Hypothetical If Arizona Pick Bedard would a Matthews/Bedard deal be possible?

[Racer88]

Outplaying, outscoring, and barely losing to a contender in a playoff series doesn't invalidate one from being a contender.

It's literally impossible for him to do that.

Why is it literally impossible for Matthews to refuse to sign an extension hold out for his final year and walk for free. This happens all the time in the NHL

 

[Dekes For Days]

Why is it literally impossible for Matthews to refuse to sign an extension hold out for his final year and walk for free. This happens all the time in the NHL

Well, first off, it doesn't "happen all the time in the NHL". It's an extremely rare occurrence that has pretty much never happened for this caliber of player, much less in a big, successful market with money. But more importantly, that has nothing to do with what you said. It's impossible for him to "sign an extension before his no trade kicks in" because him being eligible to be re-signed and his no-trade kicking in happen simultaneously.

 

[Legion34]

Its not even theoretically possible. Matthews got NMC, he either gets resigned (which he will), or he playing with Beddar in Arizona.

In what way is it not possible?

The lottery will happen in like may. His NTC will kick in July 1.

The only thing that would change is that Arizona would be want Toronto to pay his sb

Matthews would have to agree at that point.

The idea Matthews would want to play in a 5k arena and lose millions in endorsements is silly.

But if he was willing to extend in Arizona and they got him for 2 years at 8 million total that would be worth a ton

 

[ACC1224]

its all in the timing

The Penguins were virtually on their way out of the NHL when they got Crosby... he saved the day... right place right time

Don't think the LA situation was quite as urgent but maybe it was... that area also needed a big boost because of it sheer size and potential but at that time they were hurting and also at risk of losing the franchise.. sure enough in comes Gretzky to catapult that franchise into the mainstream and then from that came the other bay teams like the Sharks, Ducks

Now, the Coyotes are today in serious danger of losing their franchise right here and right now... not to mention it's Matthews hometown and he also has Crosby and Gretzky potential so you do the math


...now back to my can of primer

Yep and it doesn't add up.
Spot the difference in the situations of both Gretzky, Crosby and Matthews and you'll see why.

 

[Twine Tickler]

If Auston was unwilling to sign a reasonable extension this summer, or an extension in general for that matter, this would be the exact framework of a deal I'd be exploring.

Swapping generational talents, but we gain team control of Bedard for much longer.

Oddly enough if I were zona, or whatever team with the 1OA, I likely say no to that deal. Bedard is a franchise altering player. A once in a decade level talent.

 

[Gary Nylund]

its all in the timing

The Penguins were virtually on their way out of the NHL when they got Crosby... he saved the day... right place right time

Don't think the LA situation was quite as urgent but maybe it was... that area also needed a big boost because of it sheer size and potential but at that time they were hurting and also at risk of losing the franchise.. sure enough in comes Gretzky to catapult that franchise into the mainstream and then from that came the other bay teams like the Sharks, Ducks

Now, the Coyotes are today in serious danger of losing their franchise right here and right now... not to mention it's Matthews hometown and he also has Crosby and Gretzky potential so you do the math

...now back to my can of primer

I hope you're not serious.

 

[supermann_98]

This.

And all the talk about Arizona getting a brand spankin' new arena, I'll believe it when I see it. The damn thing is far from complete.

That said, if Matthews leaves, he leaves. I certainly won't lose any sleep.

I used to be terrified at the thought of some team offer-sheeting him.

Now as much as it would suck to lose him, if he pulls a Gaudreau or whatever, we'd have $12m to spend on a replacement #1C. Admittedly those don't grow on trees, it took 8 years or so between Sundin as the #1C to having Matthews fill those shoes, but there's lots of good players who become available every year.

This has to be a partnership between Matthews and the Leafs. If he just wants every cent he can get, well he's not a leader he's a mercenary and really, is that what you hang your hopes on come playoff time?

 

[ACC1224]

I used to be terrified at the thought of some team offer-sheeting him.

Now as much as it would suck to lose him, if he pulls a Gaudreau or whatever, we'd have $12m to spend on a replacement #1C. Admittedly those don't grow on trees, it took 8 years or so between Sundin as the #1C to having Matthews fill those shoes, but there's lots of good players who become available every year.

This has to be a partnership between Matthews and the Leafs. If he just wants every cent he can get, well he's not a leader he's a mercenary and really, is that what you hang your hopes on come playoff time?

Having Marner still on the roster will certainly soften the blow if Matthews does leave.

 

[NewZealandMike]

Having Marner still on the roster will certainly soften the blow if Matthews does leave.

It will end our Stanley Cup Aspirations if Matthews leaves in FA. We will become a middling team again. Don't get me wrong I like Austin a lot. Its the contract that is of concern, some rumours have shown up of $15m 8years. That will also cripple us if signed at that level. Again no room to add complimentary quality players not adding league minimum bottom 6. I don't envy Dubas in this to be honest. A trade would have to be examined at great length, filling multiple holes with young talent at minimum. Plus Plus Plus

 

[Gary Nylund]

It will end our Stanley Cup Aspirations if Matthews leaves in FA. We will become a middling team again. Don't get me wrong I like Austin a lot. Its the contract that is of concern, some rumours have shown up of $15m 8years. That will also cripple us if signed at that level. Again no room to add complimentary quality players not adding league minimum bottom 6. I don't envy Dubas in this to be honest. A trade would have to be examined at great length, filling multiple holes with young talent at minimum. Plus Plus Plus

I don't think Matthews is likely to go anywhere. But if he does, the chances of McDavid coming here to take his place seems pretty good.

On the thread subject, if Berard for Matthews (presumably AZ/Matthews will have negotiated an extension before agreeing to the deal) was on the table, I'd do that without hesitation. Stuff like this almost never happens though so I wouldn't spend too much time thinking about it.

 

[Mess]

In this hypothetical the only way Arizona would make this trade is if they got Matthews on a long term deal first.

Remember Matthews would be in the last year of his current deal and what would stop him from playing 1 year in Arizona while the Leafs draft Bedard and then while he is on his ELC return to Toronto the following year as a UFA ?

Matthews @ $15 mil and Bedard @ $975k = < $16 mil combined.

Or this is what Arizona is thinking and instead of trading Bedard they draft him to lure Auston to the dessert instead.

Arizona is going to need some star power for their new building .

Coyotes proposed new arena project advances to public vote​

NHL Commissioner Bettman calls $2.1 billion district plan 'a win-win for the community'
November 29, 2022

Coyotes proposed new arena project advances to public vote | NHL.com

NHL Commissioner Bettman calls $2.1 billion district plan 'a win-win for the community'

www.nhl.com

 

[ACC1224]

It will end our Stanley Cup Aspirations if Matthews leaves in FA. We will become a middling team again. Don't get me wrong I like Austin a lot. Its the contract that is of concern, some rumours have shown up of $15m 8years. That will also cripple us if signed at that level. Again no room to add complimentary quality players not adding league minimum bottom 6. I don't envy Dubas in this to be honest. A trade would have to be examined at great length, filling multiple holes with young talent at minimum. Plus Plus Plus

I don't believe that at all and I doubt many do.

 

[Mickey Marner]

I don't believe that at all and I doubt many do.

It would suck, but it’s not the end of the world. The Islanders went to back-to-back conference finals after losing Tavares. Calgary lost Gaudreau and Tkachuk, but gained Huberdeau, Kadri and Weegar. Even Edmonton won without Gretzky. I’m sure there are plenty of more examples.

 

[Gary Nylund]

It would suck, but it’s not the end of the world. The Islanders went to back-to-back conference finals after losing Tavares. Calgary lost Gaudreau and Tkachuk, but gained Huberdeau, Kadri and Weegar. Even Edmonton won without Gretzky. I’m sure there are plenty of more examples.

Quebec was forced to trade holdout Lindros is another one.

 

[therealkoho]

Matthews doesn't wanna play in front of a 5k seat arena in a dead end market that's spun it's wheels since it's inception. For him to do the most good for Arizona, he needs to play and succeed in a highly visible market like New York, Toronto or LA.

It's all about the Bennies dont you know!

 

[therealkoho]

It will end our Stanley Cup Aspirations if Matthews leaves in FA. We will become a middling team again. Don't get me wrong I like Austin a lot. Its the contract that is of concern, some rumours have shown up of $15m 8years. That will also cripple us if signed at that level. Again no room to add complimentary quality players not adding league minimum bottom 6. I don't envy Dubas in this to be honest. A trade would have to be examined at great length, filling multiple holes with young talent at minimum. Plus Plus Plus

It would never get to him leaving in FA, he'd be traded before the NMC kicked in. I'd imagine the Leafs would quietly tender the contract out to 5 or 6 teams in the west and then take the best deal

 

[NewZealandMike]

I don't believe that at all and I doubt many do.

Losing him for nothing does not change the team??? Your insight is mildly clouded

 

[ACC1224]

Losing him for nothing does not change the team??? Your insight is mildly clouded

Of course it changes the team but it doesn't mean "it will end....."
You, me or anyone else has no clue what the impact will be until we see who they spend the money on.
Perhaps they give his money to McDavid.

Hope that clears things up for you. Speaking in absolutes is always a little silly.

 

[Arzak]

In what way is it not possible?

The lottery will happen in like may. His NTC will kick in July 1.

The only thing that would change is that Arizona would be want Toronto to pay his sb

Matthews would have to agree at that point.

The idea Matthews would want to play in a 5k arena and lose millions in endorsements is silly.

But if he was willing to extend in Arizona and they got him for 2 years at 8 million total that would be worth a ton

oh my bad, he can be technically traded for Beddar.Thanks for the clarification.


From the player's perspective or Arizona's for that matter, it makes 0 sense.


Matthews is either interested in playing in Arizona or not (extending with Leafs. another team in UFA).

If he is interested in playing in Arizona, he would most likely prefer to play with Beddar than without him.

Leafs can technically trade him before July 1, but Arizona is not a contender, paying for 1 year of Matthews services with Beddar, why? If he is interested he'll be there next year.

If he is not, you are not paying Beddar for ONE season of Matthews on a struggling team.

btw full NMC not NTC, not that it makes difference.

 

[NewZealandMike]

oh my bad, he can be technically traded for Beddar.Thanks for the clarification.


From the player's perspective or Arizona's for that matter, it makes 0 sense.


Matthews is either interested in playing in Arizona or not (extending with Leafs. another team in UFA).

If he is interested in playing in Arizona, he would most likely prefer to play with Beddar than without him.

Leafs can technically trade him before July 1, but Arizona is not a contender, paying for 1 year of Matthews services with Beddar, why? If he is interested he'll be there next year.

If he is not, you are not paying Beddar for ONE season of Matthews on a struggling team.

btw full NMC not NTC, not that it makes difference.

This is not a slight to Austin, this is an "IF" Austin demands too much....Dubas has to make a trade that will involve not getting the best player in the deal

 

[HogTown06]

So after we spent years dreaming of a player of Matthews' caliber, we are now going to trade him for a prospect?

The only way Matthews is traded is if a contract can't be agreed on before his NTC kicks in. Otherwise he'll be a Leaf for the rest of his career.

 

[edog37]

I used to be terrified at the thought of some team offer-sheeting him.

Now as much as it would suck to lose him, if he pulls a Gaudreau or whatever, we'd have $12m to spend on a replacement #1C. Admittedly those don't grow on trees, it took 8 years or so between Sundin as the #1C to having Matthews fill those shoes, but there's lots of good players who become available every year.

This has to be a partnership between Matthews and the Leafs. If he just wants every cent he can get, well he's not a leader he's a mercenary and really, is that what you hang your hopes on come playoff time?

ask Edmonton the same question.....so far, we all know the answer.

 

[Fogelhund]

So after we spent years dreaming of a player of Matthews' caliber, we are now going to trade him for a prospect?

The only way Matthews is traded is if a contract can't be agreed on before his NTC kicks in. Otherwise he'll be a Leaf for the rest of his career.

"For a Prospect"

Yup, just your average run of the mill prospect.

Look, such a trade would never happen, mostly because the team holding the pick for Bedard wouldn't likely make such a trade. In case you haven't been paying attention, Bedard isn't just a prospect, he achieving things that neither Matthews, nor McDavid, nor Crosby ever did. At this stage, he's probably the best prospect since Gretzky.

Now that doesn't mean he translates to that in the NHL.... but if we don't succeed this year, some change is needed. We all might have some ideas on what that entails, but if you can bring in the top junior player in several decades, while opening up $10 mil in cap space to sign other players... maybe a Kane, maybe Meier, maybe a RoR and Tarasenko... maybe a forward and D... it gives you incredible flexibility and cap room.

What is most important, is the future of the team, not the individual players. If we have great success in the playoffs, and Matty is willing to extend, of course we don't make moves. But if we fail again, or he isn't willing to extend, then you would absolutely take this trade, without even thinking about it.

 

[Gary Nylund]

So after we spent years dreaming of a player of Matthews' caliber, we are now going to trade him for a prospect?

The only way Matthews is traded is if a contract can't be agreed on before his NTC kicks in. Otherwise he'll be a Leaf for the rest of his career.

LOL at calling Bedard "a prospect".

 

[Racer88]

Well, first off, it doesn't "happen all the time in the NHL". It's an extremely rare occurrence that has pretty much never happened for this caliber of player, much less in a big, successful market with money. But more importantly, that has nothing to do with what you said. It's impossible for him to "sign an extension before his no trade kicks in" because him being eligible to be re-signed and his no-trade kicking in happen simultaneously.

Can they agree to an extension in principle prior to the date that he can sign/no trade kicks in? I’m assuming not, so the only leverage Dubas has left himself is if he thinks they can’t reach a deal is to trade him before the deadline this spring. Otherwise Matthews can ask for whatever he wants and has all the power.