Has Dubas failed at his job?

[Stonehands1990]

Unfortunately it won't. Leafs will be good enough for Keefe and Dubas their jobs. But not good enough to move forward

It's essentially Doug Wilson of San Jose. Always good enough to retain their jobs but can't do anything beyond that

At least they went to the finals

We should have already fired Keefe

This is an excellent comparison

Having said that if Dubas and Shanny can’t see how poorly the team is coached they all have to go

 

[Stonehands1990]

And Colorado?

How does Kadri showing heart by throwing a dirty hit in game 3 and being in the press box for games 4-7 help anyone's situation. It ruined our center depth which was a strength for us against the Bruins when they had Bergeron and Krejci. People keep going to bat for a guy that is constantly suspended. Again you can have a heart and soul player that isn't an idiot and costs your team constantly.

Marner and Matthews choking is a separate issue and im not forgiving of that at all. They are solely the reason we lost against MTL this year. That plus the power play, which is on the coaching staff.

Maybe if Kadri wasn’t the only physical forward on the team things play out differently

I’ve been in his exact position before with the same results

 

[mydnyte]

For all of Kadris knucklehead decisions the one thing he was not is soft and passive. Over the line stupid sometimes? yep, but there was no denying his moxy, which this team has been lacking.

there is a time and a place for everything, and Kadri lacks the 'control' to help his team.
he is like Tie Domi was in that regard.
think back to the Leafs vs NJD's, (they were our kryptonite before Boston) we had them on the ropes, and were ready to finally knock them out and advance (our best chance post Kerry Fraser) then Domi goes idiot on Niedermayer and we lose the series as a result.
that one selfish incident cost us the series, in the same way, Kadri's multiple selfish incidents cost us series we could/should have won.
We could use a Darcy Tucker, who was very much like Kadri, but, he knew how to pick his spots and control himself a little bit better.

 

[mydnyte]

And Colorado?

How does Kadri showing heart by throwing a dirty hit in game 3 and being in the press box for games 4-7 help anyone's situation. It ruined our center depth which was a strength for us against the Bruins when they had Bergeron and Krejci. People keep going to bat for a guy that is constantly suspended. Again you can have a heart and soul player that isn't an idiot and costs your team constantly.

Marner and Matthews choking is a separate issue and im not forgiving of that at all. They are solely the reason we lost against MTL this year. That plus the power play, which is on the coaching staff.

No, not at all, the loss is mainly on the coach for playing Hyman on the top line (and other lineup screw-ups)
Hyman killed the offense, and sucked more than anyone on the team and blew tons of chances.
Matthews was always double teamed/shadowed because Mtl knew Hyman was completely worthless and not a threat to score on Price. he (Hyman) even blocked an open net sure goal shot (from Marner) in game 7 ...or was it gm 6, or both, because he blocked a few of our own shots because he SUCKS in front of the net.
I am thankful that the Oilers overpaid him, and he is gone.

 

[GreatSaveEssensa]

Sam Jose offered JT 13 million

So? Just because one guy is stupider than the other, it doesn't mean the other guy is smart.

 

[ottomaddox]

Maybe if Kadri wasn’t the only physical forward on the team things play out differently

I’ve been in his exact position before with the same results

I don't buy that. If a player gets frustrated his best option is to hit people when they are vulnerable?

 

[supermann_98]

How can anyone actually answer no at this point, the whole organization has failed. If I told you when Dubas was hired we wouldn’t have won a round yet, people would have said that it’s an unreal failure, not today it’s a divided board, Again, it’s yes across the board, no means moving the goal posts and/or bizarre man crush. No lol. This place….

Agreed 100% but the Dubas' apologists are dividing placement of blame at the feet of the players and/or Keefe.

Yes, they can and should take some of the blame but that's not the question. The question of whether he has failed or not is a straight yes/no answer and to this point in time he has failed miserably.

"His drafting record blah blah blah"
"He's made philosophical adjustments blah blah blah"

He's failed, and he's doubling down on his failures by not making any core changes. It's like replacing the deck chairs on the Titanic instead of understanding and correcting the root cause of the problem.

Luckily we'll be spared from his decision making next year after the team fails to get past the first round again. I'm just hoping he doesn't bankrupt the team of draft picks and prospects capital to (hopefully) squeak past the first round just to save his job

 

[supermann_98]

Dubas has improved the roster every year with the same results. Unfortunately he is handcuffed by the big 4 contracts and lack of playoff production from them. As a rookie gm could he really afford to let his stars take turns sitting? He’s had to clean up and move some players / contracts as well. Under the circumstances He’s done his job well

He's handcuffed by his own f***-ups so he doesn't get a pass

 

[DarkKnight]

Agreed 100% but the Dubas' apologists are dividing placement of blame at the feet of the players and/or Keefe.

Yes, they can and should take some of the blame but that's not the question. The question of whether he has failed or not is a straight yes/no answer and to this point in time he has failed miserably.

"His drafting record blah blah blah"
"He's made philosophical adjustments blah blah blah"

He's failed, and he's doubling down on his failures by not making any core changes. It's like replacing the deck chairs on the Titanic instead of understanding and correcting the root cause of the problem.

Luckily we'll be spared from his decision making next year after the team fails to get past the first round again. I'm just hoping he doesn't bankrupt the team of draft picks and prospects capital to (hopefully) squeak past the first round just to save his job

You don’t get to compartmentalize the blame, he’s the GM….it’s like blaming the soldiers and weapons but absolving the General. Come on.

 

[fahad203]

Agreed 100% but the Dubas' apologists are dividing placement of blame at the feet of the players and/or Keefe.

Yes, they can and should take some of the blame but that's not the question. The question of whether he has failed or not is a straight yes/no answer and to this point in time he has failed miserably.

"His drafting record blah blah blah"
"He's made philosophical adjustments blah blah blah"

He's failed, and he's doubling down on his failures by not making any core changes. It's like replacing the deck chairs on the Titanic instead of understanding and correcting the root cause of the problem.

Luckily we'll be spared from his decision making next year after the team fails to get past the first round again. I'm just hoping he doesn't bankrupt the team of draft picks and prospects capital to (hopefully) squeak past the first round just to save his job

What Dubas should be doing is the opposite of everything he thinks about or believes in
He believes in being a good player loving guy, someone who's honest and transparent

Lou, Bowman(both), Lombardi, Rutherford, Yzerman were never going to be known as player loving GM. They dont' care to be

Yzerman had no problem benching upcoming prodigy in Drouin
Lou has a history of Daneyko or other so called star prodigies and benching them

This is not a position where you are paid to be liked

Lets get Kane, Virtanen and Voynov into the roaster. Do they have a bad rep of being A-holes. Yes
I'll take that rep over being bunch of sore losers and chokers

Worse part isnt' when you have bad character but not having any character like our current leafs



You think any Chariot, Tanev, Edmundson, Perry pushes our goalies or Matthews, Marner around with those players around?
Not a chance

 

[killer1980]

No, not at all, the loss is mainly on the coach for playing Hyman on the top line (and other lineup screw-ups)
Hyman killed the offense, and sucked more than anyone on the team and blew tons of chances.
Matthews was always double teamed/shadowed because Mtl knew Hyman was completely worthless and not a threat to score on Price. he (Hyman) even blocked an open net sure goal shot (from Marner) in game 7 ...or was it gm 6, or both, because he blocked a few of our own shots because he SUCKS in front of the net.
I am thankful that the Oilers overpaid him, and he is gone.

Loved Hyman but offensively he was like the basketball player they leave open for the 3 point shot. He had very little chance of scoring. Saying that, I was a Hyman fan. The coach didn't know how to maximize each player playing to his strengths, He even wanted Marner to shoot more. Reminded me of my kid rolling the ball down the lane and got stopped by the pins. Keefe was just another Dubas Disaster.

 

[The CyNick]

I'll call you on that.

Which General Managers among Dave Nonis, Brian Burke, John Ferguson Jr., Floyd Smith, Gord Stellick and GerryMcNamara were better than Kyle Dubas?

I say none of them.

Bottom-three at best -- not a chance. There's a lot of stiff competition for the worst-three Leafs' GM's ever, and Kyle Dubas doesn't make it

I don't think Dubas is clearly better than any of the guys on your list.

The Ballard era guys were all handcuffed. So very tough to judge them on the same level as Dubas.

No other GM is Leafs history were handed what Dubas has been handed and then turned it into less.

Guys like Burke and Nonis started with junk and were under pressure to build a playoff team as soon as possible.

 

[The CyNick]

All indications from the team suggest to me it's not their last chance.

Worse than Punch Imlach (the second time), Gerry McNamara, Gord Stellick, Floyd Smith, JFJ, Brian Burke and Dave Nonis, who combined for eight playoff appearances in 23 years, of which six were in the 80s when 16 of 21 teams qualified?

Yes, Dubas is worse than those guys.

GMs don't start at the same position. Dubas had ownership willing to out spend every other team. Had superstar players in their early 20s. And he moved the team backwards.

Most GMs on the list were handcuffed or just couldn't make bad teams great.

 

[The CyNick]

Imlach II was probably the worst ever --- and actual dartboard material at that.

Stellick was on a whole other dimension, and would have to come in second.

McNamara and Smith were a real piece of work, too, and Burke and Nonis -- well @The CyNick -- I question your judgment on this call. You may have a penchant for exaggeration that's on display here.

No exaggeration whatsoever. He's awful.

 

[The CyNick]

Dubas' resume so far:

• Came as a GM in the most enviable position that any GM would give an arm and a leg to be in: team on the rise, plenty of cap space, assets
• Within a matter of few years: team decline, no cap space, UFAs walking , assets declining, 1st rounders out the door
• Taken to the woodshed by Nylander, Marner, Matthews
• Zamboni driver game
• hires a rookie coach-> Team shutout by CBJ, Blown series lead against Montreal
• Montreal colours on CN tower (can't remember shit like this under any past GM)
• Tells media he has some intergalactic computer that has special analytics (remember his Ceci comments?)
• Blames fans for calling out marner (called them stupid)
• No cap left to get quality depth on offense or defense with Rielly about to walk as UFA (add another UFA walking)
• Refuses picks for Hyman when Hyman was going to walk anyway... (how dumb was it to even allow Hyman to talk to Oilers without discussing any draft picks before hand)
• Trades a 1st rounder + 4th for retention because team has no cap space for an injured player at the TDL (Foligno was injured: well known fact now)
• Trades further picks for players not used -> Rittich, Hutton, Rielly Nash
• Sparks fiasco
• the list can continue....

If I wasn't a Leafs fan I would find it absolutely hilarious that a GM like him is still employed by the team

Agree 100%. His track record speaks for itself.

 

[zeke]

Agree 100%. His track record speaks for itself.

Agreed 100%, his record speaks for itself.

- Unlike the previous GM who inherited the best group of ELC talent in hockey and wasted it by signing horrible contracts, Dubas inherited a team with ZERO ELC talent left, going on 3 years now.
- Despite this lack of ELC talent, he managed to add an elite #1C and TWO Top-end Dmen, better adds than anything the previous GM was able to do even with tons of capspace.
- He continues to have zero bad contracts on his roster, with every single player extremely tradeable.
- Since he had the freedom to hire his own coach, his team has played at a 108pt pace and run away with the division in the only full season with his own coach in charge.
- Has managed to draft one of the better prospect pools in hockey, despite having no top picks.

 

[hotpaws]

Agreed 100%, his record speaks for itself.

- Unlike the previous GM who inherited the best group of ELC talent in hockey and wasted it by signing horrible contracts, Dubas inherited a team with ZERO ELC talent left, going on 3 years now.
- Despite this lack of ELC talent, he managed to add an elite #1C and TWO Top-end Dmen, better adds than anything the previous GM was able to do even with tons of capspace.
- He continues to have zero bad contracts on his roster, with every single player extremely tradeable.
- Since he had the freedom to hire his own coach, his team has played at a 108pt pace and run away with the division in the only full season with his own coach in charge.
- Has managed to draft one of the better prospect pools in hockey, despite having no top picks.

enjoy him while you can because he'll be kicked to the curb before the 22/23 seasons begins

 

[Dekes For Days]

he'll be kicked to the curb before the 22/23 seasons begins

Very unlikely.

 

[Racer88]

The beginning of this run of crappy playoff results always circles back to Dubas signing Tavares. Dubas had what he thought was 3 stars in the making……he did not need to tie up 11 million on a player that really hasn’t won anything and was essentially the same position of his current budding stars.
He risked an unconventional build by spending 50% on essentially the same position and it’s a mess especially since one of them can’t get the job done in the playoffs.
I wouldn’t have as much problem with the 50% model if it was balance between forward, defence and goal………but it is not

 

[Stephen]

Agreed 100%, his record speaks for itself.

- Unlike the previous GM who inherited the best group of ELC talent in hockey and wasted it by signing horrible contracts, Dubas inherited a team with ZERO ELC talent left, going on 3 years now.

Well, technically Dubas inherited 1x season of ELC each of Matthews, Marner each in 2018-19 (and Kapanen, as well, whom he originally traded for), which allowed him to underwrite the John Tavares contract.

So he did leverage the ELC advantage that was available to him the way he should have, but the jury's out on whether Tavares should have been our big ticket item.

 

[ACC1224]

Once Keefe is removed the clock will start ticking on Dubas.

 

[hotpaws]

Very unlikely.

he'll be gone and the majority of his supporters will turn on him

 

[Dekes For Days]

he'll be gone and the majority of his supporters will turn on him

Even more unlikely.

 

[hotpaws]

Even more unlikely.

that's what will exactly happen just like it did when Burke was fired

 

[All Mod Cons]

he'll be gone and the majority of his supporters will turn on him

Or they'll follow him to his next team? Hopefully.