Post-Game Talk: Leafs lose 4-2

[fahad203]

It's only been 4 games
But this team is just not likeable at all.

 

[TMLAM34]

SOFT, SOFT, SOFT. Take away their video games. This group that dubass has put together are coach killers. Babcock, gone, Keefe soon to be gone, both for trying to get them to play the game right, like men. Issue isn't coaching, it's the players.

The GM isn’t helping either. Trading players like Kadri and Brown for example is pretty idiotic. Those are the kind of players you keep in your organization and play the game the right way.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Also, one last thing, but can we tell our PP to allow our defensemen to shoot the puck with purpose more often?

Out of the 50 most played defensemen on the PP over the past 3 years, Rielly is among the lowest. So is Barrie. If Gio and Sandin had more minutes on our PP, they too would also be among the lowest. We flat out refuse to use our defensemen on the PP, and we can't even say that it is because "Rielly has a crap shot". Barrie, for example, is 8th in PP points over the last 3 years and is 12th in PP goals with 8th. Clearly doesn't have a crap shot. Giordano is a respectable 25th in goals with 6 and I don't think anyone says he has a poor shot. Both suffer from the same thing as Rielly.

You don't need to shoot to score. You don't need to one-time it or make it a total bomb. Just shoot with purpose, shoot to throw off the other team a little bit, and definitely shoot when it makes sense to shoot. Rielly looked off some good opportunities on the PP and it would help us not constantly cycle around on the PP without getting any shots. And especially with the team we have, we should be strong with entries and in the faceoff dot, so if they do result in the other team getting the puck and clearing/stopping it, then I would rather that than passing it around constantly looking for the perfect shot. Shooting more on defense should make it easier for the forwards to do that going forward.

What we need more than anything on the PP is someone who will stand in front of the goalie and screen him, so that point shots might work. If the puck is at the point, Tavares is usually off to the side waiting for a pass or rebound. When the puck is down low, he moves to the slot and looks for a pass. The whole philosophy seems to be for the other four to move the puck around and around until Matthews or Nylander get a clear shot, or JT is left alone in the slot. Easy to defend.

 

[Brown Dog]

losing to non-playoff teams in game 4 tells you how they will do in the playoffs?

I'm more worried about what they will do in the second half of the season and how they look, that should tell us more.



no thank you

My perception is that this core has been plagued by a tendency to play down to their opponents and take nights off. In this ultimate prove-it season for this core, it's discouraging to me that we're seeing the same issues around consistency of effort and execution, especially against weaker competition.

Bleeding points to bottom feeders is exactly how you finish second or third in the division instead of winning it.

 

[LeafLoyalist]

Poor execution, and even worse officiating.

First part was enough, second part is a cop out. This team shouldn't make officiating a factor (not that they even were tonight) against the Yotes.

 

[LeafLoyalist]

I have no sympathy for a team that's selling championship pursuit and process that drops 2x games in a week to Connor Bedard Tankies.

No show for 45 minutes, get burned by bad calls. No sympathy. Wasting everyone's time here.

'Bunred by bad call' not even true, if anything they were gifted PP on 1st goal, and Reilly made a clear cut hand pass. Let's not even claim officiating was a factor, it should never be against a bottom team.

 

[mikeyz]

He also kept sparks over mcbackup.

Traded Kadri for barrie and kerfoot.

Traded for an injured foligno.

Overpaid for an injury prone Murray.

These are but a few examples from a massive list. Yet the dubas fan boys will tell you he's great at drafting, amazing at trades, good at signing players and one of the best gms in the league.

I've been saying it for a while now. He's bordering on JFJ level bad.

 

[Twine Tickler]

The lack of effort, or at least lack of intelligent effort has been the issue in the four games.

Some weak goals, both ends.

It is early, and maybe their creative juices aren't flowing yet, there hasn't been much if anything (other than Tavares line) that makes you think this is a talent loaded team.

The timing has been off for the big boys. That will come, I am not worried about that. It literally was the exact same issue as last season. It took Matthews 4-5 games before he even scored a goal and Marner was well below a pt/game for a while.

We should still be winning games without that line producing though. Unforced errors have been the reason we've lost 2 games this season. Unnecessary aggressive D-men jumping into the play followed by sloppiness with the puck lead to the loss in MTL, and our inability to clear the zone was the reason we lost last night.

I am confident it is just early season cobwebs. But that said, we could have done a better job at potentially managing this rust with either a better lineup or less aggressive system. It has been no where near good enough from coaching to the play on the ice.

There needs to be accountability, and personally I think that needs to start from Sheldon. There have been 2 instances already where he's publicly called out his team, yet he's taken zero accountability for his own decisions. For the record, I believe in Sheldon as a coach. I do not hate him or his style. He just needs to understand that he plays a role in this failure as well.

I think the biggest issue I have with what I've seen from management/coaching this season is a disconnect from their words and their actions. They said indirectly to the media, and likely more direct to the players at the end of last season that there would be openings on the roster that they were expecting these guys to step into. Thes player's included: Malgin, Holmberg, Steeves, Robby, Anderson, Douglas...etc. Only Malgin made the team, because they had already backfilled the remaining vacancies with NAK, ZAR, and Jarnkrok before camp even began. for the record, I am a fan of those pickups, but I am not a fan of telling our players to put in work with the anticipation that there would be something to gain, only to have there be nothing at the end. Robertson flat out earned his roster spot and did exactly what was asked of him in the offseason. Only to be turned away because of a numbers game he has no control over.

Then you have Sheldon calling out his team for not being prepared, when he is continually icing questionable lineups. Holl and Muzzin has not worked for a while now, but it's the hill he seemingly wants to die on. The Kallgren of Sammy decision yesterday was just another thing.

People on here who have read my posts should know I very rarely throw stones at the management/coaching staff. I think Kyle is an amazing GM, and genuinely think he will get us to where we need to go. But I also believe firmly in being accountable. Which is something he is not afraid of doing, but has yet to show this season, and something we definitely have not seen from Sheldon. At the end of the day 2-2-0 against the opponents we've played thus far is not good enough. Period. Players, Staff, and Management need to look themselves in the mirror and figure out what they need to do better

 

[Stephen]

Good observations on the radio today talking about how when the Leafs cycle the zone and hold the puck and dominate lesser talent it’s usually when they are at their worst.

The other team is usually parking the bus and covering the slot while the Leafs look for parking space and never seem to get body positioning into the slot or crease area.

In a possession sense zone time and shot count are seen as positives but when we see too much perimeter cycling it means they’re held off of the critical areas.

One team that always had this tendency were the Jacques Martin Senators. They ran circles around the Pat Quinn Leafs yet we seemed to always score timely goals against them and the Sens always got goalied.

 

[fahad203]

Good observations on the radio today talking about how when the Leafs cycle the zone and hold the puck and dominate lesser talent it’s usually when they are at their worst.

The other team is usually parking the bus and covering the slot while the Leafs look for parking space and never seem to get body positioning into the slot or crease area.

In a possession sense zone time and shot count are seen as positives but when we see too much perimeter cycling it means they’re held off of the critical areas.

One team that always had this tendency were the Jacques Martin Senators. They ran circles around the Pat Quinn Leafs yet we seemed to always score timely goals against them and the Sens always got goalied.

They look like kids doing cirlces around parents and just tiring themselves out
Puck possession is not the same as board work. Board work, grinding are different, they use the body, tire the defense out

The secret is out. Everyone knows how the leafs are going to play, even when they hold on to the puck, they know who the shooter will be

Just wait it out until Holl or someone on the point makes a mistake for a 2 on 1. Which we have given up plenty off

 

[Fogelhund]

The truth is spoken here. Terrible game for sure, but so many posters treat every game, every period as a referendum, which as pointed out, makes them miserable, and their posting miserable.

""

 

[ACC1224]

keefe calling out his guys

What a stupid thing to say. This team with no elite players just beat your team, you hack.

 

[maskingagent]

looks like Kieffe has lost the room. Trotz won't be any better as you have overpaid unproven coddled stars who just want to dance to Hall and Oates and wave their hands to garbage goals

 

[Mess]

I'm surprised by the reactions over the loss.

Because anyone that follows their Leafs closely could have posted this yesterday morning before the game.

Leafs have a tendency to the play to the level of their competition so this feels like a trap game.

Leafs are going to lose.

The outcome, their play and performance were all highly predictable, in advance, because its been a trend in existence since Keefe arrived.

The thing that surprises me most is "Everyone" knows this including the Leafs coach and he is incapable of preparing the Leafs to compete and change this narrative. That is why we lost to Columbus and Montreal in the playoffs being the far superior team on paper.

The more things change the more they stay the same, and swapping out your goalies and a few depth players annually is not going to fix this problem.

 

[Stephen]

They look like kids doing cirlces around parents and just tiring themselves out
Puck possession is not the same as board work. Board work, grinding are different, they use the body, tire the defense out

The secret is out. Everyone knows how the leafs are going to play, even when they hold on to the puck, they know who the shooter will be

Just wait it out until Holl or someone on the point makes a mistake for a 2 on 1. Which we have given up plenty off

Kyle Dubas is a big fan of Pep Guardiola possession football and the All or Nothing before Toronto was Manchester City. They seem to really be trying to implement a high skill brand of European football to hockey tactics. Hold the puck, kick back for regroups, tons of touches of the puck before anything happens, massive offensive zone time. It’s like they’re playing for a different set of metrics and markers for success and ignoring so much of hockey basics.

Aka: Go to the net in straight ones with speed, get the puck on net, grab a dirty rebound. Like no. We want to circle the zone twice, do a little touch give and go, reverse half way down the side wall counter clockwise, drop it to the point. Go down the opposite wall. Curl back.

 

[CelticDruid]

What a stupid thing to say. This team with no elite players just beat your team, you hack.

Very disrespectful to any team even though it's true. He has done this several times before.

 

[Apex Predator]

looks like Kieffe has lost the room. Trotz won't be any better as you have overpaid unproven coddled stars who just want to dance to Hall and Oates and wave their hands to garbage goals

If he’s lost the room it says more about our core. The core can’t be tuning out another coach. The core was given everything before they accomplished anything.

 

[blue stick]

after all was said and done, more was said than done

 

[Fogelhund]

What a horrible comment. To me, that means you don’t have a team. It’s up to 1 or 2 guys to always be the difference? No wonder we lose in the playoffs.

In order to win, you need your best players, to be your best players. It's the same in every sport, all the time. Our best players weren't the best players last night, no shame in saying the truth.

 

[stealth1]

Losing aside how did we do in expected goals?

Ask @Dekes For Days

 

[Fogelhund]

looks like Kieffe has lost the room. Trotz won't be any better as you have overpaid unproven coddled stars who just want to dance to Hall and Oates and wave their hands to garbage goals

Knee jerk reaction.

 

[stealth1]

My perception is that this core has been plagued by a tendency to play down to their opponents and take nights off. In this ultimate prove-it season for this core, it's discouraging to me that we're seeing the same issues around consistency of effort and execution, especially against weaker competition.

Bleeding points to bottom feeders is exactly how you finish second or third in the division instead of winning it.

Part of it is they rely too much on their talent to win. Very rare do you see them outwork other teams.

 

[Mess]

What a stupid thing to say. This team with no elite players just beat your team, you hack.

 

[Stephen]

What a stupid thing to say. This team with no elite players just beat your team, you hack.

Keefe is such a poorly spoken goober. Even if you’re going to challenge your elite players there’s something distasteful about a pro coach punching down on another team that just beat you.

 

[ACC1224]

Very disrespectful to any team even though it's true. He has done this several times before.

Agreed, no need at all to mention the other team.

Keefe is such a poorly spoken goober. Even if you’re going to challenge your elite players there’s something distasteful about a pro coach punching down on another team that just beat you.

That's exactly it.