitch is not a 50 point guy.

He’s a consistent 90 point guy, that’s just a fact. His play in the playoffs needs a HUGE improvement, but stop the cap.

Some posts are better off ignored, just childish attention seeking.

 

[Nineteen67]

I think his point is that Marner is totally dependent on other players to carry him.

The entire core needs an alpha leader. I would get rid one of Matthews or Marner and hope to find someone t carry the team. Matthews would make a great Anderchuk if they could find a Gilmour.

 

[francis246]

Yeah a big worry I have with Marner is without an elite scoring #1C his numbers will drop. He’s had the privilege of being stapled to either prime Tavares or prime Matthews most of his career and he’s clearly benefited.

Paired with a less than excellent Tavares they weren’t as good. When Mitch was with Bertuzzi and Domi he didn’t score either, even though Matthews and Nylander had no problem working with those two.

Again false first ELC year, he played with Bozak and he did fine 62 points.

Second year ELC he played with Bozak and Marleau and he lead the team with 69 points,

Got Tavares and had 97 points (interesting how you credit Tavares for elevating Marner when Tavares never scored that amount prior to Marner hasn’t come close since losing Marner and has not reached that point total since Marner, while Marner has maintained that level of play in the regular season years after. That alone shows Marner was the driving force behind Tavares’ career year.)

The rest has been with Matthews

Some posts are better off ignored, just childish attention seeking.

I just don’t get how people are comfortable with blatantly telling lies or misrepresenting information

 

[Nineteen67]

May I remind you, Mitch scored 97 points and was the first out of the big three to score 90 points and he didn’t even play with Matthews at that point yet. Again, if you’re gonna hate on a guy, at least bring facts. Mitch is not a 50 point guy.

He’s a consistent 90 point guy, that’s just a fact. His play in the playoffs needs a HUGE improvement, but stop the cap.

The consistent failure in the big situations that is the cause for concern.

 

[francis246]

The consistent failure in the big situations that is the cause for concern.

For sure I’m not disputing that. But I’m kinda sick and tired of people diminishing a player because of one flaw. Our lack of playoff success is not Marner’s shoulders and people need to get that through their heads. Moving Marner could very well free up cap space to help us improve the roster. But if 34 can’t score goals in the playoffs this franchise is doomed. So much is made about Marner’s play dropping. I’m so interested to see the numbers on how many goals Matthews has scored in elimination games it can’t be very good.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Lol this is bull crap. Is this the level we are scooping down to now?

You can think a player is ineffective in the playoffs without diminishing who he is as a player.

Marner is still an amazing talent. He is extremely creative offensively and does create a ton of chances for his linemates, it’s why they all want to play with him (especially in the regular season).

In the playoffs he’s ineffective because he just straight refuses to go to the dirty areas, but he doesn’t need anyone to carry him. Neither does Matthews, neither does Nylander. The only guy that does is Tavares. He legit needs one of Nylander or Marner. He cannot drive a line on his own anymore.

Sorry - the sarcasm emoji didn't show up.

Just having a bit of fun with the poster who seems to think Marner is perfect, and blames other players for his drop in production.

He doesn't need anyone to 'carry' him (although he does need someone to put the puck in the net for him to get an assist), but at the same time I don't think he can 'carry' a line the way Matthews and Nylander can.

 

[francis246]

Sorry - the sarcasm emoji didn't show up.

Just having a bit of fun with the poster who seems to think Marner is perfect, and blames other players for his drop in production.

He doesn't need anyone to 'carry' him (although he does need someone to put the puck in the net for him to get an assist), but at the same time I don't think he can 'carry' a line the way Matthews and Nylander can.

That’s a fair assessment, I think of the three, Marner struggles to be consistent on a long term basis. He has moments where you’re like he’s the only player in hockey who can do that and he also has moments where you’re like he is the only player who is this skilled and could make a mistake like that haha. Idk, I’m on board with moving him because I feel we need change. But 34 and 88 better damn well step up and Treliving and our pro scouting staff better deliver on the cap space reallocation, otherwise, we gonna regret getting rid of 16 just for the sake of moving him.

Only time will tell!

 

[JL17]

So here’s a question… what happened to the Marner that blocked those 2 or 4 shots at the end of the playoff game on his ELC deal to the guy that was a step away from the puck and skated away from it against McAvoy this year.

If the dollars made that significant of a change and his head ballooned to the point where he can’t fit the ego in the door then a change of scenery is needed for the sake of the dressing room.

Mitch has created this divide or image with the way he’s acted and not being a mature adult.

 

[thewave]

For sure I’m not disputing that. But I’m kinda sick and tired of people diminishing a player because of one flaw. Our lack of playoff success is not Marner’s shoulders and people need to get that through their heads. Moving Marner could very well free up cap space to help us improve the roster. But if 34 can’t score goals in the playoffs this franchise is doomed. So much is made about Marner’s play dropping. I’m so interested to see the numbers on how many goals Matthews has scored in elimination games it can’t be very good.

He is slowing down physically

He is making more risky passes as a result.

Teams have figured his game out and are fully adjusted to it in the POs.

He complains and makes excuses

He gets coaches fired

Apparently dictates lines putting coach under threat of retaliation.

He is overpaid

He wants a raise on his overpay

He throws tantrums on the bench and in the box.

Apparently uses his agent and media to wage arguments with management proxy style.

Sounds like a real toxic winner to me. Get him out and move on.

 

[Blaylock38]

Why would a team willing to pay give up anything for additionally for Marner before he enters UFA?
Why would Marner dilute his haul from such a team by insisting they should pay the Leafs first?

Simply put because of money. If it is a team that is interested and is up coming, the extra revenue generated just getting into the first round would be enough. A team that is strong and looking to make a run, the belief that MM could get them past the first = more money. The acquiring team also gets the added year if they look to resign could save them money. The acquiring team also gets to evaluate him in real time to decide if they want to reup him. It is really no different than acquiring a rental at the deadline, no guarantee they will resign but the team will still make the trade if they believe the player can help achieve the organizational goals for that year,

 

[Nineteen67]

For sure I’m not disputing that. But I’m kinda sick and tired of people diminishing a player because of one flaw. Our lack of playoff success is not Marner’s shoulders and people need to get that through their heads. Moving Marner could very well free up cap space to help us improve the roster. But if 34 can’t score goals in the playoffs this franchise is doomed. So much is made about Marner’s play dropping. I’m so interested to see the numbers on how many goals Matthews has scored in elimination games it can’t be very good.

Matthews is a bigger question mark than Marner, imo.

 

[socko]

how would you ensure that shanahan got no credit for the cup?

It's all purely hypothetical. I can't guarantee a Cup either. I was merely stating that I think Shanahan is nearing the point of his firing and is most likely operating at this point in his own personal interests rather than in the interests of the Leafs winning the Stanley Cup. And no I don't think those things are necessarily the same. I'm not impressed by the guy and the sooner he's gone the better. It should have already happened IMO.

 

[DarkKnight]

I think his point is that Marner is totally dependent on other players to carry him.

Okay that's garbage.

Back outside...

 

[francis246]

He is slowing down physically

He is making more risky passes as a result.

Teams have figured his game out and are fully adjusted to it in the POs.

He complains and makes excuses

He gets coaches fired

Apparently dictates lines putting coach under threat of retaliation.

He is overpaid

He wants a raise on his overpay

He throws tantrums on the bench and in the box.

Apparently uses his agent and media to wage arguments with management proxy style.

Sounds like a real toxic winner to me. Get him out and move on.

When has he complained? I have not seen any of our guys complaining. Again just some more bs that you’re projecting tbh.

 

[ACC1224]

When has he complained? I have not seen any of our guys complaining. Again just some more bs that you’re projecting tbh.

some pretty vivid imaginations

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

Again false first ELC year, he played with Bozak and he did fine 62 points.

Second year ELC he played with Bozak and Marleau and he lead the team with 69 points,

Got Tavares and had 97 points (interesting how you credit Tavares for elevating Marner when Tavares never scored that amount prior to Marner hasn’t come close since losing Marner and has not reached that point total since Marner, while Marner has maintained that level of play in the regular season years after. That alone shows Marner was the driving force behind Tavares’ career year.)

The rest has been with Matthews

Not sure what exactly you refuted from me. I said the majority of his career has been with an elite #1C. Those first two years with JVR and Bozak are only a small part of his career now.

Tavares got two more points with Mitch than his previous career high. Wow what a leap. Tavares was a proven scorer before Mitch. Tavares hasn't been above a ppg player since but he's still had productive years. Also like I alluded to Tavares has aged out of his prime, he's not the same payer he was 6 years ago.

The rest has been with Matthews, AKA an elite scoring #1C.

 

[Mess]

Some say that forward Mitch Marner will be playing for the Toronto Maple Leafs for the 2024-25 season, others think otherwise. One of them is insider Frank Seravalli, who believes the Maple Leafs will force Marner into a tough situation in the coming weeks, which could lead to more than one significant moves.

“I think the Leafs are going to make a play and basically back him into a corner over the next three weeks, saying, ‘Mitch, it’s been great, but we’re moving on. So whether it’s now or eight months from now, your time’s up.’”

 

[ACC1224]

Some say that forward Mitch Marner will be playing for the Toronto Maple Leafs for the 2024-25 season, others think otherwise. One of them is insider Frank Seravalli, who believes the Maple Leafs will force Marner into a tough situation in the coming weeks, which could lead to more than one significant moves.

“I think the Leafs are going to make a play and basically back him into a corner over the next three weeks, saying, ‘Mitch, it’s been great, but we’re moving on. So whether it’s now or eight months from now, your time’s up.’”

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Why do you find something that's irrelevant, weeks old and been posted many times to be a necessary add to the discussion?