Coronavirus (COVID-19) Discussion Part IX- Now Featuring More Lockdowns

[SeaOfBlue]

Not denying that COVID is more contagious, but you can’t say people aren’t doing their part when the flu has been almost completely eradicated. That’s a remarkable achievement, but not enough for many of these authoritarians.

Government loves to point fingers and shame small businesses and fellow citizens, and many miraculously get on board with that despite them botching their response form day one. You see those people in the FaceBook comments clamouring for more lockdowns. Clown world.

The flu is still pretty relevant every year. It actually kills quite a few people (mostly older people) every year too. It's why long term care homes have been an issue for a long time, and it's not like Covid have been causing those issues. Covid have just made those issues more relevant in media, and have augmented the existing issues.

 

[Kiwi]

What a shitshow. Going on for years too it seems. I'd gladly skimp elsewhere in order to fund life-saving procedures/meds.

It doesn't really work that way, most people are for cost cutting as a general principal but they tend to get a little squiffy when it gets specific

If the government is going to run the healthcare system they have to cut off spending somewhere, that means certain treatments just won't get funded

We get this issue every couple of year's in New Zealand since we're pretty cost conscious

 

[Muston Atthews]

Maybe airports should be shut?

This is never going to end

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

It doesn't really work that way, most people are for cost cutting as a general principal but they tend to get a little squiffy when it gets specific

If the government is going to run the healthcare system they have to cut off spending somewhere, that means certain treatments just won't get funded

We get this issue every couple of year's in New Zealand since we're pretty cost conscious

But how can you ever be cost conscious again after spending $381 billion dollars like we just did in Canada? Apparently, money is no issue now. So when little Suzy needs a treatment that costs $150k, are you going to be the health minister that denies it when you just spent quite literally 10s of millions helping aunt Esther reach her mid 90s?

That's the problem with what we've done and it's a bigger problem moving forward. Basically, our governments lost their mind over Covid and nothing will ever be the same.

 

[Mickey Marner]

It doesn't really work that way, most people are for cost cutting as a general principal but they tend to get a little squiffy when it gets specific

If the government is going to run the healthcare system they have to cut off spending somewhere, that means certain treatments just won't get funded

We get this issue every couple of year's in New Zealand since we're pretty cost conscious

I understand, but in several of those articles for example, it came down to a $100,000 cap on insurance for cancer drugs. Surely they have price indexes and are able to explain to patients what treatments will cost and which their ohip budget can afford. People should know up front that ohip will cover treatments X, & Y, but not Z before the patient goes down that road, instead of effectively having the rug pulled out from under them.

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

This is never going to end

Not with our current strategy it won't. They think they can beat a virus. You can't. The hard facts are they just let people die during the Spanish and Honk Kong flu. We're in a new reality now where that will never happen (and I'm not saying it should - just explaining the reality some people won't accept). Trying to get to zero cases, which I assume is the only ending that will satisfy our modern wishy washy leaders, reminds me of the line from Star Wars: "The more you tighten your grip, Tarkin, the more star systems will slip through your fingers."

There is sage wisdom in that line. I've seen it in my own business and others. Trying to achieve perfection gets exponentially harder the closer you get. You *have* to expect a certain level of error in any venture. I.e., this virus will be with us forever or you just let it run its course. choose your path. Since I know the path our governments will choose is to live with it forever (thinking they're the first geniuses in history that can beat our most ancient foe). I say we develop strategies to live with it. I.e., protect our most vulnerable, employ reasonable measures for the rest of us and get back to living.

Do it, don't do it. meh at this point. But I guarantee the current strategy will destroy us.

 

[Mickey Marner]

But how can you ever be cost conscious again after spending $381 billion dollars like we just did in Canada? Apparently, money is no issue now. So when little Suzy needs a treatment that costs $150k, are you going to be the health minister that denies it when you just spent quite literally 10s of millions helping aunt Esther reach her mid 90s?

That's the problem with what we've done and it's a bigger problem moving forward. Basically, our governments lost their mind over Covid and nothing will ever be the same.

Our government's response moving forward is going to be based on whether something is trending on social media. The inmates are officially running the asylum.

 

[Pink Mist]

lmao we've eradicated viruses and diseases in the past, and they absolutely used measures to control the Spanish flu, they didn't "just let people die". what kind of ahistorical bullshit is that

 

[Pink Mist]

Also, province wide lockdown starting Christmas Eve

Ontario planning to implement provincewide lockdown, including school closures: sources

 

[Sens]

Also, province wide lockdown starting Christmas Eve

Ontario planning to implement provincewide lockdown, including school closures: sources

meh it’s just current grey zone rules
Small businesses just take the pipe

 

[PromisedLand]

You're fooling yourself.

Chart: Debt-to-GDP Continues to Rise Around the World

BTW, we owe our debt to ourselves. There's no one to default on. It's basically just a collapse (i.e., a confiscation). In contrast, the US with the only reserve currency in the world owes more than half of their debt to foreigners. We're in the worst possible situation imaginable if there's inflation or rising interest rates.

I'd listen to a nobel prize winning economist; but then again.... apparently calls to the voice of reason has been falling on deaf ears for majority of the thread

as you were

 

[Raymondo316]

Maybe airports should be shut?

Just like that its January/February all over again, but instead of everyone cutting off China, they're now banning all travel to and from the UK.....France have even closed the tunnel and stopped the ferries bringing in any freight.

With the virus rampaging out of control, most of the south in lockdown, likely no deal brexit and now food shortages incoming......this really is a massive mess.

 

[HolyCrap]

Read today they are looking at a province wide shutdown as early as Xmas eve. I doubt there will be any hockey in Canada now. They won’t be able to tell people you can’t see your parents for Xmas and then a have NHL hockey teams practicing for the season.

 

[Clark4Ever]

Read today they are looking at a province wide shutdown as early as Xmas eve. I doubt there will be any hockey in Canada now. They won’t be able to tell people you can’t see your parents for Xmas and then a have NHL hockey teams practicing for the season.

Yup. Another province wide lockdown is starting on Christmas Eve for at least 28 days - similar to the one we had in March. Sigh.

 

[HolyCrap]

Yup. Another province wide lockdown is starting on Christmas Eve for at least 28 days - similar to the one we had in March. Sigh.

Yup. I can’t even see my family for Xmas. They might as well move the Canadian teams South ASAP or there won’t be any Canadian hockey teams playing this year.

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

I'd listen to a nobel prize winning economist; but then again.... apparently calls to the voice of reason has been falling on deaf ears for majority of the thread

as you were

90 second video made in July when things weren't as grave, talking about the UK, not Canada, with absolutely zero information beyond saying "don't worry" over and over. Did you happen to notice in the chart I provided that Canada has borrowed twice as much as the UK this year? Do you think this actually refuted anything I posted?

As you were.

 

[PromisedLand]

90 second video made in July when things weren't as grave, talking about the UK, not Canada, with absolutely zero information beyond saying "don't worry" over and over. Did you happen to notice in the chart I provided that Canada has borrowed twice as much as the UK this year? Do you think this actually refuted anything I posted?

As you were.

You have been refuted many times. even IMF has continuously said running high budet deficit to fight the virus should be the primary objective. like i said before I'd rather listen to a nobel prize winning economist instead of ramblings of someone that has no clue what they are talking about

 

[Future]

Another province wide lockdown despite my region having a stable number of cases the past couple of weeks. Great.

Also read an article where Niagara region, a region that saw a HIGH of 50-ish cases the other day (population of half a million), is apparently “on the verge of losing the battle against COVID-19” according to the article headline.

Is anyone paying attention?

 

[Pink Mist]

You have been refuted many times. even IMF has continuously said running high budet deficit to fight the virus should be the primary objective. like i said before I'd rather listen to a nobel prize winning economist instead of ramblings of someone that has no clue what they are talking about

Since he won't believe a 90 second video, heres an article with other top economists saying the same thing

Here's why top economists are not worried about the national debt, now worth over $26 trillion

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

You have been refuted many times. even IMF has continuously said running high budet deficit to fight the virus should be the primary objective. like i said before I'd rather listen to a nobel prize winning economist instead of ramblings of someone that has no clue what they are talking about

Time for another plonk.

 

[robertmac43]

Man I'm excited for this whole thing to some day be done...

 

[Future]

Man I'm excited for this whole thing to some day be done...

Goalposts are forever changing. Don’t see this going away anytime soon. Somehow there’s still a massive amount of people that actually support lockdowns, so we will continue to let this happen.

 

[Confucius]

Since he won't believe a 90 second video, heres an article with other top economists saying the same thing

Here's why top economists are not worried about the national debt, now worth over $26 trillion

although Nobel laureate Paul Krugman was not impressed with the current choices of government spending, he was not concerned with the spending itself. He said “even though we’ve been running budget deficits that are kind of stupid, if you were going to run budget deficits, you should be using the money to build infrastructure to help education, to work on the future. And instead, we’ve been using it to get big windfalls to corporations and rich people.”
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------End
Don't worry be happy.

 

[Pink Mist]

although Nobel laureate Paul Krugman was not impressed with the current choices of government spending, he was not concerned with the spending itself. He said “even though we’ve been running budget deficits that are kind of stupid, if you were going to run budget deficits, you should be using the money to build infrastructure to help education, to work on the future. And instead, we’ve been using it to get big windfalls to corporations and rich people.”
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------End
Don't worry be happy.

He's referring to the US. Canada's government has given a lot more stimulus to individuals and small businesses

 

[Confucius]

He's referring to the US. Canada's government has given a lot more stimulus to individuals and small businesses

Well at least you admit the people you linked to weren't even talking about Canada. How last year our deficit was 20 billion, which may not have been to big a concern. This year we added pretty close to 400 billion. Some of us find that alarming.