Value of: Legit youngish starter to Ottawa

[SlafCaufield]

Debrincat, like, chychrun, isn't a rental move.

You make it sound like they were old guys that they brought as a rental to put them over the top...

When in reality it was that the sens had 5 top 6 forwards and 3 top 4 d, so they brought in a 24 year old 40 goal scorer to ADD to their core moving forward. They added a 24 year old defenseman to ADD to their core moving forward.

They now have 6 top 6 forwards and 4 top 4 d, so they can work on shoring their bottom 6 and bottom pair.

I don't understand the confusion on your end.

You're essentially confused why a young team with holes in their lineup filled those holes with young good players to keep? I legitimately don't understand your complaint.

LMAO talk about being out to lunch

 

[Petes2424]

Lol yeah Sens fans sure were proclaiming Talbot as the goalie of the future

Talbot was expected to be an upgrade to our goaltending and provide stability in tandem with Forsberg. Between inconsistent play and injury to both of them, that didn’t happen.

If you find me one Sens fan who speaks about Talbot starting for us more than 2 yrs down the road I’ll delete my account. You won’t find it, though, because you can only ever make points that are based on complete fabrications and exaggerations

I’m around Sens fans daily and have never heard anyone celebrating Talbot as some sort of savior. Not in person, not on the radio and not at games.

Since day one, 90% (of Sen fans) only hoped he’d calm things down in net during the short-term. Most of that remaining 10% were much more hesitant and took a wait and see approach, due to the Sen’s breakdowns in their own end.

There’s always gonna be some kid on the internet exaggerating things. In this case it’s pretty apparent where the exaggeration is coming from.

 

[jbeck5]

LMAO talk about being out to lunch

What? What did I say that was out to lunch?

Are you implying that debrincat and chychrun were brought in as old veterans to win us the cup this year?

And I'm out to lunch? Lol wow.

 

[nergish]

These types of players are not available via trade.

Maybe take a chance on overager, former-WJC Team Canada starter Thomas Milic at the draft?

 

[Arthur Morgan]

Debrincat, like, chychrun, isn't a rental move.

You make it sound like they were old guys that they brought as a rental to put them over the top...

When in reality it was that the sens had 5 top 6 forwards and 3 top 4 d, so they brought in a 24 year old 40 goal scorer to ADD to their core moving forward. They added a 24 year old defenseman to ADD to their core moving forward.

They now have 6 top 6 forwards and 4 top 4 d, so they can work on shoring their bottom 6 and bottom pair.

I don't understand the confusion on your end.

You're essentially confused why a young team with holes in their lineup filled those holes with young good players to keep? I legitimately don't understand your complaint.

yeah but it was clear they were behind Boston, Toronto and Tampa. they improved in a year they shouldnt have,
I have no issues with Chychrun either.

Sens already had most of that anyways along with a 7th overall selected player in the system and might have been in position to potentially win Bedard this year.
look I understand the need to want to get better I just dont understand why it had to happen in this deep of a draft.

Moving Murray makes more sense now after the last person commented but as a young team in a very tough division trading a young goalie that they have been developing for years for a old washed up goalie is something I dont understand

 

[Schemp]

So, Vejmelka?

 

[jbeck5]

yeah but it was clear they were behind Boston, Toronto and Tampa. they improved in a year they shouldnt have,
I have no issues with Chychrun either.

Sens already had most of that anyways along with a 7th overall selected player in the system and might have been in position to potentially win Bedard this year.
look I understand the need to want to get better I just dont understand why it had to happen in this deep of a draft.

Moving Murray makes more sense now after the last person commented but as a young team in a very tough division trading a young goalie that they have been developing for years for a old washed up goalie is something I dont understand

You have to get those improvements when you can though. It's possible that a top liner winger or top pair defenseman aren't available for the next 3-4 years...then what? Just suffer and fall short? Massively overpay?

If your concern is Bedard, they still have their first lottery protected, so it's not like they lost their shot at Bedard if they didn't do well this year.

Also, Ottawas window will be in the next 3-4 years. Other than Bedard, no one from this draft would be helping them in the next few years.

The goal is to make the playoffs in 24. Be ready for a run in 25. Be contenders in 26-27.

Guys who are 17 right now won't help us in the next 4 years like guys who will be 24-28 will. It's about the timing.

We want to compete while everyone is in their mid 20s...not in 6 years when today's draft picks will just be entering their prime and we will have gotten rid of half the current core. That would be a recipe for always being average and just recycling a few good players. Instead, they went to get everyone all at the same age so they can grow together instead of having half your assets not ready yet and then replace the older assets when they're passed their prime.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

You have to get those improvements when you can though. It's possible that a top liner winger or top pair defenseman aren't available for the next 3-4 years...then what? Just suffer and fall short? Massively overpay?

If your concern is Bedard, they still have their first lottery protected, so it's not like they lost their shot at Bedard if they didn't do well this year.

Also, Ottawas window will be in the next 3-4 years. Other than Bedard, no one from this draft would be helping them in the next few years.

The goal is to make the playoffs in 24. Be ready for a run in 25. Be contenders in 26-27.

Guys who are 17 right now won't help us in the next 4 years like guys who will be 24-28 will. It's about the timing.

We want to compete while everyone is in their mid 20s...not in 6 years when today's draft picks will just be entering their prime and we will have gotten rid of half the current core. That would be a recipe for always being average and just recycling a few good players. Instead, they went to get everyone all at the same age so they can grow together instead of having half your assets not ready yet and then replace the older assets when they're passed their prime.

Hey its fine if ur happy with the moves made, I just feel they were done a year early. there are RFAs available every year. besides the DeBrincat trade makes a hell of alot more sense than Gustavsson for Talbot did

 

[jbeck5]

Hey its fine if ur happy with the moves made, I just feel they were done a year early. there are RFAs available every year. besides the DeBrincat trade makes a hell of alot more sense than Gustavsson for Talbot did

I realize I didn't address the Gustavsson for Talbot trade which is probably your biggest gripe.

Gustavsson was one of the best goalie prospects about 2-3 years ago. He was on a lot of people's top 50 prospect lists.

Then he fell off those lists...and then he had a huge stinker of a season...so it was probably more of a "get a decent 1b for this struggling goalie who's value is falling and falling for consecutive years"

For every good goalie prospect that becomes a legit NHL starter, there are like 10 that only become a backup or never consistently make the NHL.

They probably saw sogaard and merilainen as equal prospects, but younger, and figured they could stabilize their goaltending for the next year or two with Talbot and Forsberg providing at least average goaltending, and then sogaard would be knocking at the door to replace one of them, likely Talbot as he's older.

Also, keep in mind that there were older teams like Boston(sounds funny now) and Washington and Pittsburgh that many were saying "it's just a matter of time before they start to fall off" so a lot of people thought that 5 of the teams would be out of the division. They were in the hunt for chychrun all year...so I'm sure the idea was that if Talbot and Forsberg just provide average goaltending, that the sens roster while healthy with Norris and formenton and chychrun added, would only need average goaltending to get into that wild card spot... So the thought was also, why risk potentially making the playoffs by promoting a failing prospect who looks like he'll probably shit the bed and not even provide backup quality goaltending.

They would rather trade a guy who was looking like he couldn't even back up(but has potential that is starting to dwindle) for a veteran who's pretty safe for average to above average goaltending. It made sense not to risk wasting a season where they could realistically make the playoffs.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

I realize I didn't address the Gustavsson for Talbot trade which is probably your biggest gripe.

Gustavsson was one of the best goalie prospects about 2-3 years ago. He was on a lot of people's top 50 prospect lists.

Then he fell off those lists...and then he had a huge stinker of a season...so it was probably more of a "get a decent 1b for this struggling goalie who's value is falling and falling for consecutive years"

For every good goalie prospect that becomes a legit NHL starter, there are like 10 that only become a backup or never consistently make the NHL.

They probably saw sogaard and merilainen as equal prospects, but younger, and figured they could stabilize their goaltending for the next year or two with Talbot and Forsberg providing at least average goaltending, and then sogaard would be knocking at the door to replace one of them, likely Talbot as he's older.

I dunno I feel like I would have given Gustavsson a little bit more of a chance but I get the need to get better. I like the big moves they have made just felt they made little early.
hell now that i think of it even if didnt trade for DeBrincat chances are Ottawa would have been ranked higher than the bottom 10 taking away a realistic chance at bedard

 

[jbeck5]

I dunno I feel like I would have given Gustavsson a little bit more of a chance but I get the need to get better. I like the big moves they have made just felt they made little early.
hell now that i think of it even if didnt trade for DeBrincat chances are Ottawa would have been ranked higher than the bottom 10 taking away a realistic chance at bedard

I also think you're looking at it with hindsight based on the season Gustavsson just had.

If you started a thread last year saying Gustavsson was going to post vezina-like numbers this year, you would have been laughed at. Even if you would have said he would be an average starter this year, they would have likely shut the topic down.

He was coming off a 5-12-1 record with an .892% after years of .887 and .889 in the AHL and .827 in his short ECHL stint.


Basically, you would have put the odds of him being like he is now at very slim.

You have to look at the trade with glasses of where Gustavsson was last summer..not where he is now after a big time surprising year.

Erase this year from his stats. Go look at his numbers before this year. Go look at his game tape. You would see plenty of holes and would have lots of doubt and would have no problem trading him for a guy who just went to the all Star game and posted .911, .915, and .919 the last 3 years.

 

[KevinRedkey]

What? What did I say that was out to lunch?

Are you implying that debrincat and chychrun were brought in as old veterans to win us the cup this year?

And I'm out to lunch? Lol wow.

It's a low-effort troll account. Just ignore it.

 

[jbeck5]

It's a low-effort troll account. Just ignore it.

I reported it as a clear troll and the moderator told me

"what's the big deal, you answered him"

Is this the level of moderating we're getting nowadays?

 

[Thechozen1]

Vejmelka

 

[Bouboumaster]

Montembeault is 26, and he's 0,906 on one of the worst team in the league

 

[Big Muddy]

Sens badly need a good consistent goalie. We’ve never developed one that stayed with us. So I think we need to trade or sign one that is under 30 and that we know is going to be consistent for us. Which teams are willing to do it? Anything is on the table for a package from Ottawa other than Tkachuk, Stützle, and Sanderson. Couple of interesting names like Carter Hart, Jeremy Swayman (I’m sure there are others out there).

Is there a reason it has to be a trade versus Free Agency? There will be new owners purportedly with deep pockets.

 

[PatrickMcC]

Is there a reason it has to be a trade versus Free Agency? There will be new owners purportedly with deep pockets.

Looking at the FA market, there aren’t many goalies that fit my description but you’re right that those goalies (Varlamovs and Jarrys of the nhl) could be a potential fit as well

Montembeault is 26, and he's 0,906 on one of the worst team in the league

I figured the Habs would rather keep him because he’s been pretty good for you guys. Or is the Habs plan to develop Cayden Primeau?

 

[Big Muddy]

Looking at the FA market, there aren’t many goalies that fit my description but you’re right that those goalies (Varlamovs and Jarrys of the nhl) could be a potential fit as well

I guess a lot depends on how one views Forsberg. Ottawa could go with a 1a & 1b situation. Love to get a really good goaltender of course. Hopefully our defense will be better with Chychrun, and Zaitsev gone. I wonder if Kleven might be able to fill a bottom pair role as well, or whether he's bound for the AHL a little more marinating.

 

[Guttersniped]

 

[GOilers88]

I'm just reading through the Talbot trade thread in this forum and is laughable that you think Sens fans werent claiming that Dorion had just pulled off a masterclass and fixed the goaltending

you can keep lying to yourself if that makes you feel better but your smug attitude about it doesnt make you correct

Why are you trying to completely derail the thread? There's literally only one person trying to be a smug little arse here.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

I also think you're looking at it with hindsight based on the season Gustavsson just had.

If you started a thread last year saying Gustavsson was going to post vezina-like numbers this year, you would have been laughed at. Even if you would have said he would be an average starter this year, they would have likely shut the topic down.

He was coming off a 5-12-1 record with an .892% after years of .887 and .889 in the AHL and .827 in his short ECHL stint.


Basically, you would have put the odds of him being like he is now at very slim.

You have to look at the trade with glasses of where Gustavsson was last summer..not where he is now after a big time surprising year.

Erase this year from his stats. Go look at his numbers before this year. Go look at his game tape. You would see plenty of holes and would have lots of doubt and would have no problem trading him for a guy who just went to the all Star game and posted .911, .915, and .919 the last 3 years.

I think I liked Gustavsson little more than the average non-sens fan to be honest. I dunno if I would have moved him. but having said that I didnt expect numbers like he has had, I would have had no problem moving him but I think Id have looked for a longer term option over Talbot.

when it all comes down to it. ignore what alot of people are saying, Sens are building something nice. also didnt help this season that Norris was out all year. sens are trending in a very nice direction. little NHL development and should be ready to go.

I just personally thought most their moves came a year too soon, who knows if Im even right on that. I just know our division is tough

 

[Petes2424]

An offer sheet to Samsonov will be the start of a new era of the “Battle of Ontario.”

 

[LTIR]

Campbell is young at heart

 

[Bouboumaster]

I figured the Habs would rather keep him because he’s been pretty good for you guys. Or is the Habs plan to develop Cayden Primeau?

Unless we're picking Bedard, I don't see the Habs competing anytime soon, so...

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Sens badly need a good consistent goalie. We’ve never developed one that stayed with us. So I think we need to trade or sign one that is under 30 and that we know is going to be consistent for us. Which teams are willing to do it? Anything is on the table for a package from Ottawa other than Tkachuk, Stützle, and Sanderson. Couple of interesting names like Carter Hart, Jeremy Swayman (I’m sure there are others out there).

Filip Gustavsson would be a good option I think.