Player Discussion Mitch Marner - On Hiatus

[TMLBlueandWhite]

Whining daily like a petulant child isn't going to have any impact on what will actually happen. Crazy that needs to be pointed out but here we are.

The irony of this sentence is mind blowing.

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

Players to watch to gauge market value this offseason:
Sam Reinhart - 28 years old - 57 goals and 94 points
Jake Guentzel - 29 years old 77 points, 30 goals
Lucas Raymond - 22 years old 72 point, 31 goals
Seth Jarvis - 22 years old, 67 points 33 goals

These are high end offensive players who are either RFA or UFA

Honestly I don't think any of them will be paid $10.9M even though we awarded this five years ago, cap inflation hasn't adjusted to that degree. It's hard to look at comparables because Dubas generally thought he was trailblazing. He was blazing something alright.

 

[Fogelhund]

Players to watch to gauge market value this offseason:
Sam Reinhart - 28 years old - 57 goals and 94 points
Jake Guentzel - 29 years old 77 points, 30 goals
Lucas Raymond - 22 years old 72 point, 31 goals
Seth Jarvis - 22 years old, 67 points 33 goals

These are high end offensive players who are either RFA or UFA

Honestly I don't think any of them will be paid $10.9M even though we awarded this five years ago, cap inflation hasn't adjusted to that degree. It's hard to look at comparables because Dubas generally thought he was trailblazing. He was blazing something alright.

Projections... we need them every few pages anyway. Second one is Dobber Prospects.

My guess... Reinhart - $10.0
Guentzel 9.2 mil
Raymond $7.8 mil
Jarvis $6.3 mil.

[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD]Rank[/TD]
[TD]Name[/TD]
[TD]Age[/TD]
[TD]Pos[/TD]
[TD]Projected Cap Hit[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]1[/TD]
[TD]Jake Guentzel[/TD]
[TD]29[/TD]
[TD]F[/TD]
[TD]$9,720,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]Sam Reinhart[/TD]
[TD]28[/TD]
[TD]F[/TD]
[TD]$8,810,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]3[/TD]
[TD]Moritz Seider[/TD]
[TD]23[/TD]
[TD]D[/TD]
[TD]$8,450,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]Martin Necas[/TD]
[TD]25[/TD]
[TD]F[/TD]
[TD]$7,110,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD]Brandon Montour[/TD]
[TD]30[/TD]
[TD]D[/TD]
[TD]$6,850,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]6[/TD]
[TD]Lucas Raymond[/TD]
[TD]22[/TD]
[TD]F[/TD]
[TD]$6,190,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]7[/TD]
[TD]Filip Hronek[/TD]
[TD]26[/TD]
[TD]D[/TD]
[TD]$6,050,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]8[/TD]
[TD]Thomas Harley[/TD]
[TD]22[/TD]
[TD]D[/TD]
[TD]$5,870,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]9[/TD]
[TD]Jeremy Swayman[/TD]
[TD]25[/TD]
[TD]G[/TD]
[TD]$5,830,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]10[/TD]
[TD]Ukko-Pekka Luukkonen[/TD]
[TD]25[/TD]
[TD]G[/TD]
[TD]$5,760,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]11[/TD]
[TD]Seth Jarvis[/TD]
[TD]22[/TD]
[TD]F[/TD]
[TD]$5,650,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]12[/TD]
[TD]Vladimir Tarasenko[/TD]
[TD]32[/TD]
[TD]F[/TD]
[TD]$5,640,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]13[/TD]
[TD]Chandler Stephenson[/TD]
[TD]30[/TD]
[TD]F[/TD]
[TD]$5,560,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]14[/TD]
[TD]Brady Skjei[/TD]
[TD]30[/TD]
[TD]D[/TD]
[TD]$5,500,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]15[/TD]
[TD]Steven Stamkos[/TD]
[TD]34[/TD]
[TD]F[/TD]
[TD]$5,130,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]16[/TD]
[TD]Elias Lindholm[/TD]
[TD]29[/TD]
[TD]F[/TD]
[TD]$5,070,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]17[/TD]
[TD]Tyler Bertuzzi[/TD]
[TD]29[/TD]
[TD]F[/TD]
[TD]$4,830,000[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

Projections... we need them every few pages anyway. Second one is Dobber Prospects.


[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]

[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Interesting charts, I haven't seen these. I've read rumours that Hronek wants much more than 6M.

Cool information though, thanks for sharing.

 

[mclaren55]

Wrong thread damnit

 

[ToneDog]

Just so everyone knows, since 2020, in 20 more playoff games played, Montour has scored 1 more point than the guy you are all trying to fire into the sun. Mo also has a +16 vs. Montour at 0. You are all so quick to shit on our best playoff performer of the last 3 seasons, because what, he only got 3A's in 7 vs Boston? Look at the rest of our lineup. Mo isn't the problem here guys, the fact that we have him playing with bums is the problem.

Tessa is prego so I'm expecting a poor season from Rielly.

 

[keonsbitterness]

My coffee-filled gut is currently at 40-60 that he waives. Your gut may vary.

 

[ULF_55]

Just so everyone knows, since 2020, in 20 more playoff games played, Montour has scored 1 more point than the guy you are all trying to fire into the sun. Mo also has a +16 vs. Montour at 0. You are all so quick to shit on our best playoff performer of the last 3 seasons, because what, he only got 3A's in 7 vs Boston? Look at the rest of our lineup. Mo isn't the problem here guys, the fact that we have him playing with bums is the problem.

Rielly might be best defender on the team, but he needs a great deal of help.
He's good at many things, excellent in fewer.
His skating this year looked suspect, but let's give him the "recoverying from ankle injury" card and we can let him play the UBI injury card into the playoffs.

He needs a young Hainsey to play with. That isn't asking too much is it? Hainsey wasn't a great defenseman. You'd think your GM could land a "not great" defenseman to support your "not great" best defender.

We should all hope they can develop or acquire the complementary pieces required to stick the assets together.

Maybe between Treliving and Berube they can get Rielly his better half.

...

I see:
? - Matthews - marner as the first line.

I just don't know if Berube will continue to undermine the abilities of Tavares and Nylander.

Speed and quick strike versus heavy and pedestrian.

 

[Fogelhund]

Rielly might be best defender on the team, but he needs a great deal of help.
He's good at many things, excellent in fewer.
His skating this year looked suspect, but let's give him the "recoverying from ankle injury" card and we can let him play the UBI injury card into the playoffs.

He needs a young Hainsey to play with. That isn't asking too much is it? Hainsey wasn't a great defenseman. You'd think your GM could land a "not great" defenseman to support your "not great" best defender.

We should all hope they can develop or acquire the complementary pieces required to stick the assets together.

Maybe between Treliving and Berube they can get Rielly his better half.

.

How is it, that we've been talking about the Rielly pairing for years on this board, and it's not been properly addressed this whole time. Most of us understand Rielly needs a guy who plays a simple game to play with.

Boosh wasn't terrible. 4 goals for, 1 against... and stats to support it. playoffs
Schenn was better 9 goals for 2 against and stats to support it. playoffs

Tanev or Pesce would be better. Matt Roy would work too.
Barring that.... you've either got to keep Boosh, or see if Nashville would give away Schenn, after how things went last year.

 

[MCR74]

The irony of this sentence is mind blowing.

If Marner concentrated on his game instead of whining like a petulant child, maybe we wouldn't be here.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

The irony of this sentence is mind blowing.

It's a total lack of self awareness.

 

[Knies iT]

The bolded is what so many don't seem to grasp.
Whining daily like a petulant child isn't going to have any impact on what will actually happen. Crazy that needs to be pointed out but here we are.

You seem way too emotionally invested in this thread/player.

 

[ACC1224]

You seem way too emotionally invested in this thread/player.

It's not the thread, I'll speak out against stupidity wherever I find it.

Thread has run it's course though, it really should be put down.

 

[socko]

Thread has run it's course though, it really should be put down.

I could say the same for the core.

 

[rumman]

Tessa is prego so I'm expecting a poor season from Rielly.

was she preggos last year too?

 

[rumman]

Rielly might be best defender on the team, but he needs a great deal of help.
He's good at many things, excellent in fewer.
His skating this year looked suspect, but let's give him the "recoverying from ankle injury" card and we can let him play the UBI injury card into the playoffs.

He needs a young Hainsey to play with. That isn't asking too much is it? Hainsey wasn't a great defenseman. You'd think your GM could land a "not great" defenseman to support your "not great" best defender.

We should all hope they can develop or acquire the complementary pieces required to stick the assets together.

Maybe between Treliving and Berube they can get Rielly his better half.

...

I see:
? - Matthews - marner as the first line.

I just don't know if Berube will continue to undermine the abilities of Tavares and Nylander.

Speed and quick strike versus heavy and pedestrian.

Rielly's performance last season sucked, instead of trying to find a unicorn to cover for his defensive ineptitude I suggest trading him for someone who's a better defender and maybe not as offensively gifted...........

If Marner concentrated on his game instead of whining like a petulant child, maybe we wouldn't be here.

yup, and doesn't help when people enable his petulant childishness.........

It's a total lack of self awareness.

it's classic confession through projection...........

 

[rumman]

You seem way too emotionally invested in this thread/player.

you'd think he was a relative of Mitch's the way he defends him at all costs.........

I could say the same for the core.

now he wants the discussion closed because he doesn't like the narrative, welcome to Stalin's thread........

 

[ToneDog]

was she preggos last year too?

Guessing this is their first.

 

[myleafs]

Hope you’re not disappointed.
Pelley looks like another suit politician instantly spouting new catch phrases of chemistry and unity for season 10 of this show.
Everything we’ve seen before.
It would be 100 % Leaf like to not only run it back but pay him 12+ million on top of that.
I’ve seen this show multiple times. Each time trying to fool you it will be different. They are the masters of doing thing differently the exact same way.

And if it fails again, then they can use the magic fire Shanny bullet which will buy them a couple more years cause you know the new guy will need time to assess......and around and around we go.

 

[ULF_55]

Rielly's performance last season sucked, instead of trying to find a unicorn to cover for his defensive ineptitude I suggest trading him for someone who's a better defender and maybe not as offensively gifted...........

He has a NMC so it is up to him whether he wants to move or not.

So, rather than pretend he'll go away, management has to make their best efforts to make the team better within the rules of reality.

I've never been a Rielly 'fan', I accept he's a good defenseman, just not a great defenseman.

I'd say they do their best to get him a better partner, and as his time with Hainsey showed, it doesn't have to be a first pairing defender. It has to be the right fit.

 

[rumman]

He has a NMC so it is up to him whether he wants to move or not.

So, rather than pretend he'll go away, management has to make their best efforts to make the team better within the rules of reality.

I've never been a Rielly 'fan', I accept he's a good defenseman, just not a great defenseman.

I'd say they do their best to get him a better partner, and as his time with Hainsey showed, it doesn't have to be a first pairing defender. It has to be the right fit.

Hainey was a long time ago, I'd try him on the wing where his defensive shortcomings won't hurt the team.........

 

[myleafs]

If you think longer term though, the core four is over next year anyways. JT is a modest hit or gone. Reilly isn't a given either for that matter. Plus the cap will go up a decent amount in 2025, so the Leafs have room for the "big 3" If you decide to go that way. Despite the sentiment here, Marner is still a valuable commodity and if Berube for example argues he can get more out of a playoff Marner, he might stay. I said 50/50, maybe it's more he leaves, but this daily slam dunk bitchfest only exists here, it has nothing to do with what is being weighed as we speak and to think.

 

[francis246]

I accept your explanation 100%. That said, logically he should have never been paid as he is so highly. Yet he and his family, despite knowing the limitations you describe, demand top dollar. Why?

EDIT: You know what? NOW I'm gonna get "EMOTIONAL". First of all, I am one of the very few posters on here that has taken everything you've said on here as close to the Gospel Truth as I could as your story seems to be very credible.

Frankly, this Marner as a victim narrative is BULLSHIT. I am a skilled trades guy who worked my way up to Supervisor in a Govt position with a pension most people can only dream of. I made probably 2 million bucks my entire working career. Yet I consider myself FORTUNATE to have this great5 life that I have. Most people who have worked for a living have FAR LESS than what I have.

So stick the Marner ( or any other professional athlete, for that matter) is a victim narrative STRAIGHT up your brown chute.

Thank you.

I’ve said this time and time, WE as in the fans, don’t care for your story. What you’ve done in your life is irrelevant in a sports context. It’s not equatable for many reasons. Good for you for making an honest living but it honestly means f*** all in this context. Sorry to be crude. Just because you made a lot of sacrifices and have gone through shit doesn’t mean athletes have to take less and it also doesn’t mean that the things they’ve experience prior to becoming rich is invalidated. 99% of todays athletes are about maximizing their own brands and making as much money as possible. Winning on top of that is a nice bonus. It sucks but that’s the era of athlete we live in now. Most of it is agent driven anyways. The players of course agree to the deals but the agents are doing the talking and making sure their clients are getting as much money as possible. Yeah Mitch deserves the vitriol but you guys act like he was in the discussions there with Dubas. It was Ferris and Dubas negotiating. All Mitch did was say yes and sign when everything was done. What do you expect him to do? Tell Ferris to rip up the contract and tell them to give me less money, like come on LOL

EDIT* (also before you try and tell me this is bullshit, I’m a former pro athlete myself who is now retired.) I can tell you first hand when I played my agent basically took care of everything contract related, I gave some parameters for certain things, like favourable places to play, looked at the offers, but really I left it up to my agent to get me the best deal in the country/league I preferred. (I played a different sport in Europe after college). Some athletes are more hands on than others tho

No one is asking you to sympathize with Mitch if you don’t want to. But comparing your life to the one of an athlete then expecting them to take less because your life was harder or you feel like you’ve worked harder is hilarious. It’s not even the same conversation.

 

[myleafs]

I watched the game last night, I saw some guy take Tkachuk’s mouth piece, the p***y tkachuk did t even try to get it back. lol! I could just imagine the uproar if Marner got his mouthguard taken away and did nothing about it. People see what they want, hear what they want. I’m sure there are 31 other teams that would appreciate having Marner on their team.

really? Comparing Tkachuk to Marners mettle?

 

[myleafs]

lawl

ITT: Marner: the cause of inflation, global warming, and the singular cause of Leafs playoff failures.

The whole core has been terrible in relation to their talent - Marner has plenty of company. Starting with the supposed best and highest paid player on the team (and soon to be highest paid in the world).. Matthew$.

View attachment 877017

Obviouisly it is all Marner's fault!

Nobody is saying its ALL Marners fault and you are correct in that there is plenty of blame to go around. However we just gave 34 and 88 new contracts and everyone knows we cant just run back 4x 11+ contracts for the umpteenth time so that leaves Marner. If you could keep just 2 of the core four which do you choose? The 2 that are signed for a few years would be my picks. And if Marner goes and the other Gucci boys continue to falter in the big moments they can go too.