Management Thread | The Song Remains the Same Edition

[timw33]

Doerrie on Roxy Fever Podcast today for 2 hour interview.

Have to read between the lines because she had to be cautious with her words, but essentially confirms:
-the room is not in a good state
-where the real problem lies (ownership) and that people are finally pointing their anger at the right people
-that Miller to NYI deal at draft blew up because it leaked to media that they were working on a deal at all (and they learned from it for the Horvat deal)
-Horvat being part of the solution not the problem in the room/deep problems still remain
-that they should have moved Miller/kept horvat
-thinks Raty is going to be a winger, thinks the Canucks have too many wingers and need to stop acquiring wingers.
-Scouts should get credit for a player's success if those attributes were present and identified by the scouts, but player development often should get more credit for the attributes grown after being drafted
-something along the lines of prospects who don't already have work ethic aren't worth drafting, even if they have the talent
-Doms GSVA model is the closest public model to what NHL teams use internally to value players
-feels most of the scouts at eliteprospects are better than most of the conventional nhl scouts
-wishes the best to analytics team, thinks they are great, loves the coaching staff, likes Cammi, likes JR as a person (upset at how Bruce treated), the issue lies with Castonguay and Allvin only.

 

[Breakers]

Doerrie on Roxy Fever Podcast today for 2 hour interview.

Have to read between the lines because she had to be cautious with her words, but essentially confirms:
-the room is not in a good state,
-where the real problem lies (ownership) and that people are finally pointing their anger at the right people
-that Miller to NYI deal at draft blew up because it leaked to media that they were working on a deal at all (and they learned from it for the Horvat deal)
-Horvat being part of the solution not the problem in the room/deep problems still remain
-that they should have moved Miller/kept horvat
-thinks Raty is going to be a winger, thinks the Canucks have too many wingers and need to stop acquiring wingers.
-Scouts should get credit for a player's success if those attributes were present and identified by the scouts, but player development often should get more credit for the attributes grown after being drafted

FRANK!!!!!!!!!!!!

we would have been in such a better spot if that frigan deal went through for the islanders
just amateur management not believing that Lou is that temperamental even though the precedent's were their constantly.

 

[timw33]

FRANK!!!!!!!!!!!!

we would have been in such a better spot if that frigan deal went through for the islanders
just amateur management not believing that Lou is that temperamental even though the precedent's were their constantly.

Yeah we would have been so much farther ahead if we moved Miller to NYI for the same package we just got, and then got Horvat signed before he started pacing for 50 goals.

 

[Breakers]

Yeah we would have been so much farther ahead if we moved Miller to NYI for the same package we just got, and then got Horvat signed before he started pacing for 50 goals.

Yeah and its the same with that extension talk if they did it earlier with Miller
That ex Newport guy said on the radio if a team traded for miller last deadline, the extension talk can't even come into the equation as it can't be discussed till the offseason.

Miller couldn't Veto a single thing to screw over the return.

 

[Vector]

 

[4Twenty]

They’re all brand new. How the f*** is the question “who’s going to be there long term”? These folks, almost all of them barely have a year here. If they’re already admitting this many mistakes take them all behind the woodshed and start over.

 

[krutovsdonut]

if rutherford wants out this indicates to me that the tochett hire was not a victory for him. he should be energized if he got his coach and made the horvat trade he planned to make. he would want to quit if he didn't want to trade horvat and tocchet was not his guy.

 

[krutovsdonut]

Yeah we would have been so much farther ahead if we moved Miller to NYI for the same package we just got, and then got Horvat signed before he started pacing for 50 goals.

i agree that is the logical rational asset management view, but i am not 100% we didn't need to blow it up. i don't think horvat was the right captain for the team and watching pettersson exercising playful dominance over horvat at the allstar game with all those hugs and face mushes like my dog messing with a big puppy tends to confirm that fact.

pettersson likes horvat but is happy horvat is elsewhere.

 

[Kevinsane]

pettersson likes horvat but is happy horvat is elsewhere.

I’m an expert level lip reader. You must be a million times better than me.

 

[krutovsdonut]

I’m an expert level lip reader. You must be a million times better than me.

well if you want to extent the analogy, i have always had the ability to sort out dogs since i was a kid.

it's the owners who are usually the problem, and mostly unfixable.

 

[SeawaterOnIce]

 

[gringo]

Rachel thinks the old captain was “part of the solution” in terms of poor room culture but the guy captain for years letting the room degenerate.

 

[credulous]

as long as dale tallon and geoff courtnall have their hooks in aquilini this team is going nowhere. i don't think rutherford has done a good job and i would be happy to see him go but no one can succeed when you've got the team owner surrounded by a bunch of grima wormtongue's second guessing everything you do

 

[krutovsdonut]

an underrated source of leaks is the aquafamily. not necessarily aquaman, but also the brothers and various kids and friends. the bigger the transaction the more likely they would hear about it. it makes sense they would have known about tochett if aquaman flew to vegas.

 

[SeawaterOnIce]

Rachel thinks the old captain was “part of the solution” in terms of poor room culture but the guy captain for years letting the room degenerate.

Point is...the problem is JT Miller. JT Miller is the problem in that lockerroom. You can see it in interviews and his shitty behavior off the ice.

 

[Bgav]

Would be amazing if JR retired. All the spotlight will be on Aquaman

 

[Orr4Norris]

an underrated source of leaks is the aquafamily. not necessarily aquaman, but also the brothers and various kids and friends. the bigger the transaction the more likely they would hear about it. it makes sense they would have known about tochett if aquaman flew to vegas.

I wonder if ownership was the source of the leak on draft day.

 

[nowhereman]

Point is...the problem is JT Miller. JT Miller is the problem in that lockerroom. You can see it in interviews and his shitty behavior off the ice.

I don't doubt he's one of the problems but I don't see how one guy, in a room of elite, highly-paid men, is going to rock the boat that much. I mean, if he was obviously the issue, you'd think everyone in the organization (from the players to the coaches to the management) would confront it and Miller would be smart enough to reign this in.

Maybe there are other problem players? Maybe part of the issue is that this team actually is mostly composed of a bunch of lilting flowers with no backbone (which might be the case, given their mentally-weak on-ice play) and no one knows how to keep a room full of egos in check? I feel like, if Miller tried something like this in Pittsburgh, Crosby (and Brian Burke) would take him behind the woodshed.

 

[Orr4Norris]

as long as dale tallon and geoff courtnall have their hooks in aquilini this team is going nowhere. i don't think rutherford has done a good job and i would be happy to see him go but no one can succeed when you've got the team owner surrounded by a bunch of grima wormtongue's second guessing everything you do

Rutherford said a lot of the right things when hired but actions haven’t lined up. Gotta wonder if that is ownership interference.

If Rutherford steps down…what a disaster. If you’re Petey, how do you sign long term knowing the state at the top of the organization? Just a total gong show.

 

[Diversification]

Currently listening.

lol. She is a real shit disturber.

 

[Breakers]

I agree with what others have said in this thread.

Why are we asking if a guy who is soo old his birth certificate was printed on a scroll is the long term solution?

We know he isn’t!!!!!!
That isn’t some controversial statement

 

[BrentSopelsHair]

Rachel thinks the old captain was “part of the solution” in terms of poor room culture but the guy captain for years letting the room degenerate.

Thinking that it's the fault of the captain that management keeps bringing in overpaid older players who stink and as a result the team sucks is just the dumbest thing ever.

There is no level of pure leadership ability that would have been able to lift the Horvat-era Canucks over the rakes that they kept laying out for themselves to step on. It's absurd to blame the results of the team on this guy

 

[Nomobo]

i agree that is the logical rational asset management view, but i am not 100% we didn't need to blow it up. i don't think horvat was the right captain for the team and watching pettersson exercising playful dominance over horvat at the allstar game with all those hugs and face mushes like my dog messing with a big puppy tends to confirm that fact.

pettersson likes horvat but is happy horvat is elsewhere.

I’m in the same camp

i agree that is the logical rational asset management view, but i am not 100% we didn't need to blow it up. i don't think horvat was the right captain for the team and watching pettersson exercising playful dominance over horvat at the allstar game with all those hugs and face mushes like my dog messing with a big puppy tends to confirm that fact.

pettersson likes horvat but is happy horvat is elsewhere.

I‘m in the same camp. All the mushiness between EP and Horvat didn’t seem genuine to me and watching the game last night, I got the sense that somehow the team had gotten a weight of its back and was ready to go in a new direction. That’s not to slag Horvat, he was a good player for us but I don’t think he was the leader he was made out to be. I’m also of the opinion that Petterson is not necessarily the best choice for captain either. If Miller is a disruption in the room, I don’t see Petterson or Hughes for that matter have what it takes to counter that. I’m not sure that there’s anyone other than Schenn that’s suitable.

 

[Izzy Goodenough]

"The news hasn’t been announced officially, but it’s just about Vancouver’s most-badly-kept sports media secret right now: MacEwen will soon be named program director for Sportsnet 650, the sports radio station set to launch later this summer."

Craig MacEwen to be named Vancouver Sportsnet radio program director

Three years after he was let go by Rogers Sportsnet as their Vancouver TV head, Craig MacEwen is back — this time in radio.

theprovince.com

 

[rypper]

"The news hasn’t been announced officially, but it’s just about Vancouver’s most-badly-kept sports media secret right now: MacEwen will soon be named program director for Sportsnet 650, the sports radio station set to launch later this summer."

Craig MacEwen to be named Vancouver Sportsnet radio program director

Three years after he was let go by Rogers Sportsnet as their Vancouver TV head, Craig MacEwen is back — this time in radio.

theprovince.com

I'm not really seeing the connection you're making.

MacEwen was a fall all over himself apologist for the Canucks when he worked at 650. There was no spin to big for him to weave, the Canucks could literally do no wrong.

He might as well have already been employed by the Canucks when he was program director for 650.

So now he's going to jeopardize that by leaking to his former work? I imagine he probably looks at them like they're peons and enjoys having control over access.