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Analyzing Dubas's Performance - III

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BertCorbeau said:
That's true, the return seems really bad now.

This is Colorado's second iteration of a rebuild though - keep that in mind .. Their first one fizzles out which led to the trade of Duchene but still left them with Mackinnon and Landeskog, and Rantenen.

Maybe that's a lesson for the Leafs ;)
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Colorado's big 3 make a helluva lot less than our 3,and I would rather have them too, and that left what was needed to add better depth and grit like Kadri and others.
They also cleared out some finesse, speed and skill guys like Barrie and Kerfoot for grit.

We needed dmen,grit and size and instead added more finesse no size and dealt the grit.

It seems Sakic learned his lesson and adapted while Dubas seems locked into his vision and is closer to crashing and burning.
 
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Dekes For Days said:
...Do you want me to post the numbers? Doesn't ever seem to make much difference, so I didn't bother wasting time.

1. You do realize that Matthews was on a 50 goal, 100 point pace in his 3rd season when he signed, right?
2. You do realize that contracts are negotiated off of more than where they fall on the raw single season point chart, right?

McDavid signed D+2. Matthews signed D+2.5. Age does matter, but Matthews' sample size of that level of production was also bigger.
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Sure, just post the numbers. Why not?
 
biotk said:
Don't really care about that....nor is it actually true. MacKinnon is 2 year 16 days older. However, in the next three years the chances of Toronto putting together a decent balanced team are near zero because the cap is flat and half their cap is spent on 4 players who don't deliver close to enough to justify their cap hits. For the next two years Colorado will be competing for the cup with their 1C and 2C (who have 24 points between them so far this playoffs) combined costing less than either JT or Matthews - and even the year after that MacKinnon will still be only 6.3.
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You don't care that they drafted their star C 3 drafts ahead of Matthews when considering how successful their rebuild is? Both were supposed to start the upward trajectory of their organizations
 
biotk said:
Personally, I am not romanticizing Kadri because I know the 3C role didn't suit him and I think he had to go. I am also a hockey fan first and foremost so I thrilled to see him having success. I simply think that the shoddy return Dubas received for him indicates major problems with Leafs' management. And I look at the success of the rebuild in Colorado compared to Toronto and I think....what a complete cluster f*** in comparison (this was also my view before these playoffs).
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For me, the hardest thing to swallow is how Colorado was able to turn things around. They already had star talent like MacKinnon and ROR and it went nowhere. Under Sakic they were able to find hidden gem players who are key contributors now like Graves, Nichuskin, Donskoi, Burakovsky and even good goalies. I guess you can add Kadri to the list. One of the things Dubas was supposed to be able to do was find those hidden gems, and I can't think of a single one yet
 
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people love living with revisionist history here. imagine Matthews played like this his 1st 4* seasons?

u6u7pnR.png


he would of been looked at as a flop. No wonder Mac gave the Avs a "steal of a contract" because he was trash up until year 5.

also Kadri is super overrated. Watch outtttt he's scoring on Arizona oh man theyre so goooood.

Rantanen's a stud tho.
 
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Gallagbi said:
Their first overall pick is also 3 years older than ours, both were supposed to start their upward trend and this is their 3rd playoff appearance since picking MacKinnon.

They're in great shape today, but it's been bumpy
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Pfft. Details schmetails.

That in the 4th season after McKinnon's draft (where we are now) they were coming off literally the worst season ever seen ( to that point) in the cap era is completely irrelevant.
 
Colorado sucked for a very, very long time. They were terrible to start the 2010s, had one great random year under Patrick Roy during Mackinnon's rookie year when it looked like they had a big three of Duchene, O'Reilly and Mackinnon, and then it fell apart again for many years before they turned the corner again in 2017 after blowing it up and restarting.

Their trajectory would actually look a like if this current Leafs team continued falling on its face, got dismantled, and then re-emerged in 2024 led by Matthews and some combination of our 2021 and 2022 first rounders or something like that.
 
Kadri kicking ass in the playoffs hurts to see no doubt, but the trade still needed to happen. Not just because of suspensions, but the team needed to address the defence in a major way. Taking away from the forwards, especially at centre where you have Auston Matthews and John Tavares as mainstay, made sense then and would now if we still had Kadri and were out in the first round again.

The main issue is that Barrie was the wrong defenseman to target. Soft, not good defensively, and no term on his contract. Now Barrie is going to walk after a shit season and playoffs, and we've got for Kadri is Kerfoot. :shakehead

Feels like a trade that was rushed and would've benefited Dubas taking his time. Even if it dragged into the season, getting the proper return for Kadri was highly important. If Dubas does explore trading Nylander, I hope he shows more restraint and bides his time before pulling the trigger.
 
AllDay28 said:
people love living with revisionist history here. imagine Matthews played like this his 1st 4* seasons?

u6u7pnR.png


he would of been looked at as a flop. No wonder Mac gave the Avs a "steal of a contract" because he was trash up until year 5.

also Kadri is super overrated. Watch outtttt he's scoring on Arizona oh man theyre so goooood.

Rantanen's a stud tho.
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You mean grabbing 10 points in 7 playoff games in his rookie season? I’d be cool with that.
 
Stephen said:
Mackinnon, Makar, Rantanen and Landeskog are all better than Kadri, and you could make a case for Girard too. And even Burakovsky is arguably more productive.
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Kadri is super overrated but if you see posts around here you'd think we traded away a first liner.
 
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4thline said:
Pfft. Details schmetails.

That in the 4th season after McKinnon's draft (where we are now) they were coming off literally the worst season ever seen ( to that point) in the cap era is completely irrelevant.
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wait,,, you mean the season where calvin pickard was their starting tender?
 
AllDay28 said:
Kadri is super overrated but if you see posts around here you'd think we traded away a first liner.
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Kadri's in a good spot with other star players to insulate him, and the Colorado Avalanche just feasted on a team that shouldn't have been in the playoffs. Wishing them all the best the rest of the way.
 
rubous said:
yea former 30 goal center, signed to a reasonable contract is over rated? dont think so...
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o0o0o watch out for the "former" 30 goal scorer.. 3 seasons ago.. soon to be 30 yr old Kadri is not going to be a 30 goal scorer ever again but sure

btw my buddy married this girl from Thornhill who went to school with Zach Hyman. you want me to tell him anything for you since hes your profile pic and all?
 
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