How many first round loses is Dubas allowed before he should be fired?

[Beaumaris]

Oh? How many would you give him? Or is it just a free pass?

Firing anyone,you start at the top bud,that’s where the real problem lies.

 

[LeafEgo]

So for all intents and purposes, Dubas did his job. EVERYONE did their jobs. The only people who DIDN'T do their jobs was the players shooting mindlessly at Vasilevskiy with all these low danger shots. And even then, the Leafs TECHNICALLY scored two goals and played to a tie, but ended up losing a goal on a technicality.

This is backwards thinking. Unless players are not fulfilling their contractual obligations (skipping practices, etc.), they are the ones that did their job. You can’t simply tell players to ‘go back out there again but be better’.

If you want different results you have to either replace players (GM) or better deploy and develop the ones you have (Coach).

Folks at the top always bear responsibility for performance.

 

[Rob Brown]

How many shitty troll posts is OP going to be allowed to make where he pretends to be a Leafs fan before he is kicked out of this section?

 

[cannucky]

Heh. Watching you guys scream and shout like you have any idea any of you know what you're talking about is like watching ants scramble after knocking down their ant hills.

Dubas did exactly that. The reality is you don't build a team that can win it all, you build a team that has a CHANCE to win it all. Quit acting like all you have to do is follow some magical formula and you'll win no prob. There is no magical formula. Even a bump to the wrong player in the wrong place at the wrong time can end a playoff run. And you'll never know when some young nobody will discover some font of energy that makes all the different.

So stop it. Just stop. YOU DON'T KNOW. You don't know ANYTHING.

What we DO know is PROBABILITY, and probability dictates this team as it is now has a better chance of making the right tweaks to win than tearing it all down and starting over. Like going back to square one NOW is the best way to win it all. You know what we call that in trading? Panic sellers. They're the people that always go broke.

"Heh. Watching you guys scream and shout "
Says the guy typing in caps like that makes the words louder and somehow more meaningful . Nobody said it was a magic formula , it is in fact a tried and true proven formula . Your personal manbla crush is the one who arrogantly thinks he has found a magical math formula that re-invents the sport of hockey , keep gobbling there pal , try not to choke on the kool aid when he gives it to ya .

How many shitty troll posts is OP going to be allowed to make where he pretends to be a Leafs fan before he is kicked out of this section?

By my count he still has 742 left to go , you can however just put him on ignore if your backside hurts when you read his posts .

 

[LeafEgo]

The irony being that if you flipped the timeline with Dubas and Lou Lam around, and it was Dubas that inherited a last overall team, and drafted Matthews #1OA and then restored the Leafs to a playoff team, after a record setting regular season, but lost in round #1 after his 3 years of service, with then Lou Lam a proven Cup winner, and he then went on to deliver 4 straight (including some embarrassing performance CBJ and MON) round #1 losses thereafter those same people would be screaming bloody murder. IMO

I'll go one further that had Lou Lam be given the opportunity to continue on and then lost to teams like CBJ and MON running his playoff record to 0-4 or 0-5 in terms of advancing beyond round #1, then there wouldn't be a single Leaf fan on the planet that wouldn't want him replaced and rightfully so, in the best interest of the Leafs team.

So logiacally trying to explain why Lou Lam record at 0-2 in round #1 losses is BAD, yeat now Kyle Dubas now at 0-4 (after inheriting a +100 point team, and young core) is GOOD, is illogical, if the measure of job performance is based on playoff round wins.

Many direct Lou/Dubas comparisons forget the lifecycle of the team.

Lou should be judged by how well he positioned the team for future success. Dubas should be judged by how well he executed success.

For example. comparing whose team had a better defensive roster, or whose team made it further in the playoffs, doesn't make any sense.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Firing anyone,you start at the top bud,that’s where the real problem lies.

Can't argue there.

 

[Mess]

Many direct Lou/Dubas comparisons forget the lifecycle of the team.

Lou should be judged by how well he positioned the team for future success. Dubas should be judged by how well he executed success.

For example. comparing whose team had a better defensive roster, or whose team made it further in the playoffs, doesn't make any sense.

Better defensive roster ?? .... Besides how are you defining 'better" its subjective?

If Dubas had a better defensive roster how come he didn't produce better playoff results?

The 2017-18 Leafs team last managed under Lou Lam gave up 232 goals against vs 2021-22 Leafs team last managed by Dubas gave up 253 GA [+ 21 extra goals against]. That is actual not subjective.

Of the 8 teams the made the playoffs from the Eastern conference this year the Leafs would be ranked 8th and last in most goals against in comparison. The Tampa Bay team that they lost to gave up 233 GA and -20 goals less, and would have compared better against the Leafs 2017-18 roster that surrendered 232 GA because they were better defensively speaking.

At what point do we start counting playoff round wins with Dubas?

 

[DANTHEMAN1967]

I've been following the Leafs since the early 2000s. I have very little experience in winning unfortunately.

Yet I seem to be the least satisfied with the results.

Lou was let go after a, then, franchise record of 105 points and a close series against Boston. Even though he inherited a sub 70 point Leafs team just 3 years earlier.

Dubas inherited a 105 point team and has zero playoff series wins after four years. Yet he's allowed to keep his job because the Leafs didn't completely embarass themselves.

I say "completely" because losing for the 6th consecutive time is still embarrassing.

Context is key.
Lou got to have Nylander, Marner and Matthews on their ELCs.
Dubas has since managed to sign the three and deal with the Covid capfreeze and still managed to improve the Leaf s by 10 points.
Lou had the much easier job.

 

[Confucius]

This seems like one of those “not sure if serious” posts.

Of course it’s serious. Regular season more accurate than playoffs, every year

Only fans of teams that have 0 playoff success say that. Nobody cares who finishes where in the regular season. Teams play for the cup. Regular season means dick. I wouldn't take the Leafs over any of the final 4/5 teams here.

maybe most don’t care, that is true and I agree. It still doesn’t change things. Playoffs are a crap shoot.

which team is favoured to win their series? Avs or Oilers? We know it’s Avs they had the better regular season. Now if Edmonton wins their series because it is a short series where anything can happen, people will say Oilers are better than Avs and always were. Yeah sure….

 

[Mess]

Of course it’s serious. Regular season more accurate than playoffs, every year


maybe most don’t care, that is true and I agree. It still doesn’t change things. Playoffs are a crap shoot.

Tampa Bay finished 3rd on the Atlantic with 110 points and beat Leafs 2nd with 115 points and Florida (President's trophy) 122 points and now start on the road as the underdogs to NYR who finished 2nd behind Carolina.

The only value finishing hire than a opponent is to earn home ice and the potential last game at home the actual points don't really matter and this year every team in the East playoffs registered 100+ points so its only determines rankings and opponents. To put too much weight on it in terms of being better doesn't really matter if you lose to weaker opponents come playoff time.

So Florida set a new franchise best 122 regular season points which was also #1 among all teams, and then got swept in 4 games by Tampa in the playoffs, so are you seriously saying Florida is the better team and holds the bragging rights here?

 

[Confucius]

Tampa Bay finished 3rd on the Atlantic with 110 points and beat Leafs 2nd with 115 points and Florida (President's trophy) 122 points and now start on the road as the underdogs to NYR who finished 2nd behind Carolina.

The only value finishing hire than a opponent is to earn home ice and the potential last game at home the actual points don't really matter and this year every team in the East playoffs registered 100+ points so its only determines rankings and opponents. To put too much weight on it in terms of being better doesn't really matter if you lose to weaker opponents come playoff time.

So Florida set a new franchise best 122 regular season points which was also #1 among all teams, and then got swept in 4 games by Tampa in the playoffs, so are you seriously saying Florida is the better team and holds the bragging rights here?

Florida was the highest scoring team in the NHL. They are better. Look through the season and Cherry pick a timeline over 4 to 7 games for every team. Chances are you will find even a bottom dwellIng team that went 4 and 3 and a top team that went 3 and 4. Playoffs are no different. Get on a roll at the right time you are Golden.

 

[TorMapleJays]

There are a few who are unable to determine for themselves what’s going on so defer to management being infallible and just running everything back in hopes that one day they get it right.
Kadri is just an example of a heart and soul player, many value that.

I wish our front office valued it.

 

[Bomber0104]

Of course it’s serious. Regular season more accurate than playoffs, every year

"Regular season more accurate" of what, exactly?

You're aware the goal of every organization is to win the Stanley Cup, not the President's Trophy right?

 

[ACC1224]

Of course it’s serious. Regular season more accurate than playoffs, every year


maybe most don’t care, that is true and I agree. It still doesn’t change things. Playoffs are a crap shoot.

which team is favoured to win their series? Avs or Oilers? We know it’s Avs they had the better regular season. Now if Edmonton wins their series because it is a short series where anything can happen, people will say Oilers are better than Avs and always were. Yeah sure….

There are so many more variables in the regular season than the playoffs that it can’t be.

 

[Confucius]

There are so many more variables in the regular season than the playoffs that it can’t be.

Avs or oilers who is favoured. Avs why because they finished 2nd and oilers finished 11th. Now if oilers win the series guess they fooled everyone and were just sitting in the bushes flirting with not even qualifying for the playoffs with 2 weeks left in the reg. Season.

playoffs anything can happen. Do you really think Tampa is so superior to the Panthers Florida can’t even win a single game. Every time they -lay it should be a lock win for Tampa then.

edit to add, fine you guys are correct the playoffs are the end all be all. We went 7 games with the 2 time league best team, the team may well three peat. We lost by a goal no need to make any changes we are 1 game worse then the best team in the league. Could have won. And we already are far superior than the Panthers

 

[Racer88]

Avs or oilers who is favoured. Avs why because they finished 2nd and oilers finished 11th. Now if oilers win the series guess they fooled everyone and were just sitting in the bushes flirting with not even qualifying for the playoffs with 2 weeks left in the reg. Season.

playoffs anything can happen. Do you really think Tampa is so superior to the Panthers Florida can’t even win a single game. Every time they -lay it should be a lock win for Tampa then.

The score tonight so far is 1-0 oilers

 

[AllHeartNoSkill]

The score tonight so far is 1-0 oilers

This was short lived

 

[Racer88]

This was short lived

Lol….….it lasted as long as it took me to type it in

 

[LeafEgo]

Avs or oilers who is favoured. Avs why because they finished 2nd and oilers finished 11th. Now if oilers win the series guess they fooled everyone and were just sitting in the bushes flirting with not even qualifying for the playoffs with 2 weeks left in the reg. Season.

playoffs anything can happen. Do you really think Tampa is so superior to the Panthers Florida can’t even win a single game. Every time they -lay it should be a lock win for Tampa then.

Just watching a few regular season games and a few playoffs games it should be pretty evident that the level of effort is much higher in the playoffs. And that's just what you see on the ice.

It's actually the regular season where anything can happen in a game. The playoffs is the ultimate test of who is the better hockey team.

The Bolts are so superior to the Panthers - that was made abundantly clear.

 

[ACC1224]

Avs or oilers who is favoured. Avs why because they finished 2nd and oilers finished 11th. Now if oilers win the series guess they fooled everyone and were just sitting in the bushes flirting with not even qualifying for the playoffs with 2 weeks left in the reg. Season.

playoffs anything can happen. Do you really think Tampa is so superior to the Panthers Florida can’t even win a single game. Every time they -lay it should be a lock win for Tampa then.

edit to add, fine you guys are correct the playoffs are the end all be all. We went 7 games with the 2 time league best team, the team may well three peat. We lost by a goal no need to make any changes we are 1 game worse then the best team in the league. Could have won. And we already are far superior than the Panthers

Like I said there are so many more variables during the season than during the playoffs. Playoffs is pretty much an equal footing for both teams. Teams rarely play disinterested in the playoffs. You can see that on any given night around the league during the season.

From what I’ve see. The Leafs are right there with Tampa and NY in all areas but behind the bench.

 

[Racer88]

Zachary Hyman lighting it up in the playoffs…….6 straight playoff games with a goal.
wish we had a guy like that……oh wait we did……..thanks a lot Dubas

 

[Confucius]

Just watching a few regular season games and a few playoffs games it should be pretty evident that the level of effort is much higher in the playoffs. And that's just what you see on the ice.

It's actually the regular season where anything can happen in a game. The playoffs is the ultimate test of who is the better hockey team.

The Bolts are so superior to the Panthers - that was made abundantly clear.

Yeah you guys convinced me. We are so much better than the Panthers. Those guys have to tear it up not us. We almost took out the best team in the league, one more goal and we could have been the best team in the league. And fans are pissed, lol.

 

[rocketman588]

Context is key.
Lou got to have Nylander, Marner and Matthews on their ELCs.
Dubas has since managed to sign the three and deal with the Covid capfreeze and still managed to improve the Leaf s by 10 points.
Lou had the much easier job.

The cap crunch is Dubases fault

Lou had to aquire those players and had them younger

Dubas got them handed to him and f***ed it up because he wanted to "reset the market" for whatever reason

 

[Leaf Fans]

Zachary Hyman lighting it up in the playoffs…….6 straight playoff games with a goal.
wish we had a guy like that……oh wait we did……..thanks a lot Dubas

Yup,he has 13 points in his 32 playoff games with Toronto.

 

[LeafEgo]

Yeah you guys convinced me. We are so much better than the Panthers. Those guys have to tear it up not us. We almost took out the best team in the league, one more goal and we could have been the best team in the league. And fans are pissed, lol.

Leafs didn't play the Panthers so we don't know that.

Certainly the Bolts are better than both, which to many is not surprising despite the regular season standings.