GDT: GM #45 LA kings vs Pittsburgh Penguins @7:00
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BigKing
Blake Out of Hell III: Back in to Hell
If it didn't mean the Kings were flaming out, it is a bit fun to read how this is all DL's fault when it was DL's team rushing out to 1st place at the start of the season and Blake was a genius.
Give Blake credit then but now that they are playing bad, it isn't his fault: it is DL's again. Brilliant.
We are all Kings fans and I respect the somewhat blind devotion some have, but the hot start should of been met with nothing but very cautious optimism. To then pretty much dismiss the November home stand of crap because they went on a win streak afterwards is just ignoring how bad this team is when 11/32/8 and a bit of 23 aren't playing at a level they've ever sustained for a full season.
Full credit to them for what they managed to do without Carter for a good stretch there, but this is still the same team that does not have the depth to overcome long-term injuries to pretty much anyone in the Top Six, 8/6/27 and Quick.
Thank goodness for Kempe as it isn't as bad as losing Carter would have been last season, but the lack of impact prospects is really magnified right now. That can be pinned on DL but it isn't even about trading away 1st rounders, its about also not making good choices with the picks they did retain. This is why I was banging the drum after the draft about Vilardi needing to be able to jump in next season and be an instant contributor: this team desperately needs good production from guys on ELCs.
Even with the holes on this roster, I think they would be in a good spot if Carter was healthy all year. That's the problem though: this team is not built to withstand long absences from its best players. Most teams aren't, but that's why most teams aren't really contenders.
Give Blake credit then but now that they are playing bad, it isn't his fault: it is DL's again. Brilliant.
We are all Kings fans and I respect the somewhat blind devotion some have, but the hot start should of been met with nothing but very cautious optimism. To then pretty much dismiss the November home stand of crap because they went on a win streak afterwards is just ignoring how bad this team is when 11/32/8 and a bit of 23 aren't playing at a level they've ever sustained for a full season.
Full credit to them for what they managed to do without Carter for a good stretch there, but this is still the same team that does not have the depth to overcome long-term injuries to pretty much anyone in the Top Six, 8/6/27 and Quick.
Thank goodness for Kempe as it isn't as bad as losing Carter would have been last season, but the lack of impact prospects is really magnified right now. That can be pinned on DL but it isn't even about trading away 1st rounders, its about also not making good choices with the picks they did retain. This is why I was banging the drum after the draft about Vilardi needing to be able to jump in next season and be an instant contributor: this team desperately needs good production from guys on ELCs.
Even with the holes on this roster, I think they would be in a good spot if Carter was healthy all year. That's the problem though: this team is not built to withstand long absences from its best players. Most teams aren't, but that's why most teams aren't really contenders.
Ziggy Stardust
Master Debater
It took 11 years for the Kings to draft a rookie who could rack up 14 goals...
I guess we shouldn't be surprised given how often we talk about the need for this team to find offense from within. A talking point that has been ongoing for years.
KingsFan7824
Registered User
- Dec 4, 2003
- 19,537
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24-16-5 on the season.
1-4-2 at home against the division.
5-0-1 with Carter.
19-16-4 without Carter.
18-12-3 without Carter in games not at home against the division.
People are saying this is the team they all thought they were. Really? People would've expected that good of a record without Carter?
If this team wasn't somehow worse at home against the division than they were last year, they would be fine. They would probably be around 5 or 6 points up on 3rd place in the Pac.
People thought Kopitar, Toffoli, Brown, Gaborik, Kempe, and Lewis would be scoring at 20+, 25+, sometimes 30+ goal paces over 82 games? All that without Carter?
This is not the team most people were thinking they were going to be. If anyone can explain the discrepancy between the 1-4-2 record, and the 18-12-3 record, I'm all ears.
24-16-5 is 96.58 points in 82 games.
18-12-3 is 96.91 points in 82 games.
96.91 points per game multiplied by 7 is 8.27 points. If they had played at that same level in the 7 home division games, they should have 4 more points right now. That's 57 points, and 2nd in the division, with the teams behind them possibly with 1 or 2 fewer points each.
If's and but's are candy and nuts, you can throw numbers around to say whatever you want, and you are what your record says you are. If you take out the hot start, then you can take out this 5 game losing streak. If you do that, they're 19-11-4, which would be 101 points over 82 games. That's not really the team people thought they were going to be. That's 2 points away from home ice in the 1st round last year, and 4 points from the division.
1-4-2 at home against the division.
5-0-1 with Carter.
19-16-4 without Carter.
18-12-3 without Carter in games not at home against the division.
People are saying this is the team they all thought they were. Really? People would've expected that good of a record without Carter?
If this team wasn't somehow worse at home against the division than they were last year, they would be fine. They would probably be around 5 or 6 points up on 3rd place in the Pac.
People thought Kopitar, Toffoli, Brown, Gaborik, Kempe, and Lewis would be scoring at 20+, 25+, sometimes 30+ goal paces over 82 games? All that without Carter?
This is not the team most people were thinking they were going to be. If anyone can explain the discrepancy between the 1-4-2 record, and the 18-12-3 record, I'm all ears.
24-16-5 is 96.58 points in 82 games.
18-12-3 is 96.91 points in 82 games.
96.91 points per game multiplied by 7 is 8.27 points. If they had played at that same level in the 7 home division games, they should have 4 more points right now. That's 57 points, and 2nd in the division, with the teams behind them possibly with 1 or 2 fewer points each.
If's and but's are candy and nuts, you can throw numbers around to say whatever you want, and you are what your record says you are. If you take out the hot start, then you can take out this 5 game losing streak. If you do that, they're 19-11-4, which would be 101 points over 82 games. That's not really the team people thought they were going to be. That's 2 points away from home ice in the 1st round last year, and 4 points from the division.
KingsFan7824
Registered User
- Dec 4, 2003
- 19,537
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How many teams have the depth to overcome long term injuries to someone in the top 6, their top 3 defenseman, or their #1 goalie? Of course Vegas does, but they're in that rarified league of all time great teams. Which mortal team has that depth?
fsanford
Registered User
- Jul 4, 2009
- 7,833
- 3,215
Old saying you cannot make Chicken Salad out of Chicken $hit.
Iafallo has huge upside.
If they could pawn of Clifford, would be good.
Actually Blake did a good job with the Pearson and Toffoli deals, he did not give away the farm based on a couple of good years
Even if it does go south the rest of this year, gonna give Blake a little more time on the job before I start questioning him.
Will see how the coaching thing goes. Maybe there is another Florida situation out there where they fire a tremendous coach and he is there for the taking
.
fsanford
Registered User
- Jul 4, 2009
- 7,833
- 3,215
Well, to be fair Kings shipped lots of young players /picks out to make cup runs, so kind of hard when you diminish your rookie talent pool to have a prolific rookie. It paid off, so this one does not bother me too much
BigKing
Blake Out of Hell III: Back in to Hell
I don't mean all at once. Contenders can get through one or two at the same time, the Kings have proven they can't since losing Martinez in 2016, Quick last year and now Carter. The jury is still out on the latter and I said it would have been much worse last year to lose Carter since Kempe has done an admirable job, but it is starting to look like exactly what I'm describing.
BigKing
Blake Out of Hell III: Back in to Hell
My entire point about Blake has been you can't really grade him yet but he was getting fellated at the start of the season. Now it is back to "chicken shit" to work with when it was that "chicken shit" being the reason they were in 1st place.
Also, Iafallo is Trevor Lewis. I say that as a compliment as Lewis is a valuable hockey player. Great job by the scouting department to be all over this guy and by Blake closing the deal once he came in there at the end. I just don't understand what "huge upside" means because it sounds like hyperbole when applied to Iafallo. However, I'll take a Trevor Lewis on my team with no assets given up and on a cheap contract all day long.
Raccoon Jesus
We were right there
As another positive, Folin's been good for his role as well. He has his moments, but I've really liked his play overall.
KingsHockey24
Registered User
- Aug 1, 2013
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Raccoon Jesus
We were right there
Tampa has been 500 in their last 10 games as well. They've lost Hedman, Stamkos and Kucherov cooled off a bit, and Vas has been Quick for the last few games. They've been outscored 9-2 in their last 2, are 3-4 in January with losses to Ottawa and Montreal, and have been outscored 17-6 in those 4 losses. Their wins are against Detroit, Carolina, and Toronto (who is in a mega slump of their own).
Are we burying TBL as well? After all, they had a similar season to us last year, major injuries kept them out of the playoffs...
onlyalad
There’s a second round? Who knew?
- Jan 13, 2008
- 7,241
- 1,089
Got to love the main board discussion: Brown deserved the cup check because everyone knew he was going to board someone.
Brown’s play was stupid and he deserves a game or two ( or three) he looks like he tried to pull back and that may save him a game.
Gino does the cup check so often that some fans think that it is a normal part of the game.
tny760
Registered User
- Mar 12, 2017
- 20,782
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tny760
Registered User
- Mar 12, 2017
- 20,782
- 22,654
BigKing
Blake Out of Hell III: Back in to Hell
Are we .500 in our last 10? TBL is 5-4-1 in their last ten games.
They also have 65 points so far. Should we be burying them?
As far as "burying" goes, I'm not tossing dirt on this team's faces yet, but it is getting pretty worrisome that they won't actually be able to hold the fort until Carter gets back.
tny760
Registered User
- Mar 12, 2017
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it's not even the all-star break man
plenty of time for things to change and they're still very much so in the race
Raccoon Jesus
We were right there
I'm only pointing out that injuries are a major factor as that 'depth' concern affects even the elite/contender teams that everyone points to. You said "contenders can get through one or two at a time," but I don't think anyone would argue TBL is a contender, yet their injuries kept them out of the playoffs and are affecting them now as well. What we're going through is not unusual and isn't necessarily a sign of a flawed team. Remember that they roared out to 65 points by being the healthiest team in the NHL by far, like the Capitals a year or two back.
BigKing
Blake Out of Hell III: Back in to Hell
Ziggy Stardust
Master Debater
FYI, the Kings are currently sitting at 9th in the division, tied with the 8th place Avalanche with 53-points. They are also tied with the 10th place Minnesota Wild.
The 11th place Ducks could draw even with the Kings with a win tonight, and the 12th place Blackhawks remain three points behind.
All teams chasing the Kings and ones the Kings are chasing have winning records over their last 10 games. Save for the Kings, of course.
The 11th place Ducks could draw even with the Kings with a win tonight, and the 12th place Blackhawks remain three points behind.
All teams chasing the Kings and ones the Kings are chasing have winning records over their last 10 games. Save for the Kings, of course.
tny760
Registered User
- Mar 12, 2017
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and 2 points out of 2nd place in the pacific, which is what matters at this point
Raccoon Jesus
We were right there
They're not--and they haven't.
I don't disagree with you, but I think many folks here lack some perspective.
BigKing
Blake Out of Hell III: Back in to Hell
How about Anaheim then? More injuries and only two points behind LA now.
This team blew the division and got stomped out of the playoffs due in large part to losing Alec Martinez in 2016. I like Martinez, but we aren't talking Hedman here. No Muzzin the last three games really put the spotlight on how weak the D corp is after 8/6/27.
I do have perspective. This team isn't deep and is extremely top heavy. You wouldn't argue that. There are deeper teams and teams better equipped to handle absences to top players than the Kings. From what we've seen from the Kings since losing Voynov in 2015, they have not been able to overcome key injuries every season since. There is most likely no cavalry coming from Ontario like years past out of Manchester and they aren't really in a position to move picks/prospects for an impact guy.
They've handled the Carter absence well so far, full marks for that. They've still got to tread water for probably another six weeks without 77 and it appears there legs are getting pretty tired.
tsanuri
Registered User
The only team that has truly succeeded through injuries is the one nobody would have thought, Vegas. Tampa without there number 1 D is. 500 and it's still early in that time. Anaheim was barely treading water with their injuries, but since they've gotten healthy they've gone on a run.
This team has just picked one of the worst times to go cold. Which everyone should have seen we'd have some cold times. We have a very good leadership group but we also have quite a few kids. What we've had 6-7 players score their first goal this year? But Vegas is just playing so far above what anyone could have predicted. Anaheim is in a winning streak. Calgary is on a 7 game winning streak. Colorado is on an 8 game streak. All while we go on a 5 game skid.
Last night the team looked better but still lost. We'll start winning again and those other teams will start losing again. That is except for Vegas or so it seems.
But this team in the end is exactly where most of us figured they would be fighting for a playoff spot. Where the division seems out of reach we're just 1 point out of second.
Raccoon Jesus
We were right there
No, ultimately I'm agreeing with you, I was just adding color to your statement about teams being able to weather injuries. I don't think all teams are created equal in that regard. Vegas can lose players without skipping a beat. TB is top-heavier than people are giving them credit for, similar to us, and are--and have been--feeling the burn. I'm not going to make the statement "we are not a contender" based on how we perform with a guy who is a 1C out, and I know you're not either. like you say, it's a bigger picture thing. This losing streak helps emphasize problems with the roster, but those problems were there on the winning streak too--we aren't suddenly terrible is all.
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