Player Discussion Kirby Dach: Welcome to Montreal

[aresknights]

The new group of LA or Montreal? Never mind, both are in good position for a rebuilt.

So MB left the Habs in a good position for a rebuild?

 

[MonkeyBusiness]

So MB left the Habs in a good position for a rebuild?

Objectively speaking, aside from his contractual blunders, there were a lot of assets to trade and acquire picks out of. Bergevin had accumulated a fair amount of talent, but his team building skills were bad and he relied too heavily on Price being the elite goalie that he was. Once Price fell victim to injuries, his mediocre team truly showed its true colors.

I'm not saying this to defend Bergevin (I can't believe I have to walk on eggshells for this), but there are teams who start their rebuilds in a far worse position than the Habs were when Hughes inherited the club. I believe Toronto and Edmonton a few years ago fit the bill. Granted Edmonton came off three consecutive 1st overall picks, but the talent around those three picks was atrocious.

 

[CaptainKirk]

Monahan with all his injuries won't be better than a healthy Hoffman. And Drouin is still a huge enigma.

Acquiring Monahan was for me a huge mistake.

We traded future considerations for Monahan and a conditional first. If he’s bad, sit him. If he’s good, trade him for futures. Worst case he’s gone at the end of the year anyway. Best case the trade brings us a first +. How is that a mistake? If we’re desperate for cap space, trade Hoffman + a 3rd for nothing. We’re still ahead.

 

[CHfan1]

Monahan with all his injuries won't be better than a healthy Hoffman. And Drouin is still a huge enigma.

Acquiring Monahan was for me a huge mistake.

Why, they had cap space to use, since Price was going on LTIR and they got a 1st round pick because of it (for a player that is an UFA after this season). Best case scenario is Monahan works out and they trade him at the deadline, worst case he doesn’t and the Habs have a 1st round pick because of it.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Why, they had cap space to use, since Price was going on LTIR and they got a 1st round pick because of it (for a player that is an UFA after this season). Best case scenario is Monahan works out and they trade him at the deadline, worst case he doesn’t and the Habs have a 1st round pick because of it.

Lmao did I read someone actually thinks a free 1st round pick was a bad trade?

 

[ReHabs]

Objectively speaking, aside from his contractual blunders, there were a lot of assets to trade and acquire picks out of. Bergevin had accumulated a fair amount of talent, but his team building skills were bad and he relied too heavily on Price being the elite goalie that he was. Once Price fell victim to injuries, his mediocre team truly showed its true colors.

I'm not saying this to defend Bergevin (I can't believe I have to walk on eggshells for this), but there are teams who start their rebuilds in a far worse position than the Habs were when Hughes inherited the club. I believe Toronto and Edmonton a few years ago fit the bill. Granted Edmonton came off three consecutive 1st overall picks, but the talent around those three picks was atrocious.

This isn’t an objective analysis…

For one, no one else could’ve accumulated anything except Bergevin… because he was the GM for ten years. He was horse-trading for his own sake not his successor. The Habs didn’t have a single PPG player at any time in Bergevin’s tenure in a league with dozens of them just last year alone.

The Habs didn’t have any blue chip prospects at the time of Bergevin’s firing, and especially no one who was on track to become a 1D (sorely missing for years). Worse yet, no good centre prospect either despite a dearth of centres in the organization for ten whole years.

Romanov seemed like a middle pairing guy at best and Suzuki is a terrific player who’d be a 2C on any of the recent Cup Champions. Optimistic views would have a “budding core” of Suzuki, Caufield (in the pits with just one goal, at the time of Bergevin’s firing), and Romanov. And that’s it. Arguably the worst “core” in the NHL. Even Arizona has Clayton Keller, and Buffalo has Dahlin (among others).

In a cap system “contractual blunders” is a whole big chunk of management. See how some teams dumped very good players for nothing except freed-up cap space. Bergevin committed 6.5m and a NMC to Gallagher, among many other heinous contracts made worse by hiring regressive coaches.

 

[BLONG7]

This isn’t an objective analysis…

For one, no one else could’ve accumulated anything except Bergevin… because he was the GM for ten years. He was horse-trading for his own sake not his successor. The Habs didn’t have a single PPG player at any time in Bergevin’s tenure in a league with dozens of them just last year alone.

The Habs didn’t have any blue chip prospects at the time of Bergevin’s firing, and especially no one who was on track to become a 1D (sorely missing for years). Worse yet, no good centre prospect either despite a dearth of centres in the organization for ten whole years.

Romanov seemed like a middle pairing guy at best and Suzuki is a terrific player who’d be a 2C on any of the recent Cup Champions. Optimistic views would have a “budding core” of Suzuki, Caufield (in the pits with just one goal, at the time of Bergevin’s firing), and Romanov. And that’s it. Arguably the worst “core” in the NHL. Even Arizona has Clayton Keller, and Buffalo has Dahlin (among others).

In a cap system “contractual blunders” is a whole big chunk of management. See how some teams dumped very good players for nothing except freed-up cap space. Bergevin committed 6.5m and a NMC to Gallagher, among many other heinous contracts made worse by hiring regressive coaches.

So many mistakes.......so many.
Having no one to be accountable on a day to day, or season to season basis, it caught up with him.
The clown is not likely to ever be a GM of an NHL team again.

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

Explain how?...California food? I don't know. Habs systems for years were defence oriented. He did play first line with the best wingers. If this is the case then Armia is a 30 goals scorer on another team. Too bad we cannot monetize extrapolation.

Californian food is the key in that story, hehe,
LA Kings did have a good moving puck system when the won 2 SC,
Habs had a boring defensive system, they defended their zone looking like an octopus on the ice, no joke I saw 4 players sliding on the ice to block shots in 5 seconds one night. That was embarrasing to watch. The players by keep doing that had just enough energy to skate to the bench, I mean they never had enough gas left on tank to start an attack. Crossing zones, being creative crossing lines, they sucked badly. All the opposite with LA Kings.

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

So many mistakes.......so many.
Having no one to be accountable on a day to day, or season to season basis, it caught up with him.
The clown is not likely to ever be a GM of an NHL team again.

The only positive thing is that when Bergy drop, he drop for real. That gave us Slaf, Mesar, Beck and Hutson.
Next year is gonna be a good draft year and we'll draft soon. So the falling of Bergy's team is total and the draft pick is 1 to 5 next year. Two good pick rank in a row. Tank you Bergy for tanking.

 

[Runner77]

I like your lines calvaince!

I’m only answering this post cause it’s the first time I see the use of “calvince” (you spelled it incorrectly, though, lol) on this forum.

“Calvince”, a variation of “calvaire”, is a mild québécois swear word. I always look for originality in the use of words or expressions. I can’t however remember the last time I actually heard someone use it so kudos to you for digging that out from “les boules à mites.”

 

[Kaiden Ghoul]

Monahan with all his injuries won't be better than a healthy Hoffman. And Drouin is still a huge enigma.

Acquiring Monahan was for me a huge mistake.

We acquired Monahan and a first

Lets see if MSL can do something with Drouin, its is last year on that contract anyway

Dvorak was producing under St Louis and Gally has something to prove,maybe there could be something with that line

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

I’m only answering this post cause it’s the first time I see the use of “calvince” (you spelled it incorrectly, though, lol) on this forum.

“Calvince”, a variation of “calvaire”, is a mild québécois swear word. I always look for originality in the use of words or expressions. I can’t however remember the last time I actually heard someone use it so kudos to you for digging that out from “les boules à mites.”

As a matter of fact I used it because I found it boule a mite and funny, like an old souvenir of 1974, lol. The poster who I was answering have calvaince spelled this way at the third line of his desciption, so I used it back. Go check the poster with Youppi on skates. It's like a little treasure hidden. And yes it's not well written but because it's a quebecois word and not officially in dictionary (french of France), the spelling is quebecois dictionary or logic approximate. But I agree it should be calvince. The 'a' makes it sounds the same but he's unnessary.

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

We acquired Monahan and a first

Lets see if MSL can do something with Drouin, its is last year on that contract anyway

Dvorak was producing under St Louis and Gally has something to prove,maybe there could be something with that line

Not everything will be bad. Or not as bad as last year. The players you mention can do more, all 3 of them.
Maybe Armia better and most of all ; Anderson.
If MLS can tune up Anderson, we'll have an interresting team to watch.

 

[dinodebino]

Monahan is just passing by. The first was the key prize.

 

[jsol]

I’m only answering this post cause it’s the first time I see the use of “calvince” (you spelled it incorrectly, though, lol) on this forum.

“Calvince”, a variation of “calvaire”, is a mild québécois swear word. I always look for originality in the use of words or expressions. I can’t however remember the last time I actually heard someone use it so kudos to you for digging that out from “les boules à mites.”

I used to joke that I’d name my boy Calvince, but I had three daughters. And people rarely got it. Nice to see this reference!

 

[Habs]

Monahan with all his injuries won't be better than a healthy Hoffman. And Drouin is still a huge enigma.

Acquiring Monahan was for me a huge mistake.

I agree. Careful though, he's a legend already around here, you will be attacked.

 

[dinodebino]

I agree. Careful though, he's a legend already around here, you will be attacked.

This trade was all about the first. Monahan was fodder to get the first. I doubt he reverts back to his younger and healthier self.

I mean, when the team PAYS to get rid of you, it says a lot, dixit Billy Beane.

 

[Habs]

This trade was all about the first. Monahan was fodder to get the first. I doubt he reverts back to his younger and healthier self.

I mean, when the team PAYS to get rid of you, it says a lot, dixit Billy Beane.

Yeah, I get it, maybe he can teach the young bucks a few things too

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

I used to joke that I’d name my boy Calvince, but I had three daughters. And people rarely got it. Nice to see this reference!

The mild swear I use the most is simonac. But I should use calvince too.
Lol, no more tabarnouche for me.

 

[Kaiden Ghoul]

Right. We need players to kill penalties. Evans, Armia or kids like Heineman or RHP have to be in that line up.

Heineman and Beck has potentiel for that 3rd line

But this year who cares… just put the player in a position to suceed to raise their value… Monahan and Dadonov come to mind

 

[Kudo Shinichi]

Fans weren't wrong. Lehkonen and Danault couldn't score on a soccer net in their last few seasons with the Habs. The question is who is to blame. Since Lehkonen was much better offensively after Ducharme was canned I tend to believe a string of worthless incompetent coaches are mostly to blame.

Lehkonen was playing well under Ducharme. He didn't improve offensively after the coaching change.

Under Ducharme:
7 goals and 18 pts in the last 29 games
4 goals and 9 pts in the last 12 games

Under St. Louis:
6 goals and 10 pts in 16 games

With Colorado:
6 goals and 9 pts in 16 games

 

[SlafySZN]

He did show yesterday that he is a really good playmaker. If Pitlick was a better goal scorer, Dach could had at least 2 A

I'm really not the biggest Hoffman fan, but I would be curious to see him on the wing of Dach. At least, he could finish Dach plays

I wanna see Caufield on his wing on at least 1 or 2 pre-season games

 

[Rob Sense]

i thought this was the Dach thread?

 

[Habs Halifax]

Objectively speaking, aside from his contractual blunders, there were a lot of assets to trade and acquire picks out of. Bergevin had accumulated a fair amount of talent, but his team building skills were bad and he relied too heavily on Price being the elite goalie that he was. Once Price fell victim to injuries, his mediocre team truly showed its true colors.

I'm not saying this to defend Bergevin (I can't believe I have to walk on eggshells for this), but there are teams who start their rebuilds in a far worse position than the Habs were when Hughes inherited the club. I believe Toronto and Edmonton a few years ago fit the bill. Granted Edmonton came off three consecutive 1st overall picks, but the talent around those three picks was atrocious.

There is no way to spin this. There are and will be many parts in our future core that come from Bergevin/Timmins era. Yeah, he had flaws but some fans can't ride middle ground. It's either pump or deflate narratives.

It's kind of like trying to criticize Gainey as our GM. Very popular GM in our herd so fans will stick up for him even if you bring up good criticism. It's the opposite effect with Bergevin.

 

[MonkeyBusiness]

This isn’t an objective analysis…

For one, no one else could’ve accumulated anything except Bergevin… because he was the GM for ten years. He was horse-trading for his own sake not his successor. The Habs didn’t have a single PPG player at any time in Bergevin’s tenure in a league with dozens of them just last year alone.

The Habs didn’t have any blue chip prospects at the time of Bergevin’s firing, and especially no one who was on track to become a 1D (sorely missing for years). Worse yet, no good centre prospect either despite a dearth of centres in the organization for ten whole years.

Romanov seemed like a middle pairing guy at best and Suzuki is a terrific player who’d be a 2C on any of the recent Cup Champions. Optimistic views would have a “budding core” of Suzuki, Caufield (in the pits with just one goal, at the time of Bergevin’s firing), and Romanov. And that’s it. Arguably the worst “core” in the NHL. Even Arizona has Clayton Keller, and Buffalo has Dahlin (among others).

In a cap system “contractual blunders” is a whole big chunk of management. See how some teams dumped very good players for nothing except freed-up cap space. Bergevin committed 6.5m and a NMC to Gallagher, among many other heinous contracts made worse by hiring regressive coaches.

Obviously, what is even the point of the sentence in bold? Evidently if we had had a GM with a bit of talent our rebuild or our club would have probably been better (depending on who you hire). But the question was did Bergevin leave us in a good position for a rebuild. I didn't say yes outrightly, because I don't believe he left us in a good position, but when you look at the past certain teams who've started their rebuilds and became contenders were worse off than we were. Honestly, I don't get why you felt the need to write out such a long post when most of the things you bring up are obvious mistakes on Bergevin's part and salient reasons why he was fired. I disagree with none of your points nor does anything you bring up counter my original post. The only thing I wanted to bring up was that Hughes and Gorton at least had something to work with. Could it have been better, well, for sure. He (Bergevin) was a bad GM, and if it would have been better he's probably still there managing the club. How the f*** that was not an objective analysis eludes me, just because he was horrendous at his job doesn't mean there weren't players of value to trade and a potential foundation. There was. I don't even understand why you felt the need to write such a long post. Bergevin didn't leave us with assets thanks to his competence and acumen as a GM; he left us with assets despite his being horrible.