Confirmed with Link: Leafs trade Beck, Finn, Gibson, Nilsson and Verhaeghe for Grabner

[ACC1224]

Really, I thought they make around 750K on average.

Not in the Minors, they make less than most people do. Big reason why Players push for one way contracts.

 

[showtime8]

Hunter has a strong talent elevator reputation and if one trust him then I wouldn't lose to much sleep over these marginal prospects shipped out here.

Toss in that Leafs already have better prospects at all positions then the ones they dealt and accept they simply lopped off the bottom of the depth chart with prospects that Hunter didn't see a Leafs future with as he had nothing to do with any of them.

I like the fact that if your going to scorch the earth of the past then doing it 5 at once helps accelerate the process and now those new free contracts can be deployed strategically to bring in more future at the expense of past mistakes.

I'd honestly like to see how close they had all 3 goalies that aren't with their main team.

To me, I thought Gibson was on top of the depth chart.


But it's not surprising that they would trade all guys that weren't drafted by the current regime. Burke and Nonis did it when they first arrived with the team. I believe they cleared almost the entire 2008 draft class.

Each manager wants to bring in their own guys and really put an imprint on the team.

 

[Mess]

Leafs prospect depth chart of signed prospects

Forwards
Nylander
Marner
Kapanen
Brown
Leipsic
Gauthier
Leivo
Johnson
Soshnikov
Carrick
Bailey
Hyman
------------------
Beck
Verhaeghe


Defense
Dermott
Percy
Harrington
Marincin
Granberg
Valiev
Loov
--------------------
Finn
Nilsson

Goalies
Bibeau
Sparks
---------------
Gibson


To me it looks like Leafs simply lopped off the bottom of the prospect pool (signed prospects) and have better players and options than the ones removed.

Note: That prospect pool doesn't include drafted but unsigned prospects as they don't free up a contract but still might be better then some of the ones traded.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Not in the Minors, they make less than most people do. Big reason why Players push for one way contracts.

Some AHL vets / NHL injury call up types might get a certain amount guaranteed as well, or just a large AHL salary, but yea. Most of the time it's 60-100k in the AHL.

 

[TMLegend]

After looking at Grabner's advanced stats, I can say this was probably a Mike Babcock influenced move. I don't remember the article or where I saw it, but Babcock does a little exercise in the off-season and calculates the amount of goals he expects out of his lineup. Apparently, in this article, the Maple Leafs weren't where they needed to be in this regard.

http://public.tableau.com/shared/P7FHDT62D?:display_count=yes

Grabner scores goals at a well above average first line rate, and produces points at low-end first rate.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Whether or not they will isn't really the point though, is it?

Management clearly felt that they weren't worth holding onto, otherwise they wouldn't have used five of them to get an average third liner.

Not unless Mgt wanted to win this year, and felt Verhaeghe was worth the price to upgrade our top 9. Remember, there are season ticket holders(I have a share to see 2 games a year if I want them) that this team is still responsible in putting out the best on ice product for paying customers.

 

[Mess]

Not unless Mgt wanted to win this year, and felt Verhaeghe was worth the price to upgrade our top 9. Remember, there are season ticket holders(I have a share to see 2 games a year if I want them) that this team is still responsible in putting out the best on ice product for paying customers.

Grabner is one of the fastest NHL skaters in the league and fans should not be surprised if Babcock tosses Grabner over the boards early and often in 3v3 OT.

With that much open ice and a player that few can skate with will make for many scoring chances for him and result in OT wins for the Leafs.

 

[Menzinger]

Not unless Mgt wanted to win this year, and felt Verhaeghe was worth the price to upgrade our top 9. Remember, there are season ticket holders(I have a share to see 2 games a year if I want them) that this team is still responsible in putting out the best on ice product for paying customers.

He hasn't hit 30+ points since 2012, it's a bit of an oversell to think he's going make a significant impact on the roster.

Time will tell, but I'll be very, very surprised if he finishes the season with the Leafs.

The Leafs certainly have an obligation to entertain paying customers - no dispute there, but I don't think management and the the team's coaches have high expectations for the team this season.

 

[Fogelhund]

As far as I can tell, Grabner is what we had to take back, in order to free up roster places, with us giving away prospects that don't fit into the future.

 

[deletethis]

As far as I can tell, Grabner is what we had to take back, in order to free up roster places, with us giving away prospects that don't fit into the future.

Ding ding ding! We have a winner. What they do with these contract spaces is what will determine the value of this trade. Grabner was a healthy scratch in last year's playoffs. He's a dump, not some high value trade deadline chip. I'm sure the Leafs will give him a fair chance to earn a substantial role but just as likely he performs at the same level he performed last season for the Islanders and has about as much worth as David Booth had last spring.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Ding ding ding! We have a winner. What they do with these contract spaces is what will determine the value of this trade. Grabner was a healthy scratch in last year's playoffs. He's a dump, not some high value trade deadline chip. I'm sure the Leafs will give him a fair chance to earn a substantial role but just as likely he performs at the same level he performed last season for the Islanders and has as much worth as David Booth had last spring.

Let's just hope that Grabner scores a lot more than Booth did and it happens before the trade deadline. I believe it was after that when Booth started getting a lot more goals and people on here were worried he was messing up their tank plan at getting the best draft pick possible.

 

[Damisoph]

That is not a minority opinion lol.

The opinion that Verhaege > Gauthier? Yes, extreme minority.

 

[Durrr]

Not unless Mgt wanted to win this year, and felt Verhaeghe was worth the price to upgrade our top 9. Remember, there are season ticket holders(I have a share to see 2 games a year if I want them) that this team is still responsible in putting out the best on ice product for paying customers.

Highly doubt management wants to win now, and with stop gaps no less. Sounds like you're suggesting exactly what we've had to endure for the past decade.

 

[Drew75]

Snow has come a long way as a GM. I used to question his IQ as a GM. Not anymore. Lou is sharp too, probably a good deal for both teams.

I have to think Snow wants the 3M capspace. And Lou wants to make the playoffs this year by getting a NHL ready player. We will see if this is a deal that will help both teams when we can evaluate it better with time.

I still really don't get how you look at our roster and see playoffs or even more so - how you look at Grabner as that 'missing piece' to push us closer to the playoffs.

I know you're convinced they're in a 'win now' mode and although you are in a VERY small minority who doesn't see the plan - I do give you credit for your convictions. I get that you're focused on the fact the players who went out are younger than the player coming back (although, if you get past that fact, you'll see there are other factors at play, and it wasn't actually a hockey trade but rather contract space for cap space deal) - but seriously, do you go down the lineup of reclamation projects (we could have as many as 9-11 players going for a 'fresh start' on their careers) and see playoffs???

I don't see anything on our roster beside a lot of temporary pieces here to generate more mid-round picks and insulate the kids from the rest of the 'tear down'.

 

[WTFMAN99]

I still really don't get how you look at our roster and see playoffs or even more so - how you look at Grabner as that 'missing piece' to push us closer to the playoffs.

I know you're convinced they're in a 'win now' mode and although you are in a VERY small minority who doesn't see the plan - I do give you credit for your convictions. I get that you're focused on the fact the players who went out are younger than the player coming back (although, if you get past that fact, you'll see there are other factors at play, and it wasn't actually a hockey trade but rather contract space for cap space deal) - but seriously, do you go down the lineup of reclamation projects (we could have as many as 9-11 players going for a 'fresh start' on their careers) and see playoffs???

I don't see anything on our roster beside a lot of temporary pieces here to generate more mid-round picks and insulate the kids from the rest of the 'tear down'.

Well I think you and I are on the same page lol.

 

[yubbers]

what an odd deal. Don't know what to make of it

 

[FreeBird]

Didn't see that coming. That's a lot of contracts we're unloading.

More of Morrison's mistakes shown the door, he remains as head of pro scouting.

 

[Swayze*]

More of Morrison's mistakes shown the door, he remains as head of pro scouting.

Exactly

I don't get why he still has a job and is so revered around here.

 

[Guy Boucher]

More of Morrison's mistakes shown the door, he remains as head of pro scouting.

Hunter audited all the scouts. The fact they kept him around must mean he has some value and it's very possible his suggestions were neglected by past management.

 

[WTFMAN99]

More of Morrison's mistakes shown the door, he remains as head of pro scouting.

It seems odd to me, but then again, we don't know what mandate he was given, what to look for etc. Either way looks like he's moved over to the pro side which means he won't have a say in our draft going forward.

 

[FreeBird]

It seems odd to me, but then again, we don't know what mandate he was given, what to look for etc. Either way looks like he's moved over to the pro side which means he won't have a say in our draft going forward.

Maybe he'll have better luck evaluating pro's than amateurs.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

I still really don't get how you look at our roster and see playoffs or even more so - how you look at Grabner as that 'missing piece' to push us closer to the playoffs.

I know you're convinced they're in a 'win now' mode and although you are in a VERY small minority who doesn't see the plan - I do give you credit for your convictions. I get that you're focused on the fact the players who went out are younger than the player coming back (although, if you get past that fact, you'll see there are other factors at play, and it wasn't actually a hockey trade but rather contract space for cap space deal) - but seriously, do you go down the lineup of reclamation projects (we could have as many as 9-11 players going for a 'fresh start' on their careers) and see playoffs???

I don't see anything on our roster beside a lot of temporary pieces here to generate more mid-round picks and insulate the kids from the rest of the 'tear down'.

Grabner is an upgrade. He is not the missing piece. No one said this. Even Kessel could not single handedly lift the Leafs into the playoffs.

I do see the Grabner deal as a positive that the team is going to look at proactive ways to improve the on ice product.

To me, there is nothing wrong with winning now, while continuing to draft and develop.

Build up a winning culture, bring back respectability, have pride in the Maple Leaf. And let the scouts continue to find talent and develop.

I believe there is a fine line in winning and losing in the NHL. Talent is just one component. There are many talented teams that miss the playoffs yearly. Just as there are less talented teams that make the playoffs.

The Leafs in my opinion have the components to make the playoffs. I have no doubt in this.

 

[Jack Bauer]

The Leafs in my opinion have the components to make the playoffs. I have no doubt in this.

Time will prove one way or another but I think it's laughable to think we'll be anywhere near a playoff spot with this roster.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Maybe he'll have better luck evaluating pro's than amateurs.

Here is hoping - I just find it weird how our draft has looked from Burke to Nonis, and now this year with neither (although Mark Hunter was this year)

Burke has historically drafted poorly, and if he's given poor direction in terms of what to look for in players, then he will draft crap players.

That being said the Leafs haven't drafted a lot of talent and it looks poorly on him.

That being said this was a really solid draft for us. I liked some picks in the past such as Nylander, Toninato, and Joshua. By no means have they proven anything, but I actually feel like they might make an impact later, although Nylander is a pretty obvious one. Let's hope we keep this going so we can become a decent organization again.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Time will prove one way or another but I think it's laughable to think we'll be anywhere near a playoff spot with this roster.

I have no problem with letting time tell the story. I have great confidence in Babcock and Lamoriello. Also I have confidence some of our younger players. Rielly and Nylander are going to force their ways into key roles for this line up. Couple that with some smart signings, the Grabner deal, and maybe more to come. This team will be a lot better this year.