Juraj Slafkovsky - Year Two

[Miller Time]

Well Rehabs is notceably absent. I’m sure he’ll reappear once Slaf inevitably has a bad sequence.

Like death & taxes... No escaping it lol

I do hope that all the "experts" who were seemed to find joy in proclaiming with certainty that Slaf was being ruined and his selection evidence of management incompetence can find at least a bit of joy in watching him progress so positively.

His ceiling remains as high as ever, but now we're getting great proof of how hard he's willing to work at being a complete hockey player, which only raises his floor. Kid is setting himself up to have a long, productive career.

Future is bright

 

[nhlfan9191]

All the vindication in this thread is so cringe.

First it wasnt about points, it was about the process, now he gets points (to the very elite clip of .3 ppg) and somehow were celebrating?

He still struggles with his shot, he still has a hard time not cherry picking a passing lane, he still kills plays because he has poor vision, etc. All things a stint in the AHL wouldve adressed. Id add his defensive reads too but thats just time-relative. Hes still not on the PP, his ice time is still low.

Pump the brakes. Hes now at a level where hes above a 4th liner, how are we celebrating this?

Ill add the usual annoying disclaimer to catter to the Karens: No he is not a bust, no he will not bust, yes he is a quality player.


Its not. A reason why he cant shoot is because he doesnt yet have the processing speed to recognize situation in which shooting would be the right play.

Thats the kind of things that the AHL helps with, more situations to practice this.

I’ve just stayed away lately. There’s some positive signs with his development but I’m not going to pretend that pacing for around 30 points playing with the teams best offensive players is some big feat. There’s nothing to celebrate yet some people feel it’s time to dish out the “I told you so’s.”

 

[admiralcadillac]

I’ve just stayed away lately. There’s some positive signs with his development but I’m not going to pretend that pacing for around 30 points playing with the teams best offensive players is some big feat. There’s nothing to celebrate yet some people feel it’s time to dish out the “I told you so’s.”

I mean what can you expect when you have to deal with the same i told you so’s every time things don’t work out? Lets not pretend the negativity and cynicism aren’t hallmarks of this board. It’s probably why almost all of the comments are tongue in cheek.

 

[Kennerback]

Bip....respectfully you are wrong. His shot needs work, but its not a processing issue. He has been playing great hockey and belongs on the big team. He uses his body to his advantage....each game that becomes more obvious......his passing has been both creative and effective.....this requires excellent vision......his backchecking and defensive awareness are growing.....as evidenced in blocked shots......If you can't see that, you are so clearly in the minority at this point, that it comes across as pure hating of the player, or shear arrogance on your part, to claim to know better.

His shot needs work both technically and in usage. It seems to have been drilled into him years ago to shoot only when forced to. I don’t think when he doesn’t shoot he’s making a poor decision or judgment call. He’s not even entertaining the possibility of shooting in that context.

 

[Mrb1p]

Bip....respectfully you are wrong. His shot needs work, but its not a processing issue. He has been playing great hockey and belongs on the big team. He uses his body to his advantage....each game that becomes more obvious......his passing has been both creative and effective.....this requires excellent vision......his backchecking and defensive awareness are growing.....as evidenced in blocked shots......If you can't see that, you are so clearly in the minority at this point, that it comes across as pure hating of the player, or shear arrogance on your part, to claim to know better.

The fact that he is a NHL player shouldnt get in the way of his development. Joshua Roy would certainly have success here, why is he down in the AHL?

 

[Whitesnake]

I think multiple people on just the last page alone have talked about much more than the points he’s scoring, which were elements that were already used as arguments that he belongs in the NHL.

I.e. defensive awareness.

I could point to you tons of players in the AHL that might have what it takes to play in the NHL but don't. Quite a few players could be great in stretches. But what you need is consistency.

Again, still wondering how a trip to the AHL would have hurt his progression. As a 18 year old or even 19.

What they're saying is that if Slafkovsky becomes a good player without having spent time in the AHL, then it's proof that he wouldn't have benefited from time in the AHL.

Which makes obviously no sense...lol. You still could benefit from the AHL whether it's for confidence, working on different things, being able to be more rapidly ready for the NHL and all sorts of different factors. I mean, if Slaf develops into a 55-points guy....could I be able to say that if he would have played in the AHL, he would have become a 80-point guy? lol.

Again, for me, it's not even about points. It,s about playing the game in its entirety. And reserving the NHL at 18 ONLY for exceptionals. Players that at 18 or 19 even find the NHL too easy.

 

[waitin425]

I have no idea how Slaf recent points success is a proof that the AHL wouldn't have helped...lol. Makes no sense. So not scoring doesn't mean the AHL was the way to go. But scoring SHOWS it wasn't? What kind of kindergarten type of thinking is that?

Not scoring was the argument that AHL backers were making to send him down. NHL backers are currently saying......that argument has been refutted. It is not the scoring that shows he should be in the NHL, it was all of the other stuff he was doing. But it was the lack of scoring that several posters hung their hat on to argue for the A. You know that is the truth White, and now trying to flip that argument around. That is kindergarten bullshit.

NHL has and will be the best place for Slaf to develop. The current proof lies in his past 7 games. The bigger proof is the curve with which he is developing over this entire season.

 

[waitin425]

The fact that he is a NHL player shouldnt get in the way of his development. Joshua Roy would certainly have success here, why is he down in the AHL?

Are you sure about that? Certain?

"adjective

1. known for sure; established beyond doubt"

Roy and Slaf are two different players. What Slaf needs to work on and what Roy needs to work on are completely different.

The AHL and NHL are also completely different. What Roy is doing in the AHL doesn't mean it will necessarily translate to the NHL.

Roy will be a fine NHLer but he isn't quite there yet.

 

[admiralcadillac]

I could point to you tons of players in the AHL that might have what it takes to play in the NHL but don't. Quite a few players could be great in stretches. But what you need is consistency.

Again, still wondering how a trip to the AHL would have hurt his progression. As a 18 year old or even 19.

Which makes obviously no sense...lol. You still could benefit from the AHL whether it's for confidence, working on different things, being able to be more rapidly ready for the NHL and all sorts of different factors. I mean, if Slaf develops into a 55-points guy....could I be able to say that if he would have played in the AHL, he would have become a 80-point guy? lol.

Again, for me, it's not even about points. It,s about playing the game in its entirety. And reserving the NHL at 18 ONLY for exceptionals. Players that at 18 or 19 even find the NHL too easy.

How do you send a guy down when the team is at .500 with an outside shot at a playoff spot and he’s one of the team’s best forwards? Riddle me that one.

 

[SlafySZN]

I’ve just stayed away lately. There’s some positive signs with his development but I’m not going to pretend that pacing for around 30 points playing with the teams best offensive players is some big feat. There’s nothing to celebrate yet some people feel it’s time to dish out the “I told you so’s.”

He has 5 points in his last 7 games since he played with Caufield and Dvorak. That’s not a 30 points pace.

 

[DAChampion]

Not scoring was the argument that AHL backers were making to send him down.

False.

 

[waitin425]

What I want to know is this.....what is the metric by which @Whitesnake @Mrb1p @ReHabs and others will measure Slaf being in the NHL a success. When will we know, in your mind that he belongs? Is it something like5 more points in his next 7.....10 more in his next 14....does he have to reach PPG pace? Is it simply your eye test? Outperform his draft class (he is already doing it)?

Give us something guys. What is the metric we can all use to measure Slaf and know he has made it?

 

[Guy Larose]

Many will ragret bashing him!

They never regret anything here, they just say they'll eat crow blah blah blah. Easier to bash and backtrack with the crow eating crap afterwards.

 

[waitin425]

They never regret anything here, they just say they'll eat crow blah blah blah. Easier to bash and backtrack with the crow eating crap afterwards.

 

[Mrb1p]

Are you sure about that? Certain?

"adjective

1. known for sure; established beyond doubt"

Roy and Slaf are two different players. What Slaf needs to work on and what Roy needs to work on are completely different.

The AHL and NHL are also completely different. What Roy is doing in the AHL doesn't mean it will necessarily translate to the NHL.

Roy will be a fine NHLer but he isn't quite there yet.

Thats the thing. Roy doesnt need to work on puck skills, he needs to work on off puck play, which is... crazy but where would it be better to work on this than in the toughest league in the world to get the puck?

More puck = puck play, less puck = play away from the puck.

One needs the former, the other needs the other. The former is the AHL, the latter is the NHL.

 

[417]

He’s been progressing very well. I’ve been saying it for a while that you need to look at the overall trend. He’s slowly refining all aspects of his game. His play without the puck has developed so much since the start of season.

How is this happening!?!?!

It's the NHL! It's not a developmental league!!!!!

 

[Mrb1p]

What I want to know is this.....what is the metric by which @Whitesnake @Mrb1p @ReHabs and others will measure Slaf being in the NHL a success. When will we know, in your mind that he belongs? Is it something like5 more points in his next 7.....10 more in his next 14....does he have to reach PPG pace? Is it simply your eye test? Outperform his draft class (he is already doing it)?

Give us something guys. What is the metric we can all use to measure Slaf and know he has made it?

I dont know why you lump me in there lmao.

Ill know when hes a top 6 winger that can put up over 65 points a year. I really dont care for him to survive and end up as another Kotkaniemi.

I said the same thing about Jesperi, by the way.

Slaf is a good player, hes talented, hes gonna be good probably no matter what, just like KK, but not unlike KK, I want more from him. I want an elite player. This, is in most case, acquired either by just sheer talent or by hard work in the proper channels.

Right now, Slafkovsky has neither of those things.

How is this happening!?!?!

It's the NHL! It's not a developmental league!!!!!

Because its easy to develop off puck play when you never have the puck.

How is his play with the puck? Lol...

Literally what Ive been saying for 10 years is happening right before our eyes.

N.B.: No, this doesnt mean that Slaf could never develop puck skills, it could happen. It happened to Marchand, it happened to Benn, and a bunch of others. It just means it is less likely.

 

[417]

Its not. A reason why he cant shoot is because he doesnt yet have the processing speed to recognize situation in which shooting would be the right play.

Agreed this is probably the next step he needs to take, being ready to shoot before you even get the puck, wanting to shoot, not always deferring.

There was a 3 on 2 last night where he has the puck in the slot and still tried passing off to his right to Caufield, he didn't even look at the goalie to give him doubt or put doubt in the minds of the defenders that he was gonna shoot, they played the pass all the way and Slaf forced it to Caufield instead of getting a shot on net.

It will come.

Thats the kind of things that the AHL helps with, more situations to practice this.

Or it can make it worse because the AHL doesn't mimmick the limited time and space that you have in the NHL.

 

[417]

I have no idea how Slaf recent points success is a proof that the AHL wouldn't have helped...lol. Makes no sense. So not scoring doesn't mean the AHL was the way to go. But scoring SHOWS it wasn't? What kind of kindergarten type of thinking is that?

As kindergarten as thinking that scoring in the AHL would help him score more in the NHL lol.

I don't think his recent point surge is proof the AHL wouldn't have helped…

But it's certainly evidence that his recent point surge is proof that players can learn/develop in the NHL.

But who am I kidding…people are still going to repeat that same tired passage

What they're saying is that if Slafkovsky becomes a good player without having spent time in the AHL, then it's proof that he wouldn't have benefited from time in the AHL.

I mean if the opposite is always true….

 

[Mrb1p]

Agreed this is probably the next step he needs to take, being ready to shoot before you even get the puck, wanting to shoot, not always deferring.

There was a 3 on 2 last night where he has the puck in the slot and still tried passing off to his right to Caufield, he didn't even look at the goalie to give him doubt or put doubt in the minds of the defenders that he was gonna shoot, they played the pass all the way and Slaf forced it to Caufield instead of getting a shot on net.

It will come.


Or it can make it worse because the AHL doesn't mimmick the limited time and space that you have in the NHL.

Yes, just like driving a 200cc kart to train for f1, its much better to drop someone straight in the 1000 bhp f1 car, why would he need training in F2? Hes just gonna learn bad habits !

Lets be real, thats just not true. Theres a reason why were telling people to be patient and theres a reason why theres large amounts of prospects in lower leagues. Gradual learning has been studied for decades now, lets not fall into pop-science. Learning to walk, learning one string songs on a guitar, learning to climb on v1s, learning is always done at a lower pace and it never becomes detrimental.

 

[417]

Because its easy to develop off puck play when you never have the puck.

How is his play with the puck? Lol...

Literally what Ive been saying for 10 years is happening right before our eyes.

N.B.: No, this doesnt mean that Slaf could never develop puck skills, it could happen. It happened to Marchand, it happened to Benn, and a bunch of others. It just means it is less likely.

So again…you CAN develop in the NHL!?

 

[le_sean]

What I want to know is this.....what is the metric by which @Whitesnake @Mrb1p @ReHabs and others will measure Slaf being in the NHL a success. When will we know, in your mind that he belongs? Is it something like5 more points in his next 7.....10 more in his next 14....does he have to reach PPG pace? Is it simply your eye test? Outperform his draft class (he is already doing it)?

Give us something guys. What is the metric we can all use to measure Slaf and know he has made it?

Are you new here? People will just constantly move the goalposts to fit their narratives.

Slaf could be successful and have a great career and they will say “yeah but he’s a one-off, the NHL is not a development league so technically we aren’t wrong.” Or they will say “yeah but he’s still disappointing for a 1st pick.”

 

[Mrb1p]

So again…you CAN develop in the NHL!?

Yes you can, nobody ever said you couldnt. Its just not optimal both time wise and quality wise.

Again, Kotkaniemi is the perfect example. He developped "fine". It took 6 years and he's about 70% in his ultimate ceiling, he had to reinvent his offensive skillset because he never got the time to learn to dominate and push his tools to the maximum.

I was saying exactly the same thing in 18-19. I know you'll just say "He just never was that good", but thats just not true and rewriting history.

On another note, yes, you can 100% get better in the NHL and some even surpass their ceilings. Brady Tkachuk had low-ish end vision, and now hes a PPG player.

On the other hand, Dach came in the league with game breaking talent, but with problems when it comes to a) getting his shot off and b) picking his spot to shoot. He still has the same weakness today.

 

[417]

Yes, just like driving a 200cc kart to train for f1, its much better to drop someone straight in the 1000 bhp f1 car, why would he need training in F2? Hes just gonna learn bad habits !

That's not a comparative analogy to what's happening right now.

Yes he was/is raw, but not nearly as much as many of you have tried to pain the picture as.

Lets be real, thats just not true. Theres a reason why were telling people to be patient and theres a reason why theres large amounts of prospects in lower leagues. Gradual learning has been studied for decades now, lets not fall into pop-science. Learning to walk, learning one string songs on a guitar, learning to climb on v1s, learning is always done at a lower pace and it never becomes detrimental.

Telling people "to be patient" while overreacting to small samples of play in the NHL seems contradictory to me. Being patient doesn't mean only being patient if he's in the AHL...it also applies to Slaf IN the NHL.

Also, the reason why there's a large amount of prospects in lower leagues is fairly obvious...not sure what this has to do with Slafkovsky.

He IS learning gradually, if you tracked his progress over the first 60 odd games of his NHL career, you can see the gradual progress.

The issue for so many, not saying this applies to you necessarily, is that progress hasn't been tied to points and that's what drives the narrative of so many here.

Watch, the next dry spell (and believe me, it's coming), the same people who seem absent lately...will be back with a vengeance and this cycle will continue for a while still.

 

[417]

Yes you can, nobody ever said you couldnt. Its just not optimal both time wise and quality wise.

There's no way you just wrote that? lol

Again, Kotkaniemi is the perfect example. He developped "fine". It took 6 years and he's about 70% in his ultimate ceiling, he had to reinvent his offensive skillset because he never got the time to learn to dominate and push his tools to the maximum.

Kotkaniemi is a perfect example of a player whose development was stunted as a result of a coaching staff who preferred playing washed veterans like Thompson and Staal instead of KK...or they preferred the valuable minutes Danault provided instead of doing a better job integrating KK.

He hasn't reinvented himself lol...he's played and produced like a solid #2C because that's who he is and has always been and was drafted to be. There isn't a single soul who thought when the Habs drafted him that he was going to be an elite #1C.

I was saying exactly the same thing in 18-19. I know you'll just say "He just never was that good", but thats just not true and rewriting history.

On another note, yes, you can 100% get better in the NHL and some even surpass their ceilings. Brady Tkachuk had low-ish end vision, and now hes a PPG player.

On the other hand, Dach came in the league with game breaking talent, but with problems when it comes to a) getting his shot off and b) picking his spot to shoot. He still has the same weakness today.

Yet I've been in countless debates on here pushing against that very idea...that "the NHL is a not a developmental league". People LOVE repeating that.

When the Habs played the Coyotes a few weeks back, Andre Tourigny was kind enough to provide us with that same soundbite that Habs fans ate up. This was the same coach who while lecturing Habs fans that the NHL is not a developmental league (in relation to Slaf), also was simultaneously admitting that Logan Cooley was developing in the NHL lol.