2021 Roster Thread XIX - Who's In Net

[deadhead]

It's possible. I don't recall him specifically saying he was a long hauler or anything:


He did have 8 points in his first 13 games returning, before his 3 points in 27 games finish. He had pretty brutal underlying numbers two seasons ago, but I didn't think that was his true value. Sure enough, he returned to possession neutral. I think his finishing is his best attribute, but it's still not hard to spot the outlier 5v5 season, which was brought up ad nauseam, in these groupings:

1.88 points/60......0.63 goals/60
1.36......0.6
1.51.......0.54
2.53......1.21
1.41.....0.62​

Sure, he can spike again like any player, but I think his last season looks relatively in line with his career norm, just without that mega-drought. He's not a passer, and even two seasons ago his primary assist/60 at 5v5 remained consistent. As usual, it comes down to shooting %s. He's fine in a vacuum. Still don't care for a 5 year contract for a 3rd liner, whose usage should get squeezed out further.

Exit interview (not he lost his sense of taste, that's a pretty severe symptom):

"Yeah, I don’t want to use it as an excuse. COVID affected everyone a little bit differently. I lost a little bit of weight. I’ll try to get that back, get back on track with my fitness, just being at my regular playing weight and being able to do that. It’s pretty hard to do that when you can’t taste food or things like that."

Laughton noted that he lost a significant amount of weight due to his bout with COVID-19, and his inability to taste food after recovering made it difficult to put it back on — at least in part explaining his second half scoring woes. Fletcher revealed that out of the 29-ish players who were on the roster or regulars on the taxi squad, 20 were hit with COVID-19 at some point over the past 5-6 months. That’s obviously not an insignificant number. It’s going to have an impact.

How did the Flyers — including ownership, GM, head coach and players — answer for awful 2020-21 season?

 

[GapToothedWonder]

Lots of them get 4 year deals, but there are a few 5 and 6 year deals as well.

Scott Laughton Comparables Results - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Looks like a total of 4.

 

[GapToothedWonder]

They do actually. Pittsburgh just recently gave Brandon Tanev a six year deal at a 3.5 million cap hit versus Laughton who got five years at 3.0 million. They were both 27 when their new contracts kicked in and Laughton is a more versatile and slightly more productive player.

A 32 year old Jay Beagle with a career high of 30 points got a four year deal at a 3 million cap hit from the Canucks in 2018.

There are examples of older and/or less productive players than Laughton who get 4-6 years and around the same cap hit in free agency every year.

Also, if we are going to get technical about what Laughton is from a production standpoint. If you include the playoffs, Laughton has produced 88 points over the last three seasons/199 games. This comes out to .442 points per game, or 36 points over an 82 game season.

I certainly wouldn't have prefered a five year deal for Laughton, but acting like 35 point guys who split their time between the 3rd and 4th lines are a dime a dozen is simply incorrect. His play and contract is nothing to get super excited about, nor get upset about as both are solid for this team.

I didn't read most of this but Curufuwins contract comparison showed a total of 4 getting 5 or more year deals. So not many.

 

[Beef Invictus]

That infuriates me. All the talk of patience and allowing guys to be "seasoned" in the AHL during the Hextall years was such bullshit. The AHL, or at least the phantoms, is NOT a development league. All of our young players that spent time on the phantoms have shown zero benefit from it....in fact id argue it hurt some of their development.

Fundamental skills and positioning, preparing your body for a long physical season, overcoming adversity...these are things players should learn in the minors. Myers shouldnt need an NHL coach to teach him basics...he should have been taught that in LV.

Hextall drafted well, but he failed to oversee successful development of his talent.

Lol and now Lappy runs that clown show

 

[deadhead]

I didn't read most of this but Curufuwins contract comparison showed a total of 4 getting 5 or more year deals. So not many.

Have to look at the ages as well, the longer contracts went to 27 year old players, Tanev, Belesky, Pouliot.
Iafallo got a 4x4, plays more minutes on a weaker team so his raw stats are better, but 1.61 pp/60 compared to Laughton's 1.94 over last 3 seasons.

 

[TheKingPin]

And maybe I could have gotten $20k for my bombed-out 2004 Impreza. I didn't, but maybe I could've.

Why, because it shows that significantly older and less productive players get similar deals and doesn't support your argument.


His contract is slightly below market value for a player like him.

and maybe if my aunt had a penis she'd be my uncle.

You shouldn’t cite bad deals as proof of a point just because they were made. See I I’ll do that too while simultaneously proving my point that Laughton could have gotten a first and that you shouldn’t base your point off bad deals…

Foligno was traded for a first.

 

[Prongo]

Exit interview (not he lost his sense of taste, that's a pretty severe symptom):

"Yeah, I don’t want to use it as an excuse. COVID affected everyone a little bit differently. I lost a little bit of weight. I’ll try to get that back, get back on track with my fitness, just being at my regular playing weight and being able to do that. It’s pretty hard to do that when you can’t taste food or things like that."

Laughton noted that he lost a significant amount of weight due to his bout with COVID-19, and his inability to taste food after recovering made it difficult to put it back on — at least in part explaining his second half scoring woes. Fletcher revealed that out of the 29-ish players who were on the roster or regulars on the taxi squad, 20 were hit with COVID-19 at some point over the past 5-6 months. That’s obviously not an insignificant number. It’s going to have an impact.

How did the Flyers — including ownership, GM, head coach and players — answer for awful 2020-21 season?

I wouldn’t consider losing your sense of taste a “severe symptom”. f*** I’m 7 months recovered after no serious symptoms and my taste and smell are nowhere near what they used to be.

It is legit the only symptom I had and it never had fully recovered since then.

 

[The Madrigal]

I didn't read most of this but Curufuwins contract comparison showed a total of 4 getting 5 or more year deals. So not many.

You are falling to realize a few things. That is recent history, not in total. Laughton is younger and/or better than a lot of the players on the list. You made it sound as if nobody comparable to Laughton gets a five year deal and there are examples in recent history of players who were less productive and/or older than him that got five or even six year deals. Either way I guess you need to make up your mind, do players like Laughton ever get five year deals, or is it only sometimes, including some who get six years. You made one comment, got proven wrong, then all of a sudden decided to move the goal post which isn't exactly surprising from you. The Flyers have plenty of problems, Laughton's contract isn't one of them.

 

[Striiker]

Yikes.

Dude, just stop with the ''you don't understand'' crap. I understand plenty

a few hours later...

You are falling to realize a few things.

The lack of self-awareness is truly something special.

 

[The Madrigal]

You shouldn’t cite bad deals as proof of a point just because they were made. See I I’ll do that too while simultaneously proving my point that Laughton could have gotten a first and that you shouldn’t base your point off bad deals…

Foligno was traded for a first.

Somebody said 30-35 point players don't get five year deals. I simply pointed out that a 32 year old with a career high of 30 points got a four year deal at the same aav of 3 million that Laughton got. How good or bad the contract was is irrelevant in the context of the conversation.

Also, while Laughton may have gotten the Flyers a first, you have no idea what they were or were not offered.

So on one hand you say that a piece of factual information shouldn't be cited, but then use your own pure speculation to try to make a point. Seems like a bit of double standard to me.

 

[Magua]

Exit interview (not he lost his sense of taste, that's a pretty severe symptom):

"Yeah, I don’t want to use it as an excuse. COVID affected everyone a little bit differently. I lost a little bit of weight. I’ll try to get that back, get back on track with my fitness, just being at my regular playing weight and being able to do that. It’s pretty hard to do that when you can’t taste food or things like that."

Laughton noted that he lost a significant amount of weight due to his bout with COVID-19, and his inability to taste food after recovering made it difficult to put it back on — at least in part explaining his second half scoring woes. Fletcher revealed that out of the 29-ish players who were on the roster or regulars on the taxi squad, 20 were hit with COVID-19 at some point over the past 5-6 months. That’s obviously not an insignificant number. It’s going to have an impact.

How did the Flyers — including ownership, GM, head coach and players — answer for awful 2020-21 season?

Fair enough, deady. He did have 8 points in 13 games upon returning, but I'm just not going to speculate on how he felt and when -- it's possible it caught up to him, or he just hit a rut, who knows. I'm totally okay giving him a mulligan for that 3 points in 27 games stretch, COVID or otherwise. It was more eye roll worthy than anything at the time, especially when they signed him to 5 years in the midst of it. There was some bad luck too; regardless, I know that's as unsustainably bad as other stretches were unsustainably good.

 

[GapToothedWonder]

You are falling to realize a few things. That is recent history, not in total. Laughton is younger and/or better than a lot of the players on the list. You made it sound as if nobody comparable to Laughton gets a five year deal and there are examples in recent history of players who were less productive and/or older than him that got five or even six year deals. Either way I guess you need to make up your mind, do players like Laughton ever get five year deals, or is it only sometimes, including some who get six years. You made one comment, got proven wrong, then all of a sudden decided to move the goal post which isn't exactly surprising from you. The Flyers have plenty of problems, Laughton's contract isn't one of them.

These essays responding to peoples off hand comments just boogles my mind.

 

[deadhead]

Fair enough, deady. He did have 8 points in 13 games upon returning, but I'm just not going to speculate on how he felt and when -- it's possible it caught up to him, or he just hit a rut, who knows. I'm totally okay giving him a mulligan for that 3 points in 27 games stretch, COVID or otherwise. It was more eye roll worthy than anything at the time, especially when they signed him to 5 years in the midst of it. There was some bad luck too; regardless, I know that's as unsustainably bad as other stretches were unsustainably good.

That's why I like to see a larger sample that seems to represent a player at that point in development.
1.94 pp/60 over a three year period from 24-26 seems to me to suggest a player hitting his peak. 200 games evens out hot/cold streaks.

Now Laughton has limitations, he's not a playmaker, more of a finisher, and in the past, he struggled with defense at center at 3C (at 4C he could just focus on forechecking), but his defense took a step up last season. And he's much improved on the PK.

I think it's a good bet he'd get 4x4 in free agency, so 5x3 to me seems a bargain, even if you had to eat a million or two in the last couple years (at age 30-31) to move him you should still come out ahead (i.e. $11M for 3 years plus whatever you obtain in trade).

 

[ybnvs]

Put me on the list of people who love the Laughton extension. Perfect price and glad he's locked in with the Flyers for the next few years.

 

[deadhead]

While Hayes hasn't played up to his contract, he hasn't been as nearly as bad as some would suggest:
HDCF% (last 3 seasons):
Lindblom 54.12% (9.28/60 against)
Hayes 54.02% (9.94) [2yr]
Couts 51.75% (10.21)
JVR 51.47% (10.05)
Voracek 50.87% (10.41)
Giroux 50.77% (10.38)

Patrick 49.69% (9.59)
Laughton 49.47% (10.21)
Farabee 49.30% (10.34)
TK 49.15% (10.43)

NAK 48.81% (8.71)
Raffl 46.35% (10.49)
bottom six types tend to have low HDCA/60 but also low HDCF%, as they usually lack linemates with offensive skills

Sanheim 51.69% (10.07)
Provorov 50.99% (9.87)
Braun 50.62% (9.60)
Ghost 48.59% (10.20)
Myers 46.47 (10.87)
Hagg 45.58% (11.28)

 

[GapToothedWonder]

Spoken like a person who is way out of their element and has absolutely nothing of substance to say.

To/too/two you. Definitely not.

 

[Curufinwe]

It's possible. I don't recall him specifically saying he was a long hauler or anything.

He talks here about losing weight and being unable to put it back on because he couldn’t taste food. Also that the trade rumors were affecting him.

Laughton shares his experience with COVID-19, trade deadline

already covered, I see.

 

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

I don't understand why people have Frost penciled into the lineup next year. You can bet Schmuck and Nature Boy are using him as one of the pieces to acquire Seth Jones or Jack Eichel. Frost doesn't have the ARGH SIIIIIIIIZE factor that they look for.

 

[mja]

I don't understand why people have Frost penciled into the lineup next year. You can bet Schmuck and Nature Boy are using him as one of the pieces to acquire Seth Jones or Jack Eichel. Frost doesn't have the ARGH SIIIIIIIIZE factor that they look for.

Would anyone really be upset if we lost Frost in a package for Eichel?

 

[Beef Invictus]

Would anyone really be upset if we lost Frost in a package for Eichel?

No, but it'll be in a dumb package.

 

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

Would anyone really be upset if we lost Frost in a package for Eichel?

Considering nobody knows how bad Eichel's neck injury is, it's probably best not to include anything major until multiple independent medical advisors say what the best course of action is, what recovery time is and what possible repercussions are if surgery is the best course of action. Considering Buffalo wants the other team to deal with this, clearly something isn't on the up and up.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Considering nobody knows how bad Eichel's neck injury is, it's probably best not to include anything major until multiple independent medical advisors say what the best course of action is, what recovery time is and what possible repercussions are if surgery is the best course of action. Considering Buffalo wants the other team to deal with this, clearly something isn't on the up and up.

There's a strong chance Buffalo is going to end up running some blockbuster where several players on two teams learn they're seen as expendable, only for the thing to get nixed by a physical

 

[bennysflyers16]

Put me on the list of people who love the Laughton extension. Perfect price and glad he's locked in with the Flyers for the next few years.

I am in the would of liked to trade him for assets, but have no problem with him staying as a Flyer. Don't love the contract, but it is fair.

 

[bennysflyers16]

Would anyone really be upset if we lost Frost in a package for Eichel?

f*** NO !

 

[captainpaxil]

Successful teams have a long term deal with depth player who can move up the lineup. I was in the raffl fanclub and I have calmed down on my expectations on laughton coming in cheap to perform the same role. He does a lot of little things well and took his game to the next level in the playoffs. Solid clutch depth guy with speed.
You have to try pretty hard to be upset about laughton. It seems the same people complaining are the same ones who make a firestorm when the veteran depth players they bring in on the cheap play down to value. Proven talent costs money.

Jvr cooter voracek
G Patrick tk
Lindblom Hayes farabee
Laughton frost Allison/nak

Assuming they all survive the off-season is a lineup I feel can take us to the playoffs and go places