Game 7 SCF - Would you rather have Peak Crosby or Current McDavid?

[StoveTopStauffer]

Peak McDavid is a better player. Crosby is great but his generational talent and ability is a tier below. He's in the discount gen talent club with like Jagr etc.

 

[ViD]

Don’t forget Malkin has been a much bigger impact player than Draisaitl

 

[GMR]

The guy that doesn’t have concussion problems.

 

[MetalheadPenguinsFan]

Sid easily

 

[TheGuiminator]

Out of curiosity, I looked up Crosby's performance in game 7's. Let me know if I missed any, but I think he's played in seven:

1. 2009 vs Washington - huge game. Best player on either team. Scored two goals and a primary assist. Led his team in defensive zone starts (both 5v5 and overall).
2. 2009 vs Detroit (SCF) - Crosby actually missed half the game due to injury (and was held scoreless in just under 10 minutes of ice time). Pittsburgh won thanks to Max Talbot's two goals.
3. 2010 vs Montreal - bad game. Crosby was held scoreless. He also took a dumb penalty ten seconds into the game, on which the Habs scored. They never relinquished the lead.
4. 2014 vs Rangers - held scoreless for the third game 7 in a row. He played well, but Lundqvist had one of the best games of his career.
5. 2016 vs Tampa Bay - scoreless for the 4th game 7 in a row. Similar comment as 2014 - he played well (generated a ton of shots, and the corsi-type data shows that the Pens dominated possession when he was on the ice). Bryan Rust scored both of Pittsburgh's goals.
6. 2017 vs Washington - secondary assist on the game winning goal. Ironically I don't think he played any better than in 2014 or 2016, just that he had (somewhat) better luck.
7. 2017 vs Ottawa - primary assist on the OT winner. Played almost 27 minutes and (once again) looks great according to the corsi-type data.

Crosby's game 7 record is a mixed bag. In terms of the team's record, Pittsburgh went 5-2. He had one incredible game (2009). He had a couple of other games where he was held to one point, but those were on the series-winning goals. He had a couple of games where he played well, but was held scoreless. He had two "bad" games - 2010 where his dumb penalty gave the Habs a very early lead, and then 2009 vs Detroit when he was injured. Overall I'd say Crosby's output in game 7's is solid, but underwhelming for someone who's in contention for #5 all-time.

Also worth mentionning, since the Golden Gold, there's a running myth about Crosby that he's a big clutch player. He's always very popular among journalists or even NHL players in the "who would you pick in a must win game" debate.

However, his track record when facing elimination is :

10W - 12L

4G, 13a, 17 pts, -8
(0,77 ppg or 63 pts pace)

The only time Crosby really took over a game in the playoffs when stakes were high was in game 7 of the second round against Washington in 2009

 

[IceManCat]

FOUR SCF finals isn’t enough of a sample size? Get out of here LOL. And as far as age goes, literally only peak/prime years (20-29).

There’s no excuses, Crosby has been very subpar (for his calibre of player) in cup finals.

How many cups does McDavid have vs Crosby "at the same age" LOLOL

 

[Ignatius]

Holy Recency Bias, Batman! A whole lot of people either have forgotten 2017 or perhaps they were not old enough to watch those playoffs but somehow figured out how to write comments on the internet in 2024.

 

[Letsdothis]

Holy Recency Bias, Batman! A whole lot of people either have forgotten 2017 or perhaps they were not old enough to watch those playoffs but somehow figured out how to write comments on the internet in 2024.

2017 playoffs: Crosby 24 gp 8+19 = 27 +4
2024 playoffs: McDavid 24gp 8+34 = 42 +12

People are old enough to remember... Crosby never dominated playoffs quite like McDavid has in the last few years.

 

[mr figgles]

Crosby and his 4 goals in 25 finals games was butt in the finals. Give me Mcdavid.

 

[Xspyrit]

Damn, a lot of people will struggle to cope with this poll

 

[nbwingsfan]

How many cups does McDavid have vs Crosby "at the same age" LOLOL

Crosby played on better teams yea. How is that relevant

 

[Letsdothis]

How many cups does McDavid have vs Crosby "at the same age" LOLOL

Crosby had 1. McDavid 0 or 1 depending on the result in monday.

 

[Regal]

FOUR SCF finals isn’t enough of a sample size? Get out of here LOL. And as far as age goes, literally only peak/prime years (20-29).

There’s no excuses, Crosby has been very subpar (for his calibre of player) in cup finals.

I mean it’s a big enough sample size to say he should be criticized for it, it’s not a big enough sample size where we can say it’s a unlikely he wouldn’t regress to his mean over more games.

 

[Gurglesons]

I'd probably take Sid because I'm biased and think he's more of a "winner", but it's pretty much a toss up.

 

[Skolman]

Crosby won three cups and 2 CS trophies.

But unfortunately he's never been as good as 97 in the playoffs

 

[Hockeyholic]

But unfortunately he's never been as good as 97 in the playoffs

09 he was pretty great

He won two CS trophies too

 

[jigglysquishy]

09 he was pretty great

He won two CS trophies too

He was great in 2009?

3 points in 7 games -3

He missed half of game 7 too

Malkin had 8 points in 7 games

 

[nowhereman]

Truth is, Crosby was not he best player on the team in any of his three cup wins.

Yeah, that's bullshit.

 

[Video Nasty]

09 he was pretty great

He won two CS trophies too

Yet never has been as good as McDavid.

 

[Ignatius]

2017 playoffs: Crosby 24 gp 8+19 = 27 +4
2024 playoffs: McDavid 24gp 8+34 = 42 +12

People are old enough to remember... Crosby never dominated playoffs quite like McDavid has in the last few years.

Your Statwatching skills are truly Elite, again, I prefer game watching. I'm taking absolutely nothing away from McDavid but where are the Cups that he has led his team to if he is so great? Check that stat.

Crosby's shooting percentage was insane in 2017, especially in the Washington series. I cannot conceive of how the Penguins win the cup that year without Crosby playing at the level he did throughout those playoffs in all aspects of the game. Crosby is somewhat like a McDavid- Barkov hybrid in that sense

 

[Letsdothis]

Your Statwatching skills are truly Elite, again, I prefer game watching. I'm taking absolutely nothing away from McDavid but where are the Cups that he has led his team to if he is so great? Check that stat.

You tell not to stat watch and then cite Cups - surely a stat that's less reflective of individual performance than any other conceivable stat.

 

[Ignatius]

You tell not to stat watch and then cite Cups - surely a stat that's less reflective of individual performance than any other conceivable stat.

Nope, if McDavid wins the cup on Monday night I think most people are going to think that he was unequivocally the number one reason why Edmonton won just like Crosby was a key contributor for all three of his cups. Same with Wayne, Mario, Messier, Kane, Lidstrom, etc.

Here is this threads argument, more points = better game 7 player. Crosby has actually hoisted the cup after a game 7 victory in a Stanley Cup final not to mention his Golden goal or other big game heroics like in game 7 of the Washington series during the 2009 playoffs. Mcdavid's track record just doesn't have that much to offer, he just hasn't been in as many big games and big moments. Crosby is a proven commodity, McDavid is just the it girl of the moment. Connor McDavid could end up being the Caitlin Clark of hockey.

 

[CascadiaPenguin]

FOUR SCF finals isn’t enough of a sample size? Get out of here LOL. And as far as age goes, literally only peak/prime years (20-29).

There’s no excuses, Crosby has been very subpar (for his calibre of player) in cup finals.

Watch the handshake line in 2009. When Babs shook Sid's hand at the end the Wings line he said "great leadership" while looking straight at him. That, from one of the worst losers and most miserable humans in hockey after losing one of the greatest final games in NHL history. You guys are comical. Very "subpar"? Yeah. Right.

 

[CascadiaPenguin]

You tell not to stat watch and then cite Cups - surely a stat that's less reflective of individual performance than any other conceivable stat.

Here's a reflective stat for you- no one in this history of hockey has "dominated the playoffs" (your words, not mine) without having his name on the cup. Any argument otherwise is just silly and/or completely disconnected with the concept of team sports.

McDavid (a player I admire tremendously, playing for a team I hope wins this thing) put up his first four point night in these finals in last Saturday's 8-1 shelling. All of these points came after EDM was already winning 3-1. Does that make Connor's performance somehow weaker? Probably not. Were these points relevant as to the outcome of the game? Of course not.

 

[Video Nasty]

Crosby has actually hoisted the cup after a game 7 victory in a Stanley Cup final

The guy didn’t play half of that very game. Big whoop on this being a point of your argument.

The rest of it is atrocious. It girl of the moment has 5 Art Rosses, 4 Lindsays, 3 Harts, a boatload of other individual accomplishments, and could have picked up a Cup and a Conn Smythe in less than 24 hours. Seems like more than that to me.