CXLVIII - Coyotes owner Alex Meruelo had 'productive' meeting with Phoenix mayor

[Llama19]

Scottsdale mayor to Coyotes owner on arena plan: “Not feasible, or welcome”...

To quote:

"For now, Meruelo needs to focus on winning a public auction for the land he wants — currently set for June 27 — and then getting both Phoenix and Maricopa County to sign off on the creation of what Arizona calls a “theme park district” within which a tax surcharge would be levied on sales or business income and then kicked back to pay off construction bonds. This isn’t a TIF, because it’d be a new tax on top of the development paying normal taxes to the city and county, but it’s also not quite like a tax just on tickets where the money mostly comes out of a team owner’s pockets because economics; I’m currently engaged in a lengthy email exchange with a couple of economists about how exactly to figure out what should count as the public cost, but since we don’t know the projected total amount of the tax surcharge it’s a bit premature anyway."

Source: www.fieldofschemes.com/2024/04/09/21272/scottsdale-mayor-to-coyotes-owner-on-arena-plan-not-feasible-or-welcome/

 

[awfulwaffle]

Scottsdale mayor to Coyotes owner on arena plan: “Not feasible, or welcome”...

To quote:

"For now, Meruelo needs to focus on winning a public auction for the land he wants — currently set for June 27 — and then getting both Phoenix and Maricopa County to sign off on the creation of what Arizona calls a “theme park district” within which a tax surcharge would be levied on sales or business income and then kicked back to pay off construction bonds. This isn’t a TIF, because it’d be a new tax on top of the development paying normal taxes to the city and county, but it’s also not quite like a tax just on tickets where the money mostly comes out of a team owner’s pockets because economics; I’m currently engaged in a lengthy email exchange with a couple of economists about how exactly to figure out what should count as the public cost, but since we don’t know the projected total amount of the tax surcharge it’s a bit premature anyway."

Source: www.fieldofschemes.com/2024/04/09/21272/scottsdale-mayor-to-coyotes-owner-on-arena-plan-not-feasible-or-welcome/

Your source is basically a gossip column?

 

[aqib]

The letter is public. Only thing this proves is he’s got no more access than any other Joe Shmo. Only difference is he’s got a platform to bark from.

I'm sure but it hadn't been posted yet and this was thing I saw with the whole letter. Again I made no comment on it, just posting the info.

 

[Stumbledore]

Imagine having a 16M cashier's check...

I've handled a few of them.

The longer you hold them, the heavier they begin to feel.

 

[Llama19]

I posted it just because he reads the entire letter and the other posts only have segments. He is actually very Pro-Arizona but again the point was just having the entire letter from the Scottsdale mayor

Here is an article that has the entire statement letter: 'Not feasible or welcome:' Scottsdale mayor against proposed Coyotes development

To quote part:

"As Scottsdale councilman in 2000 and now as mayor, I have seen the inside dealings when the Coyotes suddenly left Scottsdale in 2002, and recently as they vacated their former home ice in Glendale in 2022. The team is struggling at Arizona State University Mullet Arena, at less than 90% capacity. And coincidentally, there is a new measure at the 2024 Arizona Legislature which would permit surcharges, an on-site sales tax to boost viability for an arena such as the Coyotes organization now proposes."

Source: www.abc15.com/sports/not-feasible-or-welcome-scottsdale-mayor-against-proposed-coyotes-development

 

[aqib]

Your source is basically a gossip column?

Field of Schemes is useful as an aggregator of links/news. Its own content (commentary and analysis) sucks.

 

[awfulwaffle]

Field of Schemes is useful as an aggregator of links/news. Its own content (commentary and analysis) sucks.

Which is exactly what the quote is.

 

[JimAnchower]

Source: www.abc15.com/sports/not-feasible-or-welcome-scottsdale-mayor-against-proposed-coyotes-development

I admire the hockey sport

As they say in hockey, let's do that hockey.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

Been busy this morning and trying to wade though everything but I know I mentioned this elsewhere.

The water, sewer, etc….. is coming from Phoenix.

They went to great pains to make sure that the infrastructure originated from Phoenix.

Now you’re beginning to understand why.

As long as Meruelo keeps his P’s and Q’s straight with Phoenix, the mayor of Scottsdale can go full on Karen all he wants. Phoenix can stand on the west side of Scottsdale Road, look at him with a wry smile and tell him his city had it’s chance in 1999 to solve this whole thing and keep the revenue it would have generated, but chickened out.”

This looks accurate, except it appears he can delay the process, as Scottsdale and ADOT need to approve any changes at Scottsdale road.

 

[MeHateHe]

Here is an article that has the entire statement letter: 'Not feasible or welcome:' Scottsdale mayor against proposed Coyotes development

To quote part:

"As Scottsdale councilman in 2000 and now as mayor, I have seen the inside dealings when the Coyotes suddenly left Scottsdale in 2002, and recently as they vacated their former home ice in Glendale in 2022. The team is struggling at Arizona State University Mullet Arena, at less than 90% capacity. And coincidentally, there is a new measure at the 2024 Arizona Legislature which would permit surcharges, an on-site sales tax to boost viability for an arena such as the Coyotes organization now proposes."

Source: www.abc15.com/sports/not-feasible-or-welcome-scottsdale-mayor-against-proposed-coyotes-development

The ability (or not) of the Scottsdale mayor to impact the club's ability to get this thing done isn't the most interesting part of this letter. His personal motivations (does he have friends/donors who want the land or whose businesses might be impacted by the development?) is a little more interesting.

The key part of this is that a politician is choosing to pick a fight with the club, and that underscores one of the points I've said all along: they've got a brand image problem.

If you announce a project like this, you're going to get a range of reaction. If a professional jai alai team was setting up shop here, I'd react with supreme indifference, because it's not my thing and it doesn't impact my life at all. I would think this is the ideal level of negative reaction you'd want when announcing a move like this. It should range from "meh" to "hooray!!!!"

But for a politician to focus this much attention on a project must mean he thinks/believes/knows that a considerable portion of his constituency are going to hatehatehate it. Successful politicians know that leading means finding a parade and jumping in front of it. Sure, some folks in Scottsdale are going to be upset that the mayor doesn't like the club. But this statement means he thinks enough people are going to agree with him that he's taking this stand.

It doesn't mean that everyone hates the club. It doesn't even mean that the majority hates the club. But it would seem to me that even having a significant minority with a level of animus toward the club means you have a problem.

Sure sure, maybe the mayor is misreading public sentiment and maybe he's just grinding his own ax. But this revelation would portend of a brand challenge the club is going to need to face up to at some point.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

Brodie Brazil who is an Oakland area media guy did a video on Youtube where he read the Scottsdale mayor's entire letter. Now before people say how he doesn't know anything since he isn't from the Valley, he has been reporting on sports venue/relocation stories for a while because of the A's and he is pro-Coyotes staying.

Yeah, he does alright for a guy that doesn’t really know the area and refuses to do any research.

 

[aqib]

Which is exactly what the quote is.

That quote is mostly a factual statement. If you go on the site and read the whole post it's about 85% reporting facts and 15% opinion.

Yeah, he does alright for a guy that doesn’t really know the area and refuses to do any research.

Again I posted it because it was the first link I saw that had the whole letter from the Scottsdale mayor

 

[GindyDraws]

Field of Schemes is useful as an aggregator of links/news. Its own content (commentary and analysis) sucks.

It's because the site is from a person who historically is anti stadium development and even wrote a book on the subject while this forum is PRO stadium development.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

This is all so transparent, it’s laughable. The mayor of Scottsdale would obviously prefer a non revenue generating development next to his city. Housing developments, corporate HQ’s etc. would frequent Scottsdale establishments.
Phoenix will generate income from sales tax in the ED, certainly more than any loss at Footprint and they will be peeling away from Scottsdale establishments.
IDK why y’all love to complicate the simple, but again, it’s laughable.

This is all so transparent, it’s laughable. The mayor of Scottsdale would obviously prefer a non revenue generating development next to his city. Housing developments, corporate HQ’s etc. would frequent Scottsdale establishments.
Phoenix will generate income from sales tax in the ED, certainly more than any loss at Footprint and they will be peeling away from Scottsdale establishments.
IDK why y’all love to complicate the simple, but again, it’s laughable.

 

[aqib]

It's because the site is from a person who historically is anti stadium development and even wrote a book on the subject while this forum is PRO stadium development.

Absolutely. Its still a good aggregator for new of all the stadium development projects going on. Like some racists in the UK had a "Boycott Halal" app which listed all the Halal (muslim equivalent of kosher) restaurants so fellow racists could boycott. It turned out the only people who downloaded it were Muslims so they knew where to eat.

 

[TheLegend]

Here is an article that has the entire statement letter: 'Not feasible or welcome:' Scottsdale mayor against proposed Coyotes development

To quote part:

"As Scottsdale councilman in 2000 and now as mayor, I have seen the inside dealings when the Coyotes suddenly left Scottsdale in 2002, and recently as they vacated their former home ice in Glendale in 2022. The team is struggling at Arizona State University Mullet Arena, at less than 90% capacity. And coincidentally, there is a new measure at the 2024 Arizona Legislature which would permit surcharges, an on-site sales tax to boost viability for an arena such as the Coyotes organization now proposes."

Source: www.abc15.com/sports/not-feasible-or-welcome-scottsdale-mayor-against-proposed-coyotes-development

To quote the more important part....

In March, Arizona State Land Department officials met in my office, and I pointed out that all Scottsdale Road improvements from the 101 north are entirely in our city. There is zero infrastructure west of Scottsdale Road. I demanded that infrastructure for the proposed site, including water and sewer, be pulled from Phoenix assets along 56th Street to the west. Scottsdale Water assets are absolutely not available.

Furthermore, I have demanded that the 64th Street - AZ Loop 101 north exit be built out to serve the area, again to the west of Scottsdale Road. At our meeting, the Arizona State Land Department agreed that these requirements will be bundled with any successful bid for the property. I also met with the mayor of Phoenix who confirmed that all utilities must be extended from 56th Street.

The end result being the State Land Department and Coyotes when with sourcing everything through Phoenix. Cutting Scottsdale out of the equation.

56th Street is not part of Scottsdale, but here is Mayor Ortega “demanding” infrastructure be added to it.

Mayor Ortega also wants the project moved farther west. Meaning not next to his city so that it can suck business away from his city.

Mayor Ortega also omitted in his historical references where two separate public votes of Scottsdale residents came out in favor of Steve Ellman’s original plan to build there rather than going off to Glendale.

 

[awfulwaffle]

That quote is mostly a factual statement. If you go on the site and read the whole post it's about 85% reporting facts and 15% opinion.

The key part that was quoted by llama is the interpretation that the Coyotes are going to utilize a yet to be approved taxing system. Give me a break.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

To quote the more important part....



The end result being the State Land Department and Coyotes when with sourcing everything through Phoenix. Cutting Scottsdale out of the equation.

56th Street is not part of Scottsdale, but here is Mayor Ortega “demanding” infrastructure be added to it.

Mayor Ortega also wants the project moved farther west. Meaning not next to his city so that it can suck business away from his city.

Mayor Ortega also omitted in his historical references where two separate public votes of Scottsdale residents came out in favor of Steve Ellman’s original plan to build there rather than going off to Glendale.

The 56th st. thing had me wondering as well. I could only determine that he thought it would (and it may) mitigate some traffic concerns around Scottsdale rd.

The key part that was quoted by llama is the interpretation that the Coyotes are going to utilize a yet to be approved taxing system. Give me a break.

A regular Nostradumbass, but seriously even I, (coiner of the Asshat's) don't believe they'd be stupid enough to go into this knowing they need that legislation.

 

[TheLegend]

The 56th st. thing had me wondering as well. I could only determine that he thought it would (and it may) mitigate some traffic concerns around Scottsdale rd.


A regular Nostradumbass, but seriously even I (coiner of the Asshat's) don't believe they'd be stupid enough to go into this knowing they need that legislation.

XG has said they would be pushing forward with or without that legislation.

While Ken Kendrick decided not to utilize that law (that was originally passed for HIM) you can’t fault any other AZ sports team from at least looking at utilizing it.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

XG has said they would be pushing forward with or without that legislation.

While Ken Kendrick decided not to utilize that law (that was originally passed for HIM) you can’t fault any other AZ sports team from at least looking at utilizing it.

Yotes can't use it as currently written and I'm not liking the "look" of a former employee pushing for the change that would allow it's use, even if he is currently with another sports franchise.

 

[awfulwaffle]

XG has said they would be pushing forward with or without that legislation.

While Ken Kendrick decided not to utilize that law (that was originally passed for HIM) you can’t fault any other AZ sports team from at least looking at utilizing it.

I mean, realistically, any developer is going to be looking to utilize every possible avenue they have to save money/tax breaks etc. Like was pointed out in so many other threads when Tempe was going through the vote, there are plenty of other developments on the lake that had tax breaks and incentives. Every city does it, every state does it, every developer does it.

 

[PCSPounder]

Wecome to Arizona.

You act like that’s only Arizona. Sheesh!

 

[TheLegend]

The key part that was quoted by llama is the interpretation that the Coyotes are going to utilize a yet to be approved taxing system. Give me a break.

It was interpreted that way because a former Coyotes executive who left the team last December is now working on behalf of the Arizona Rising pro soccer team. And they’re working with a lobbyist who the Coyotes previously hired for work on TED.

 

[TheLegend]

You act like that’s only Arizona. Sheesh!

There are similarities elsewhere. But there’s a special kind of craziness in AZ. Our state Supreme Court today decided an 1864 territorial law was perfectly fine.

 

[Stumbledore]

You act like that’s only Arizona. Sheesh!

I really admire your avatar. The Hawks are crazy not to grab this and adapt it.