Management Thread | The Song Remains the Same Edition

[DonnyNucker]

He hasn't really had enough time to work with Martin or Delia. He is considered one of the very best in the world though. Most European leagues use his book for techniques.

I expect that number will go up and up as the unhappy fans lament his departure

It is possible that they have changed course but that would be a good thing except they did make what looks like early a couple of mistakes, but the Miller saga is not done yet IMO.

We'll see. Wait, just a little more patience.

It is possible that circumstances and maybe Horvat not wanting to stay, regardless of what he says now, because what good does it do him to disrespect the team and his friends after being moved, but he does look like he is supressing a grin a lot when talking about the trade, like he isn't terribly upset just surprised.

ON Miller, I think Vegas may have just become another possible player for his services. Although there are a few other players they might look at or prefer but if the Canucks reduce their expectations of returns they might get a chance to make a deal. Unfortunately I think they may believe Tocchet change change the spots on this cat. 3 weeks to see if that is the case.

For the first time in a very long time the roster of young players in the AHL is impressive and while having a good AHL team does not always translate to a good NHL team, the Marlies were a top AHL team while the Leafs were the Laffs, it is something not seen here for a long time since Nonis/Gillis. Safety in numbers, law of averages?

The Demko rumours have been around too long for there to be nothing, even with Rutherford advertising his value from day one. What is needed is health for some teams others may take a chance early to get "Bubble Demko".

ON one more bit of smoke that is clearing now, Tryamkin.
It is now coming to light that all the management misleading information is coming down to a insulting contract offer, with unacceptable terms. This is one aspcet of the "old boys club" that I dislike, how they can OWN a player that nevers signs but can make sure that player doesn't sign anywhere else even if they don't want him. A demonstration to other players, do what we say or never get a shot in the NHL. I remember Burke doing that to a couple of players but misjudged on Umberger who had a loop hole. Federov did not and Burke even crowed about his ownership of the kid regardless if warranted or not, "he will never play in the NHL" and then the old boys club circled the wagons. Well Tryamkin is now a FA and there is no reason some NHL team would not want his services. He is still youngish for a defenceman in the NHL. If you think he isn't good enough if you can remember Linden and Benning both were saying how good he was and how he would help the team right up until he signed that KHL deal 24 hours after their offer. And then all the spin by friendly media, the marketing department and astro surfing agencies. "the city smelled of pot" DUH! ever been down town? You can smell "skunk" a block away. His wife didn't like Vancouver, really? A preference for half stocked shelves and less offered with a superior climate? He got home sick. It was embarrassing how many fans were led along by their noses. His leaving could not have had anything to do with a contract offer, or money or not liking the NHL. His coming back twice and waiting for months for Benning to talk about contracts only to be told that there was no money while Benning gave millions to Pouliot, Schaller, Gagner, Beagle Roussel, Larson, Benning even traded away draft picks for some, but the kid waited until the end. AND the bought media continued with "he isn't any good", "He didn't want to be here", with never a mention of what the player said or thought of why he left. That would have been critical against the city's favourite child, Linden.

What is the evidence of this fiction about him leaving? Horvat's rumoured contract offer and others as well, what was the rumoured offer for Groot? NEVER MENTIONED, just every bit of negativity or spin handed out.

Well there are new kids in town running the show, I don't know if they would look at him but for a team desperate for dmen, PK specialists, deterrents, would they take a look at him now? And there are still Benning loyalists who will quote all the "spin".

4 years at 3 mil would be a bargain even if his play is the same as OEL because of the deterrent factor. Or if in doubt and he would sign here for less term, the 3/4 mil for 2 years. Even Reeves might think twice about wanting a dance. The last guy like him is not Chara, it is Byfuglien without all the points

You are out of your mind

 

[racerjoe]

Rutherford is on record saying that this job has been harder than he expected, but that he would also not quit halfway through unless his health requires that. I tend to believe him.

I am shocked a normal rational person would buy anything written by that guy. With his track record of reporting only factual information.

I won't even mention that reporters name. He should be banned on here just like Eckland.

 

[Hollywood Burrows]

why wouldn't you want out of the worst franchise in the NHL? It would be surprising if you didn't want out!

 

[Steamer]

Simmons is a donkey.

But I also wouldn’t be surprised if Rutherford is done after the season is over.

He’s done it before, he’s 110 and I think he miscalculated the passion of the market.

HE spent a few years in Toronto as a player, but most of his playing and management career has been in the USA. He is clueless in a Canadian market.

 

[Steamer]

As much as it may be unpopular, I have no problem with his designation of Aliu. Future Greats and Heartbreaks has numerous unbiased accounts of Aliu throughout junior and they are far from glowing reports

I'm sure we can all relate to the facts.. 23 teams didn't want the guy to stick around. You can't possibly infer that 23 teams wanted his departure due to the colour of his skin. Especially considering all the smoke surrounding his behaviour otherwise.

Comparing him to Simmonds though comes off as real cheap and a bit of a dog whistle but its no secret Aliu was a problem child.

Agreed, there was more the his skin colour involved. I am not suggesting there wasn't a racist aspect, but that is a lot of teams that didn't want the player. There are certainly enough African American players in the league now to suggest that attitude may have been a big factor in Aliu's failure to succeed, rather than skin colour.

 

[Orr4Norris]

Agreed, there was more the his skin colour involved. I am not suggesting there wasn't a racist aspect, but that is a lot of teams that didn't want the player. There are certainly enough African American players in the league now to suggest that attitude may have been a big factor in Aliu's failure to succeed, rather than skin colour.

Avery had a decent career despite being a despicable human being. It took a lot for him to finally be freezed out. And he got multiple chances.

I don’t doubt Aliu was a **** to deal with. But so are a lot of white dudes. That’s the real double standard.

 

[TruGr1t]

Francesco should just make it official and name himself President, GM, CEO and Lord of the Underworld.

 

[rypper]

What’s the source of this rumour?

Fan fiction websites.

 

[theguardianII]

why wouldn't you want out of the worst franchise in the NHL? It would be surprising if you didn't want out!

Referring to the players right?

 

[theguardianII]

Agreed, there was more the his skin colour involved. I am not suggesting there wasn't a racist aspect, but that is a lot of teams that didn't want the player. There are certainly enough African American players in the league now to suggest that attitude may have been a big factor in Aliu's failure to succeed, rather than skin colour.

Having to be worried about ethnicity as a coach can sometimes be something unexpected. I once put a line together and another coach asked me why? I honestly didn't understand what he was talking about, then he asked if I did because they were all oriental. I was dismayed, it never entered my mind, they just played well as players together, I never ever thought about race, only players. I had even championed a few kids I thought were over looked at selection camps that were good players but other than white.
Some coaches just see a jersey and player. Now there is another whole area of concern, to be labeled racist for just doing what is best for the team.

That said there is nothing that is saying what he feels happened is wrong. But a player can "have baggage" and be a problem PERSON.

 

[gringo]

Avery had a decent career despite being a despicable human being. It took a lot for him to finally be freezed out. And he got multiple chances.

I don’t doubt Aliu was a **** to deal with. But so are a lot of white dudes. That’s the real double standard.

look at the coach of the maple leafs still an unrepentant David Frost acolyte. You never hear about what a little shit Keefe was. Golden boy status, but skin colour has nothing to do with it? Who do you think was a bigger asshole during their Junior career? Sheldon “takes signals from David frost in the stands” Keefe or Aliu?

Francesco should just make it official and name himself President, GM, CEO and Lord of the Underworld.

Luigi still boss of the underworld oops I’ve said too much

 

[kanucks25]

For sure. Realistically need 1-2 of Boeser, Garland, Beauvillier gone in a month. Only one is needed if Myers is gone as well

I would be surprised if any of these guys are moved at the deadline. Seem more like off-season transactions.

Not sure on the source but I believe it was rumoured that Dubas was interested in Garland going back to his time in Arizona. If he’s still interested then he must be a big fan of Garland.

That was also 2 years ago when Garland was having his best year and wasn't being paid almost 5M.

I don't see how he'd be a fit for them right now unless we're like retaining half.

 

[AwesomeInTheory]

As much as it may be unpopular, I have no problem with his designation of Aliu. Future Greats and Heartbreaks has numerous unbiased accounts of Aliu throughout junior and they are far from glowing reports

I'm sure we can all relate to the facts.. 23 teams didn't want the guy to stick around. You can't possibly infer that 23 teams wanted his departure due to the colour of his skin. Especially considering all the smoke surrounding his behaviour otherwise.

Comparing him to Simmonds though comes off as real cheap and a bit of a dog whistle but its no secret Aliu was a problem child.

Do you really want to be taking the side of Steve Downie or Bill Peters?

How much of a "problem child" is Aliu compared to, oh, Patrick Kane? Or the aforementioned Sean Avery? Or Mike Richards?

Dude didn't participate in the stupid f***ing hazing shit that was perpetuated by known shitbird Downie and that altered his career trajectory. He also didn't tolerate blatantly racist shit and stood up for it and was punished for not going along with it.

His background and ethnicity absolutely played a role. How many times have we bemoaned Benning being a beneficiary of the OBC? That shit goes all the way down.

Look at John Vanbiesbrouck and how he was able to secure another high level position coaching Team USA after spouting off really nasty racist invective about Trevor Daley.

Mix in the immaturity/indiscretions of youth, which Aliu himself has acknowledged and it comes off no different than a host of other players. Like, oh, say, Shane O'Brien (13 teams.) Or Erik Gudbranson.

The "23 teams" thing is also a bit of a misnomer, given that many of those teams were under an organization's umbrella and were further complicated with the Thrashers/Jets trade (as well as the Thrashers having the Wolves as their AHL affiliate, hence him splitting duties between Chicago and Peoria.) Also, Peters demoting him because Aliu had the audacity to not appreciate being called a racial slur.

If he were white, he'd be portrayed as a 'journeyman.' But I guess he doesn't play the white way--I mean, the right way, we can just ignore everything he says, lol.

 

[Steamer]

look at the coach of the maple leafs still an unrepentant David Frost acolyte. You never hear about what a little shit Keefe was. Golden boy status, but skin colour has nothing to do with it? Who do you think was a bigger asshole during their Junior career? Sheldon “takes signals from David frost in the stands” Keefe or Aliu?


Luigi still boss of the underworld oops I’ve said too much

You don't see me defending Keefe. It's irrelevant. This technique is called deflection. Instead of addressing the subject you deflect by attempting to tie it to a completely different circumstance. Hey, have you noticed how many sexual assault scandals are going on solving junior hockey players? They are not angels and there is lots of B ess. But either Aliu had the bad luck to wind up with 23 different racist organization or there was a problem with him. If you could read properly, you will note I pointed out how many African American NHL players there are now. Interesting how their careers didn't happen to go through 23 racist based organizations isn't it?

 

[MS]

You don't see me defending Keefe. It's irrelevant. This technique is called deflection. Instead of addressing the subject you deflect by attempting to tie it to a completely different circumstance. Hey, have you noticed how many sexual assault scandals are going on solving junior hockey players? They are not angels and there is lots of B ess. But either Aliu had the bad luck to wind up with 23 different racist organization or there was a problem with him. If you could read properly, you will note I pointed out how many African American NHL players there are now. Interesting how their careers didn't happen to go through 23 racist based organizations isn't it?

I have no doubt that Aliu has faced considerable racism in his career.

Further to that, Simmons’ quote about Simmonds is like saying ‘Baseball wasn’t racist in the 1950s - look at Jackie Robinson!’

But the ‘23 teams’ thing is a red herring. It’s what happens relatively often when fringe players become ECHL/Euro lifers. An ex-Canuck prospect like Yann Sauve is now on 20 teams. Aliu’s situation was pretty normal through age 24 when he was released by Calgary - he’d played for two organizations on their NHL and ECHL teams.

 

[gringo]

You don't see me defending Keefe. It's irrelevant. This technique is called deflection. Instead of addressing the subject you deflect by attempting to tie it to a completely different circumstance. Hey, have you noticed how many sexual assault scandals are going on solving junior hockey players? They are not angels and there is lots of B ess. But either Aliu had the bad luck to wind up with 23 different racist organization or there was a problem with him. If you could read properly, you will note I pointed out how many African American NHL players there are now. Interesting how their careers didn't happen to go through 23 racist based organizations isn't it?

23 teams dude this stuff is just funny. The guy I quoted (not you, you sensitive snowflake) brought up the OHL , which is why i brought up Keefe. It’s not deflection to compare two players treatment.

What I will say is Keefe is probably the most over-privileged little bitch to ever coach in the nhl and almost certainly got the job because he knew the right people who overlooked his disgusting defence of David frost

 

[Vector]

Dhaliwal corroborating Simmons story.

 

[Hit the post]

I have no doubt that Aliu has faced considerable racism in his career.

Further to that, Simmons’ quote about Simmonds is like saying ‘Baseball wasn’t racist in the 1950s - look at Jackie Robinson!’

But the ‘23 teams’ thing is a red herring. It’s what happens relatively often when fringe players become ECHL/Euro lifers. An ex-Canuck prospect like Yann Sauve is now on 20 teams. Aliu’s situation was pretty normal through age 24 when he was released by Calgary - he’d played for two organizations on their NHL and ECHL teams.

Look at what Hank Aaron had to put up with even later during his chase for Ruth's home run record.

 

[LordBacon]

Dhaliwal corroborating Simmons story.

Great another dinosaur

 

[rypper]

This team is so stupid.

 

[Orr4Norris]

Dhaliwal corroborating Simmons story.

What. The. f***.

 

[valkynax]

Dhaliwal corroborating Simmons story.

If Moleman wants out, Fredolini will just hire another trophy president who, either share his vision of lunacy, or has his own testicles so shriveled up he'd ever stand up to Fredolini himself.

 

[Josepho]

didn't the league intervene tallon taking over here?

 

[MS]

It seems pretty obvious that these guys are having major struggles dealing with the dipshit owner so these rumours probably aren't surprising. When you're 75 and have 3 Cups you probably don't want to be dealing with that shit.

As for what would happen if Rutherford goes ... who knows. There's no way they could sell Tallon in this market and it would be a disaster if they tried.

 

[Just A Bit Outside]

Dhaliwal corroborating Simmons story.

f*** me. That’s even worse.

Might as well bring in Milbury too.