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Around the NHL 11 - 2023/24

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Jet said:
It's a real shame and should be a cautionary tale for the NHL when deciding what they are trying to eliminate from the game.

If you are trying to get rid of fighting (honestly, I'm cool with that), you simply HAVE to be very punitive with illegal plays, especially those that have intent to injure behind them.

If not, the league is just going to get uglier and uglier.
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I think whether fighting stays or goes they just need to be more punitive with supplemental discipline until the message is heard. Fighting isn't stopping any of it now.
 
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Jet said:
It's actually quite funny to hear some of the commentary around here surrounding womens hockey. You can tell it's a lot of dudes who's only involvement in the sport is watching or maybe beer league.

We played the MB Bisons women's team back when I was with Hot 103 and I was fully impressed. I have also been fortunate enough to play with some of Canada's Oympians and their skill and ability was tremendous.

The problem is, most people have only ever watched NHL seriously and they are measuring these women against the very elite of mens hockey players.

I've played with guys like Dale Weise who we would all call a plug around here, and when you get on a sheet of ice with him you quickly understand how good you have to be to play in the NHL. You see their skills and processing of the game and are amazed that they are tweeners or only get a cup of coffee.

Yes, women will never be as physical, fast or have as hard of a shot as men, but they can absolutely play the game of hockey at a high level.

I'm cheering for the PWHL and I hope they can survive and allow these athletes to make a good living.
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It's funny... as my son aged out and I watched my daughters play high level, I've come to appreciate and even prefer watching womens hockey.

And yes, they can play... I realized that when my daughter tracked me down from behind on a breakaway and stripped me clean of the puck in her U15 father-daughter game lol
 
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Jet said:
It's actually quite funny to hear some of the commentary around here surrounding womens hockey. You can tell it's a lot of dudes who's only involvement in the sport is watching or maybe beer league.
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Watching and spreadsheets are as far as I've gotten, but as I know from experience that if you disagreed with the accuracy of any of my claims that you'd have called it out specifically, I feel I can confidently stand by each of the claims I've made thus far on the topic.
 
AlphaLackey said:
Watching and spreadsheets are as far as I've gotten, but as I know from experience that if you disagreed with the accuracy of any of my claims that you'd have called it out specifically, I feel I can confidently stand by each of the claims I've made thus far on the topic.
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I am not sure what the claim actually is though
 
Joe Hallenback said:
I am not sure what the claim actually is though
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* Women's national teams don't soft-play high school boys' teams in exhibition matches, as they generally want to avoid losing.

* As proof of above: the hockey USWNT once booking a two-game set against two high school boys teams, but after losing the first one, requested the second be changed to a scoreless scrimmage.

* Hockey with minimal checking allowed (no hits into boards, no pinning against boards, no open ice hits once possession/space established) played at about a high-school-boys level will be a tough sell.

* The rules on body checking will become problematic to enforce once the teams get a history and a little bad blood between them.

* A standard marketing tactic for women's sports is to accuse men of misogyny if they don't support the league, but this tactic wears out quickly.

* The launch of this league has been extremely poor, both in terms of brand building and general marketing; perhaps the least in any league I've seen.

* The inability to wager on the games will hurt the ability to generate interest, or even any free-to-enter promotional contest (player points pool, survivor pool, prediction contest) to generate meta-level interest.

I will now take questions at this time :P
 
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Jet said:
It's actually quite funny to hear some of the commentary around here surrounding womens hockey. You can tell it's a lot of dudes who's only involvement in the sport is watching or maybe beer league.

We played the MB Bisons women's team back when I was with Hot 103 and I was fully impressed. I have also been fortunate enough to play with some of Canada's Oympians and their skill and ability was tremendous.

The problem is, most people have only ever watched NHL seriously and they are measuring these women against the very elite of mens hockey players.

I've played with guys like Dale Weise who we would all call a plug around here, and when you get on a sheet of ice with him you quickly understand how good you have to be to play in the NHL. You see their skills and processing of the game and are amazed that they are tweeners or only get a cup of coffee.

Yes, women will never be as physical, fast or have as hard of a shot as men, but they can absolutely play the game of hockey at a high level.

I'm cheering for the PWHL and I hope they can survive and allow these athletes to make a good living.
Click to expand...
Yup, I have a buddy who played against Quinton Howden when they were younger (around 11 or 12, my buddy is a year or two older than him) and he said Quinton absolutely smoked everyone on the ice. Granted he was a future 1st round pick, so he had talent for sure, but it’s insane what the gap is even between dudes that spend most of their career in Europe and Joe Blow.
 
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I believe the PWHL will do very well and play will only improve and players get better over time like any sport/league.

This article speaks to some of the competitive matches that the Canadian women’s National Team has played against male teams.

It’s great to see the women’s league up and running.

www.tsn.ca

Canadian women's hockey team battle-tested for Beijing by men's Junior A teams - TSN.ca

The Canadian women's hockey team was pushed out of its comfort zone in pre-Olympic preparation. The players didn't always like it.
www.tsn.ca
 
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LucianoBorsato said:
Hey they could all skate circles around me, no problem there. And I have watched and cheered for the national Women's team for years. I was more commenting that the marketing and presentation wasn't great. I'm trying to undersand why they decided to forgo team nicknames with fun logos that would actually appeal to people and maybe sell some merch, and instead opted for those generic city name jerseys.
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Oh yeah, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the PWHL launch was good at all.

Unfortunately, there was likely very limited investment in the league as it's a risky proposition, so they probably did the best they could.

My commentary was purely about the quality of women's hockey and whether they can play the game at a high level or not.
 
AlphaLackey said:
Watching and spreadsheets are as far as I've gotten, but as I know from experience that if you disagreed with the accuracy of any of my claims that you'd have called it out specifically, I feel I can confidently stand by each of the claims I've made thus far on the topic.
Click to expand...
The point I was trying to make is women play high quality hockey as well.

Measuring it against men is unfair simply due to size, strength, and the inherent differences of the game.

I wasn't specifically calling you or anyone else out in my post - I was just sharing my experience playing against women.

Of course I am just a plug but I have played against all manner of elite hockey players, and some of the top women I played with possessed some very high level skills and decision making.
 
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AlphaLackey said:
* Women's national teams don't soft-play high school boys' teams in exhibition matches, as they generally want to avoid losing.

* As proof of above: the hockey USWNT once booking a two-game set against two high school boys teams, but after losing the first one, requested the second be changed to a scoreless scrimmage.

* Hockey with minimal checking allowed (no hits into boards, no pinning against boards, no open ice hits once possession/space established) played at about a high-school-boys level will be a tough sell.

* The rules on body checking will become problematic to enforce once the teams get a history and a little bad blood between them.

* A standard marketing tactic for women's sports is to accuse men of misogyny if they don't support the league, but this tactic wears out quickly.

* The launch of this league has been extremely poor, both in terms of brand building and general marketing; perhaps the least in any league I've seen.

* The inability to wager on the games will hurt the ability to generate interest, or even any free-to-enter promotional contest (player points pool, survivor pool, prediction contest) to generate meta-level interest.

I will now take questions at this time :P
Click to expand...

And... you forgot this...

7d50bd967d29d88741dfe93703c7e01e.gif


:sarcasm:
 
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The NHL and DOPS are a joke plain and simple, when the maximum fine is 5,000 dollars for millionaire hockey players how is that going to stop anything or anyone? That's like fining us normal folk 50 cents for something, never going to do shit. Now start the fines at 100,000 dollars and maybe that will start to do something, maybe.
 
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Gm0ney said:
Maybe not a popular opinion, but I think the Jets are closer to 10 than 1. PDO's running a little hot. Special teams are crap. Let's pump the brakes a bit. Very good team, sure. #1? Whoa, Nelly...
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The Jets may not be perfect but there is a lot of bad hockey out there....we are definitely the best team in the NHL right now
 
Gm0ney said:
Maybe not a popular opinion, but I think the Jets are closer to 10 than 1. PDO's running a little hot. Special teams are crap. Let's pump the brakes a bit. Very good team, sure. #1? Whoa, Nelly...
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To be fair its likely based mostly on December where the Jets had the best record in the league at 11-1-2.
 
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jiho said:
The Jets may not be perfect but there is a lot of bad hockey out there....we are definitely the best team in the NHL right now
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jokesondee said:
To be fair its likely based mostly on December where the Jets had the best record in the league at 11-1-2.
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If it's just looking at the December W-L record then sure...but what's the point of a semi-subjective Power Ranking then? The Jets have been on even more of a heater in the last month. PDO is 1.052 getting .938 goaltending and 11.3% shooting - most of that without our best shooter? Is that sustainable? I think it's perfectly cromulent to say "yeah they're winning, but their special teams sucks, I'm not convinced".
 
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Jets 31 said:
The NHL and DOPS are a joke plain and simple, when the maximum fine is 5,000 dollars for millionaire hockey players how is that going to stop anything or anyone? That's like fining us normal folk 50 cents for something, never going to do shit. Now start the fines at 100,000 dollars and maybe that will start to do something, maybe.
Click to expand...

How about showing some guts and saying no limit on the fines. Do something horrible, well get a fine in the millions - similar to US lawsuits. :nod:
 
Gm0ney said:
Maybe not a popular opinion, but I think the Jets are closer to 10 than 1. PDO's running a little hot. Special teams are crap. Let's pump the brakes a bit. Very good team, sure. #1? Whoa, Nelly...
Click to expand...

Maybe not the best team in the league, that's debatable but saying they are closer to 10 than 1 is just silly. The Jets are third in the league in point% and goal differential.

Jets since Nov1 are 19-6-2 which is best in the league.
Jets since Dec1 are 11-1-2 which is best in the league.

Is this sustainable for the rest of the year? Probably not, but you're probably the only hockey fan in the world that would put them closer to 10 than 1 right now.
 
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Gm0ney said:
Maybe not a popular opinion, but I think the Jets are closer to 10 than 1. PDO's running a little hot. Special teams are crap. Let's pump the brakes a bit. Very good team, sure. #1? Whoa, Nelly...
Click to expand...
If the special teams were great and thats how the Jets were winning than I would say pump the brakes. Because you are depending on the refs to win you games ... cough cough Oilers.
Majority of the teams go threw dry spells on their special teams just look at Carolina when they lost to the Jets they went on losing streak mainly because of their special teams ... only 1 PP goal in 4 games and they lost all 4 games. Now their PP is hot ... 10 PP goals in their last 5 games and they only have 1 regular lost in their last 10 games.
 
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Gm0ney said:
If it's just looking at the December W-L record then sure...but what's the point of a semi-subjective Power Ranking then? The Jets have been on even more of a heater in the last month. PDO is 1.052 getting .938 goaltending and 11.3% shooting - most of that without our best shooter? Is that sustainable? I think it's perfectly cromulent to say "yeah they're winning, but their special teams sucks, I'm not convinced".
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Yeah I'm happy with the results but we saw last year what happens if our shooting goes into the shitter.

I think we definitely are in for some regression in terms of goal scoring at 5 on 5. What we need to mitigate that regression is for the coach to figure our pp out. We will need pp goals the back half of this year imo.
 
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