Juraj Slafkovsky - Year Two

[ReHabs]

No, those who insist on saying Habs management didnt do anything good, those who think and say Habs coaching staff is bad and those who have yet to say something positive could be considered detractors to some level. You check all the boxes, If fact boxes are not big enough as you not only have nothing positive to say about the Habs, but you constantly try to convince anyone who do see good things they're wrong. So yeah stop playing victim, you are the definition of toxic. Toxic enough it's 100% legitimate to question your Habs fandom.



Can't wait for your reply showing the 1 or 2 times you made a somewhat positive comment about the Habs, it's going to be Crazy!

I’m sorry I’ve made such an impression on you in… the whole nine days you’ve been here.

Well, it isn’t the case that I am not a fan. I’m a big fan. A long-time suffering fan. A formerly naive fan. An anglo fan who loves the French language, loves the province, and respects the Habs’ identity.

I was raised with the expectation that it is not normal for the Habs to be terrible. I’m gonna maintain such standards and expectations. If we don’t have success we might as well not have lower standards.

 

[Toene]

Not sure it's a good idea, its a f***ing cesspool with some very disingenuous posters on both sides

You're asking the wrong question...the question you should be asking is what is the upside? Is it for him to rediscover his confidence?

Then OK...but taking an NHL player and sending him down to the AHL to reclaim his confidence seems counter-intuitive to me.

I meant, what was the downside of starting him there at the beginning, in fall 2022.

Without supposing management has this "secret plan" that would be so genius that it's even going over the head of the most knowledgeable fans and hockey analysts, do you really think starting a very raw, non-generational top-pick prospect in the NHL at 18 is the best course of action possible?

Let's be honest here.

Your point about struggle is valid, but as a teacher, there is constructive struggle, and there is drowning.
If the struggle that requires effort is helping the kid, you'll see her/him experience some difficulty at first, but you'll also notice some tangible improvements after a little while.
If the tasks are a tad too difficult, the kid will feel frustration, lose confidence and interest. And this reality applies to virtually everybody who is learning, from kids in elementary to PHD candidates, from high-end athletes to middle-aged office workers learning to use a new computer program.

After close to 60 games, can we say that there are observable improvements? I believe he's worse than his very first games, when the challenge was exciting and you could see him beam from enthusiasm, but better than his mega-slump from last year (weeks preceding his injury). To me, it's apparent that the challenge is a little bit too much. We can disagree, of course. Maybe you do see significant improvement in his play and his attitude, but then I'd be interested to see on what you base your opinion. Again, without assuming "it's all part of HuGo's mysterious plan".

So, when a student struggles trying to learn something, sometimes you have to go back to something more basic : it helps release some pressure, and you can make sure it's understood before you move on to more complex concepts.

 

[Goldenhands]

Believe it or not, Slaf has more even strength pts than Cooley. Cooley has 1 goals 8 assists playing on the Yotes top PP unit and 3 even strength pts. Slaf has 1 goal on that weak 2nd PP wave, and 4 even strength pts.

Its not a knock at the Cooley fans, you are allowed to have your favorites, but more of a good jab at the Slaf's detractors and the Yotes organization who trolled us after their win no long ago.

https://x.com/ArizonaCoyotes/status/1720302056114995451?s=20

Then you have André Tourigny in his post game interview telling us how to handle our 1st OV with such arrogance that I lost alot of respect for him. Well I would like to thank them alot since Slaf has been playing much better since then.

I would also like to thank Tourigny for telling us on the air like 2-3 months before the draft what their intentions were, we ended up outanking them by 2 pts on the last game of the season, Reinbacher will look much better in a Habs jersey.

Really wish for the Yotes But and Simachev comes overseas one day...

 

[cave troll]

Still, that gnome plug Cooley scored more pts in his first 18 NHL games than Slaf did in his 39.
How is that possible?
That damned PP. Should be abolished !

 

[morhilane]

Then you have André Tourigny in his post game interview telling us how to handle our 1st OV with such arrogance that I lost alot of respect for him. Well I would like to thank them alot since Slaf has been playing much better since then.

Based on what he said in that interview and his usage at 5v5 of Cooley, I got quite a few questions...

 

[OnTheRun]

Still, that gnome plug Cooley scored more pts in his first 18 NHL games than Slaf did in his 39.
How is that possible?
That damned PP. Should be abolished !

So first 18 games challenge eh?

NHL Stats

The official source for NHL Stats including skaters, goalies, teams stats and more.

www.nhl.com

 

[Jaynki]

Believe it or not, Slaf has more even strength pts than Cooley. Cooley has 1 goals 8 assists playing on the Yotes top PP unit and 3 even strength pts. Slaf has 1 goal on that weak 2nd PP wave, and 4 even strength pts.

Its not a knock at the Cooley fans, you are entitled to have your favorites, but more of a good jab at the Slaf's detractors and the Yotes organization who trolled us after their win no long ago.

https://x.com/ArizonaCoyotes/status/1720302056114995451?s=20

Then you have André Tourigny in his post game interview telling us how to handle our 1st OV with such arrogance that I lost alot of respect for him. Well I would like to thank them alot since Slaf has been playing much better since then.

I would also like to thank Tourigny for telling us on the air like 2-3 months before the draft what their intentions were, we ended up outanking them by 1 pt and Reinbacher will look much better in a Habs jersey.

Really wish for the Yotes But and Simachev comes overseas one day...

Tourigny missed a good opportunity to shut his mouth.

With the growing rarity of francophone coach, he is a prime candidate to coach oue team in the future. I would argue, and thats more than just this.simple comment, that with his goofish behavior, he is eliminating himself from future contention for HC.

He is often intervening on local sport radio in Quebec and he does not sound intelligent.

 

[Goldenhands]

Tourigny missed a good opportunity to shut his mouth.

With the growing rarity of francophone coach, he is a prime candidate to coach oue team in the future. I would argue, and thats more than just this.simple comment, that with his goofish behavior, he is eliminating himself from future contention for HC.

He is often intervening on local sport radio in Quebec and he does not sound intelligent.

I wouldnt go as far as saying he doesnt sound intelligent, but he missed a good opportunity to shut up for sure. I mean when Is the last time a NHL coach or a GM downgraded a young prospect from another team publicly? It never happens, it had to come from a Mickey Mouse organisation like the Yotes.

Otherwise I agree, slim chances we ever see him behind the bench in MTL.

 

[leVENTduNORD]

I’m sorry I’ve made such an impression on you in… the whole nine days you’ve been here.

Well, it isn’t the case that I am not a fan. I’m a big fan. A long-time suffering fan. A formerly naive fan. An anglo fan who loves the French language, loves the province, and respects the Habs’ identity.

I was raised with the expectation that it is not normal for the Habs to be terrible. I’m gonna maintain such standards and expectations. If we don’t have success we might as well not have lower standards.

Yup, you make quite the impression boy LOL

pretty sure if you repeat it everyday you'll find a poster or two who will believe you.

Given the fact you're not part of Habs management, Habs coaching staff, Habs player and not a fan, when you say WE, de qui tu parles !?

 

[417]

I meant, what was the downside of starting him there at the beginning, in fall 2022.

Without supposing management has this "secret plan" that would be so genius that it's even going over the head of the most knowledgeable fans and hockey analysts, do you really think starting a very raw, non-generational top-pick prospect in the NHL at 18 is the best course of action possible?

Let's be honest here.

I said last year I would have sent him down after camp for a good half season at least. So I don’t disagree.

Is it the be all/ end all of the rest of his career?

Not even close.

Your point about struggle is valid, but as a teacher, there is constructive struggle, and there is drowning.
If the struggle that requires effort is helping the kid, you'll see her/him experience some difficulty at first, but you'll also notice some tangible improvements after a little while.
If the tasks are a tad too difficult, the kid will feel frustration, lose confidence and interest. And this reality applies to virtually everybody who is learning, from kids in elementary to PHD candidates, from high-end athletes to middle-aged office workers learning to use a new computer program.

I'm not sure he has struggled to the point many seem to think here. He surely hasn't been great, but other then what I thought was a pretty ugly stretch a few weeks ago where I again said, I would have sent him down for a stint… I find he's been showing slow but still steady progress.

I'd rather not disrupt that, he's not hurting the team or his own development at this moment.

After close to 60 games, can we say that there are observable improvements? I believe he's worse than his very first games, when the challenge was exciting and you could see him beam from enthusiasm, but better than his mega-slump from last year (weeks preceding his injury). To me, it's apparent that the challenge is a little bit too much. We can disagree, of course. Maybe you do see significant improvement in his play and his attitude, but then I'd be interested to see on what you base your opinion. Again, without assuming "it's all part of HuGo's mysterious plan".

I would say yes but there's certainly a lot of room for more improvement. He’s probably at the baseline of what I would like to see at this stage in his development.

So, when a student struggles trying to learn something, sometimes you have to go back to something more basic : it helps release some pressure, and you can make sure it's understood before you move on to more complex concepts.

I wouldn't say he’s failing with the more complex concepts but the margins are very thin here, whether he's here or in Laval, as long as he’s progressing. But that progress doesn't always manifest itself in ways that are obvious such as goals or assists.

 

[Jaynki]

I wouldnt go as far as saying he doesnt sound intelligent, but he missed a good opportunity to shut up for sure. I mean when Is the last time a NHL coach or a GM downgraded a young prospect from another team publicly? It never happens, it had to come from a Mickey Mouse organisation like the Yotes.

Otherwise I agree, slim chances we ever see him behind the bench in MTL.

For the best

 

[Kobe Armstrong]

I was fine with the Slafkovsky pick and ultimately I am still fine with it. I was happy and am still happy we didn't pick Wright. I can't act like I was a big Cooley fan in his draft year either. Dream scenario would've been a trade down and picking Nemec or Jiricek, but the idea of trading down in your first year as GM when you have the 1st overall pick and you are hosting the draft is crazy.

I think he could probably use some time in the AHL after his next scoring drought but it is up to him to prove us wrong. If he keeps putting up points he won't go anywhere. I think we have the right to be concerned that he won't turn into an impact player, but I'm also encouraged by the emergence of other proclaimed busts this season

 

[Draft]

All this hubbub and misery... Slaf is still one of the only players from this draft that might sniff a top line or top pairing role.

 

[Kennedys]

Juraj is our Wayne Gretzky

 

[ReHabs]

The Montreal Canadiens and the Laval Rocket are like two classes in the same developmental program. It doesn't matter to me which of those leagues a young player is in, as long as it helps him develop skills, confidence, and habits.

I understand the connotations of being 'sent down' to Laval. It is a demotion, after all. In the case of veterans and prospects who can't cut the NHL, it can reflect a lack of patience. However, for a teenager barely a year after being drafted, it can be a normal part of the learning curve.

The Habs haven’t sent him down, and have intoned multiple times that they’re fearful of sending him down. Habs fans and commentators get furious at the notion too— calling those of us who want Slaf to thrive elsewhere “detractors”.

Now, about patience — I feel rushing him to the NHL with a cockamamie scheme to develop him from the ground up shows a lack of patience itself. Instead of letting the prospect’s ability dictate the decisions they’ve hastily imposed their own (unproven) scheme on the situation.

Why didn’t they rush Reinbacher? Some think it’s because they tacitly admit they’ve made a mistake and don’t want it repeated. Others think it’s because Slafkovsky is MSL’s pet project.

Some speculate that Slafkovsky’s development is going perfectly to plan. I think those people are delusional.

 

[Scriptor]

The Habs haven’t sent him down, and have intoned multiple times that they’re fearful of sending him down. Habs fans and commentators get furious at the notion too— calling those of us who want Slaf to thrive elsewhere “detractors”.

Now, about patience — I feel rushing him to the NHL with a cockamamie scheme to develop him from the ground up shows a lack of patience itself. Instead of letting the prospect’s ability dictate the decisions they’ve hastily imposed their own (unproven) scheme on the situation.

Why didn’t they rush Reinbacher? Some think it’s because they tacitly admit they’ve made a mistake and don’t want it repeated. Others think it’s because Slafkovsky is MSL’s pet project.

Some speculate that Slafkovsky’s development is going perfectly to plan. I think those people are delusional.

I feel rushing him to the NHL with a "COCKAMAMIE SCHEME" to develop him from the ground up shows a lack of patience itself.

This is such a loaded statement, it hints at no honest analysis of the current situation with Slafkovsky.

It's like saying, "Taking a pill guaranteed to kill you might not be the proper way to go."

I find these "I have to be 110% right" set-ups only weaken the points you try to make and they aren't even necessary to make your points that, otherwise, can arguably be defended and make a reasonable part of a discussion.

Unfortunately, this approach is all too common on discussion boards.

My two cents...

 

[ReHabs]

I feel rushing him to the NHL with a "COCKAMAMIE SCHEME" to develop him from the ground up shows a lack of patience itself.

This is such a loaded statement, it hints at no honest analysis of the current situation with Slafkovsky.

I’ve written plenty of factual statements about Slafkovsky. He’s the worst producing top drafted forward of the 21st century. His change in PPG is negligible (21pt pace to 22pt pace). He is getting outscored by the rookie Cooley.

He is not in the right league.

It's like saying, "Taking a pill guaranteed to kill you might not be the proper way to go."

Not at all

I find these "I have to be 110% right" set-ups only weaken the points you try to make and they aren't even necessary to make your points that, otherwise, can arguably be defended and make a reasonable part of a discussion.

I don’t think you’re being fair. But I also don’t think you intend to be fair.

No other prospect is developed like this. No prospect who struggles so much is actively prevented from being re-assigned to the AHL. I call it a cockamamie scheme because it’s a strategy that is beyond recognition. I’ve literally never seen this. Have you??

He was the youngest guy in the NHL last year, how about you take that as a hint that the Habs didn’t intend to develop him slowly?

Unfortunately, this approach is all too common on discussion boards.

My two cents...

I agree, but unless someone provides evidence that Slafkovsky is being developed in a typical or ordinary manner I think you need to direct your ire toward those who insist that the NHL is a development league and that Slafkovsky’s heretofore unprecedentedly bad scoring rates are actually not strange at all.

 

[cave troll]

I’ve written plenty of factual statements about Slafkovsky. He’s the worst producing top drafted forward of the 21st century. His change in PPG is negligible (21pt pace to 22pt pace). He is getting outscored by the rookie Cooley.

You're omitting the fact that Slaf is a project and not a typical 1OA, whataver that means.
So we cannot compare him with other 1OA forwards who were not projects and who were typical 1OA.

 

[ReHabs]

You're omitting the fact that Slaf is a project and not a typical 1OA, whataver that means.
So we cannot compare him with other 1OA forwards who were not projects and who were typical 1OA.

Basic statement easily refuted:

If he’s not a typical 1OA/(Top Drafted Forward) they had no reason to rush him to the NHL and their folly was proven by Slafkovsky’s performances last season. This season is a continuation of that folly.

The Hughes Fans or “anti-detractors” want it both ways: to shrug it off and say 1OAs always get rushed so that’s fine and also at the same time to relieve Slafkovsky and the Habs of the expectations and baseline standards of 1OAs. It doesn’t work!

 

[Jaynki]

Instead of letting the prospect’s ability dictate the decisions

Some simply think he was an NHL player from day one.

Also, the cockamamie scheme

 

[cave troll]

Basic statement easily refuted:

If he’s not a typical 1OA/(Top Drafted Forward) they had no reason to rush him to the NHL and their folly was proven by Slafkovsky’s performances last season. This season is a continuation of that folly.

The Hughes Fans or “anti-detractors” want it both ways: to shrug it off and say 1OAs always get rushed so that’s fine and also at the same time to relieve Slafkovsky and the Habs of the expectations and baseline standards of 1OAs. It doesn’t work!

Well, a typical 1OA usually has most of these skills: leadership, winning mentality, scoring skills, playmaking skills, speed, strenght, stamina, quick thinking, anticipation of plays, willingness to learn and to progress above the limits...
Slaf is severely lacking in many of these skills. He's just some kind of hockey apprentice trying to understand the hockey game in NHL. He's not a 1OA who says look, pass me the puck, I'll deal with it!
He has no skill to be a player making decisive plays. He came to NHL as a bottom 6 kid in Liiga and he acts like that.
Should he be in AHL? Management says no. Hughes explicitly said that if he focuses on scoring in AHL it can be contraproductive. They're trying to mold him into a NHL player on NHL ice. Will they succeed? Nobody knows. All will be visible at the end of his ELC, which comes in year and a half. If he scores 30 next year he'll probably get a bridge as a second chance. If he fails, he'll be shipped back to Europe.

 

[sandviper]

I don't think there is a double-standard, I think you're missing the point. People are just mocking the Cooley play because it's the type of play that Slaf detractors would not let go. Here you are making excuses for Cooley you wouldn't for Slaf.

Lshap recognizes both Cooley and Slaf are young and are asking for patience for both. I am not sure you are though.

Yeah, Cooley is the flavour of the day for Slaf detractors despite the fact 98% of the haters wanted Wright. FWIW, I’m not a Slaf hater but I did want Cooley but yeah, that isn’t really the point. I don’t think anyone hates Cooley but it’s more about mocking that narrative the Slaf bashers are running with.

What is really weird for me is the narrative that it’s ok to bash players like Slaf (and Kotkaniemi prior) but heap praise upon praise on OTHER team’s prospects. I mean hey, we’re all fans here… i dislike some of our own players and like other team players but it is normal behaviour to not like/cheer other team players.

I coach U-14 & U-16 competitive basketball...we took a huge chance on a kid who moved here from Tanzania 2 years ago and had barely played any basketball. Typically, he would play at least a full year of House League basketball before he even got a sniff of competitive teams, but I lobbied hard for him because he just turned 13 and he's 6-4 with a huge wingspan.

We're about 6 weeks into our season, he's barely played, he hasn't scored or contributed much to our team.

But there isn't a single player on our roster who has progressed more and by this time next year, if he continues on this path, he's going to be unstoppable.

We don't measure his progress in points and assists...we measure his progress by the fact that he didn't know how to grab a rebound, or pivot or set a screen or run the floor or block a shot a few weeks ago. Now he does all of those things quite effectively.

I promise you whoever is coaching him in U-13 next season, he's going to thank me for putting him on the team.

This was just an analogy like yours, I fully comprehend that it doesn't necessarily translate at all levels of all sports.

Giannis Antetokounmpo was super raw player drafted out of Greece in 2013, 15th overall...he had never dominated any league he was in prior, people laughed at the draft because of how awkward and skinny he was. His rookie year, people continued to laugh...he looked overmatched.

By year 3...people weren't laughing anymore

Great story and had a similar experience. I coached an AA U14 baseball team and this massive kid, like 6’2 came on straight out of house league. Normally, kids go through at least house league select a few years (he only played one year house) and at least a year of A ball but in tryouts, I saw the potential. He couldn’t hit like the other players, or throw with the expected accuracy and lacked some infield IQ (he played 3rd) but he had great speed. When he DID hit the ball, it was gone. If he could throw under pressure, the kid had a cannon.

Needless to say, he was a bit of a gong show that first year as well as the first couple months of year two. Then, something finally clicked and he went full beast mode and led our team in homers, RBIs and steals. He wasn’t winning any Gold Gloves but his defence improved significantly.

 

[cave troll]

What is really weird for me is the narrative that it’s ok to bash players like Slaf (and Kotkaniemi prior) but heap praise upon praise on OTHER team’s prospects. I mean hey, we’re all fans here… i dislike some of our own players and like other team players but it is normal behaviour to not like/cheer other team players.

I think it's the opposite. It's mostly Habs fans overhyping their own prospects and bashing others. How many times we've red that Cooley is a gnome who can only play on PP? That Wright is going nowhere? That Nemec is soft? That Jiricek is AHL dude?
The worst bashing of all was that happiness about Michkov being sidelined in SKA. That was the lowest point of bashing here.

 

[BaseballCoach]

I’ve written plenty of factual statements about Slafkovsky. He’s the worst producing top drafted forward of the 21st century. His change in PPG is negligible (21pt pace to 22pt pace). He is getting outscored by the rookie Cooley.

He is not in the right league.

Not at all

I don’t think you’re being fair. But I also don’t think you intend to be fair.

No other prospect is developed like this. No prospect who struggles so much is actively prevented from being re-assigned to the AHL. I call it a cockamamie scheme because it’s a strategy that is beyond recognition. I’ve literally never seen this. Have you??

He was the youngest guy in the NHL last year, how about you take that as a hint that the Habs didn’t intend to develop him slowly?

I agree, but unless someone provides evidence that Slafkovsky is being developed in a typical or ordinary manner I think you need to direct your ire toward those who insist that the NHL is a development league and that Slafkovsky’s heretofore unprecedentedly bad scoring rates are actually not strange at all.

What is different about this prospect than many others is that he is being developed in an atmosphere where the team is not desperate for wins and expecting the kid to be their saviour. Recall how Clod Churien panicked in February 2019 when he realized the team might make the playoffs with their fast aggressive style, and promptly changed the style, bet on newly acquired Nate Thompson and Jordan Weal, and blew the season while KK's TOI was killed just when the league pundits were remarking how he was doing pretty well.

The Habs knew last year that Slaf had the size to not be overmatched against men, and had noticeable results scoring against men in his draft year, particularly in the second half of the season.

The team execs fully expected Slaf to take time to adapt to the NHL pace and game, and were prepared to be patient with him when they saw how determined he was to learn and improve.

It is clear that at just 70% of one season into his NHL career, Juraj has made significant progress and impacts the game virtually every match, moreso than several other forwards with an NHL salary. He is trending toward 22 points in his first 82 NHL games and having an increasing number of moments where his package of skills shine through.

Last year, the idea of sending Slaf to Laval was not ridiculous on its face. I disagree with those who thought this move would msomehow speed up results at the NHL level, but given his level of play during the January doldrums after Monahan went down, it would not have been evidently dumb to give him time in Laval just to change the mentality a bit. He did climb out of the funk though and was playing well in the 3 games before his freak injury.

But this year, at this point, doubling down and STILL calling for Slaf's immediate demotion is pure obstinacy.

He belongs in the NHL and it is really time you stopped bashing on Slafkovsky as a proxy for getting licks in against the new management.

 

[cave troll]

I hope you realize that those projected 22 pts in rookie season would have been the worse 1OA forward rookie production since Thornton. IMO, it's not something to point out as a good thing.