Proposal: J.T. Miller to TOR

[habsfan44]

Reality is HF Value and League Value are often different with the exception of the Duchene trade. This is a fact.

The reality is that General Managers set the price and it doesn't matter if we agree or not , that's it that's all , no exceptions .

 

[Hodge]

People talk about moving contract all of the time yet rarely it happens unless it's Arizona and look at them right now.

Miller is a UFA for 23-24 he may very well cash in on that.

Sure the Myers contract is up but we have very little in the system defensively and the OEL contract will still be on the books as well as Horvat needing to be resigned and Elias a year away.

All of this on top of Brock possibly needing to be qualified no I don't think the Canucks can really afford Miller and what would be the point anyway as they still wouldn't be a SC contender with the moves needed to do so.

If the Canucks want to extend Miller they could easily trade Boeser or Garland and free up the necessary cap space. Whether or not that's a good idea is debatable.

 

[wetcoast]

If the Canucks want to extend Miller they could easily trade Boeser or Garland and free up the necessary cap space. Whether or not that's a good idea is debatable.

Well teams can literally do anything but doing good things and acting on good ideas is the goal right?

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

The reality is that General Managers set the price and it doesn't matter if we agree or not , that's it that's all , no exceptions .

Your right, this ask for Miller won't be met, because wether its the Rangers or Leafs, Miller isn't worth whats being asked for. His contract just isn't long enough.

 

[Hodge]

Well teams can literally do anything but doing good things and acting on good ideas is the goal right?

Regardless of whether they end up trading Miller or not they're under no pressure to move him before the 2022 trade deadline unless they get an incredible offer. They could get a 1st+prospect+asset return for Miller at the 2023 deadline, why should they move him for that now?

 

[Canuck Luck]

Lol this isn’t how it works, and the two of you are either being obtuse on purpose or neither of you pay a lot of attention. Teams almost always take back salary to accommodate a trade, often with the eye of flipping those players later for more value. Kerfoot would represent a pretty darn good cap ballast player with future value.
I’m not even big on moving Kerfoot until the off-season personally as he’s one of the better playoff performers on the team and is a valuable PK piece.
Not to mention after July he’s owed league minimum for his last year and would hold immense value for a cap floor team or someone who cares about real dollars vs cap hit.
If Vancouver would eat 50% I would offer a 1st + pick of 1 of the leafs 4 top prospects + a conditional 2nd that becomes a first if leafs make cup final either playoffs.
There would have to be some salary manipulation though like swapping dermott/Holl and Schenn to make it fully work salary wise.

What’s obtuse is you thinking we have to take a shitty offer where the salary we are taking back somehow adds value to the offer to the Canucks.

do you think Montreal thinks pitlick held any value in their toffoli trade? I’ll give you a hint the answer was no. They would have taken the offer with or without pitlick in it but took pitlick because they had to balance salary.

we can take kerfoot and dermott but to us they are 0 value like pitlick. So the deal has to include enough that we would say yes even if those 2 weren’t in the deal. Is that simple enough to understand?

We don’t care what value dermott or kerfoot have to the leafs. To the CANUCKS they have 0 value. Kerfoot by seasons end would be just like Dickinson/Pearson to us. Overpaid 3rd line players that bring nothing we need to the lineup. He’s a 30-35 point complimentary top 9 player. The majority of your fan base is valuing him as a 50+ point player just because he is pacing that playing with Tavares and Nylander. Stick Adam Gaudette in kerfoots spot and I bet you wouldn’t see much of a drop off if any. The drop off you would see would be well worth the extra 2.5M in cap space

 

[im gangster]

Lol Kerfoot. The stale fart that nobody wants around.

 

[sens13]

why don't leaf fans understand that other teams don't value kerfoot/dermott that highly?
kerfoot is a 35 point player that's pacing a lot more because he plays with tavares and nylander. you could put any 3rd liner there and see the same result.

dermott is a bottom pairing d-man. he does not have much value. every team has a dermott type player. why do they think he's still going to be a top 4 d-man? Like it's ridiculous how they think someone will trade them a 2nd or a decent prospect like frost or kravtsov for him.

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

why don't leaf fans understand that other teams don't value kerfoot/dermott that highly?
kerfoot is a 35 point player that's pacing a lot more because he plays with tavares and nylander. you could put any 3rd liner there and see the same result.

dermott is a bottom pairing d-man. he does not have much value. every team has a dermott type player. why do they think he's still going to be a top 4 d-man? Like it's ridiculous how they think someone will trade them a 2nd or a decent prospect like frost or kravtsov for him.

I agree with you on Dermott, but you couldn't be more wrong about Kerfoot.

 

[sens13]

I agree with you on Dermott, but you couldn't be more wrong about Kerfoot.

kerfoot had 2 assists yesterday. both were basic passes that any player could make.

nylander did all the work to get the goals. kerfoot is getting easy points this season because of his linemates

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

kerfoot had 2 assists yesterday. both were basic passes that any player could make. he's getting easy points this season.

So you watched 1 game and made your decision ? Your guessing plain and simple while trying to speak to me about a player you've watched maybe 6 times in two years. Thats some interesting logic. Truth is you really have no clue but have a need to be in on this thread anyway because you dislike the leafs.

 

[Hoglander]

Not a chance in hell that Canucks move Miller for that steaming pile of OP.

Him having only 1 more year after this, doesn't affect his value much, if at all. That is a whole year to figure out an extension. It isn't the Canucks problem if the leafs couldn't afford it, and they aren't going to gift Miller to the Leafs for this crap offer, when they have lots of other options. This is not a serious offer

 

[CupcakeSprinkles]

The reality is that General Managers set the price and it doesn't matter if we agree or not , that's it that's all , no exceptions .

Reality is history of these deals do not coincide with the logic of HF

 

[sens13]

So you watched 1 game and made your decision ? Your guessing plain and simple while trying to speak to me about a player you've watched maybe 6 times in two years. Thats some interesting logic. Truth is you really have no clue but have a need to be in on this thread anyway because you dislike the leafs.

kerfoot went from a meh 3rd liner in the last 2 years to a 55 point player this year once he was placed with 2 1st liners.

It's pretty obvious he's getting carried but of course why would leaf homers admit that. then they can't keep the pretense that kerfoot has massive value now which is their daily topci whenever kerfoot is added into trades

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

Not a chance in hell that Canucks move Miller for that steaming pile of OP.

Him having only 1 more year after this, doesn't affect his value much, if at all. That is a whole year to figure out an extension. It isn't the Canucks problem if the leafs couldn't afford it, and they aren't going to gift Miller to the Leafs for this crap offer, when they have lots of other options. This is not a serious offer

I domt believe the Canucks have trade options for Miller because he isn't worth what nucks fans are asking for. Look at the Rangers thread as well, the asks in there are Ludacris. Keep him and resign him, I could care less and I'm sure Rangers fans have said the same. He has 2 playoffs to offer and then he's off to ufa. Hes just not worth the ask.

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

kerfoot went from a meh 3rd liner in the last 2 years to a 55 point player this year once he was placed with 2 1st liners.

It's pretty obvious he's getting carried but of course why would leaf homers admit that. then they can't keep the pretense that kerfoot has massive value now which is their daily topci whenever kerfoot is added into trades

Leaf homer, thats hilarious. I'm critical of the leafs when they deserve it and praise them when they deserve it. Kerfoot has held his own on that Line all season and has also been very good in our most recent playoff series. Hes a key contributor on our team and the only reason we would trade him is for an upgrade in a package and our cap. He plays very similar to Conner brown who Ottawa loves, but sure he's a fringe 3rd liner.

 

[habsfan44]

Your right, this ask for Miller won't be met, because wether its the Rangers or Leafs, Miller isn't worth whats being asked for. His contract just isn't long enough.

....and if the ask is met , what will your opinion be then ?

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

....and if the ask is met , what will your opinion be then ?

That I was wrong and I'll admit it. I don't believe I am though, guess we will see.

 

[habsfan44]

Reality is history of these deals do not coincide with the logic of HF

I think we're saying the same thing .

 

[Canuck Luck]

Because leafs can't afford to lose him for a pick, he needs to be replaced with someone better or we just keep him because he plays very well in the regular and post season. Hes also the 2nd highest cap hit on our team outside of our core players, the other being Mrazek. Its not hard to understand.

Okay change the proposal to a value of thread lol. I'd wager the majority if not all of the 30 other fanbases do not value Kefoot at a 2nd round pick either.

Sure Kerfoot may be the best option the Leafs have for the role he's currently in, that does not mean the propped up stats he's gotten from it are his value to other teams. Do you think the Canucks look at Kerfoot putitng up 50+ playing with Tavares and Nylander and say hey he can do this with Dickinson + Pearson or even Horvat and Garland? His stats would immediately plummet dropping the value you're saying he should have. The only chance a team values him at a 2nd is if they have a spot next to 2 guys like Nylander and Tavares where he could be an upgrade for them. Now look around the league and you'll see theres no other team with that kind of spot needing to be filled.

Other teams will see him as that 30-35 point 3rd line player that can fill in as a complimentary 2nd liner if you have better talents to carry him.

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

Okay change the proposal to a value of thread lol. I'd wager the majority if not all of the 30 other fanbases do not value Kefoot at a 2nd round pick either.

Sure Kerfoot may be the best option the Leafs have for the role he's currently in, that does not mean the propped up stats he's gotten from it are his value to other teams. Do you think the Canucks look at Kerfoot putitng up 50+ playing with Tavares and Nylander and say hey he can do this with Dickinson + Pearson or even Horvat and Garland? His stats would immediately plummet dropping the value you're saying he should have. The only chance a team values him at a 2nd is if they have a spot next to 2 guys like Nylander and Tavares where he could be an upgrade for them. Now look around the league and you'll see theres no other team with that kind of spot needing to be filled

I understand what your trying to say, and sure on the Canucks even without Miller there are wingers the Canucks would rather use in their top 6, but its not just offense that kerfoot can provide, its a 200 foot game. My point is that he has value even to the canucks playing a 3rd line role. Why do you think your Gm wants to get faster, because he wants the team to be quick on transition and aggressive defensively 5 on 5 and on the pk as well. Kerfoot fits that description 110%. Hes not a massive asset but he's a good one who could help most teams.

 

[habsfan44]

That I was wrong and I'll admit it. I don't believe I am though, guess we will see.

Kudos to you sir . The ability to admit when one is wrong is a gift that far to few people possess and you're absolutely right , we will have to wait and see .

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

Kudos to you sir . The ability to admit when one is wrong is a gift that far to few people possess and you're absolutely right , we will have to wait and see .

Nice chatting with you and I genuinely hope habs land 1st overall this year, its nice when both teams are competitive and have young stars. Makes the rivalry much more fun.

 

[Nylanderthal]

Hard, hard pass from Toronto's perspective.

The "deal" for Miller to Toronto pretty simply boils down to:
- One of Robertson, Amirov, or maybe Liljegren
- 1st Round Pick 2022
- Travis Dermott or a 3rd
- Some conditional 2023 pick depending on the Leafs success in either year

for Miller at 50%

"Buying" teams dont subtract material / important players like Kerfoot from their roster.

This the basis of a trade between the two teams I’ve been pitching for a while and one that makes sense, maybe sun liljegren for Niemela as liljegren is contributing now

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

Right and this deal would give up not only a 1st, but also:

Dermott - (RFA Controlled Asset)
Kerfoot - (C/LW 40 point)
Knies - B+ Prospect
4th

I don't see where Foligno plays into the mix here. There's a long list of Teams that overpay for assets at the deadline. The cost of giving a first is a lot less of a gamble then the one mentioned in this thread. Maybe Canucks get lucky.. land a massive deal. I'm just saying the direct Rangers trade proposed is inferior.

Leafs are a playoff Team and wouldn't move Kerfoot unless it meant getting a better forward back. He definitely has value and I have no doubt he'd get a 2nd +. Playoff teams add assets afterall....

None of which move the needle, Kerfoot and Dermott we don't want or need, Knies is a great asset, but redundant there for not a need, the 4th is a nothing pick.

Like none of that stuff makes any sense for us, and it certainly doesn't make the deal that much sweeter, especially considering it would be easily beat.

The Rangers trade is way better and gives us more of what we actually need.