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Speculation: 2020-21 LA Kings News/Roster/Rumors Discussion Part VI

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KingsFan7824 said:
If the Kings are going after Landeskog, or more importantly if he considers an offer from them, they're then not expecting to not be competitive for 3-4 years. Those would be the years you're paying some stupid 7 year UFA contract for. You want years 1-3, but pay for years 5-7, because of the cap. Maybe 1 more year of building the roster, but by year 2, it's all in at that point.

That's the problem with the big name UFA market. If you go that route, you have to get something done within the first couple season, or else there's no reason to get involved with it. You want to get more specific role guys in free agency, that's a bit different, but you don't have 7 years with the money guys.



Johansen had scored 60g and 130pts in the 2 seasons prior to the trade. Richards for Schenn would be more like Werenski for Byfield, but the Flyers were going out of their way to trade him. Clb needs to want to trade him. Assuming they're not rebuilding, a guy with 6 games and 1pt in his career is not the C they need before Jones needs to get paid.



Sort of an odd couple sentences from you, gotta be honest.
Click to expand...

I suppose I should have used the word "draft" instead of "get".

And you're right...the UFA is a fools errand. Blake will probably go there but it won't be a big dollar acquisition.

Finally, I think everyone is just using Werenski as the type of player the Kings should get. Who knows if he is available though? Similarly, I just used the Jones-Johansen trade as an example of what has been done in the past.

The truth is that if Blake wants the type of defenseman he says the team needs, he will have to get that player via a trade. And the primary trade chips the Kings have are center prospects and draft picks. Potentially Bjornfot in a bigger package deal with more pieces involved. I think most people are being pretty realistic that those are the most likely options available.
 
tomd said:
I suppose I should have used the word "draft" instead of "get".

And you're right...the UFA is a fools errand. Blake will probably go there but it won't be a big dollar acquisition.

Finally, I think everyone is just using Werenski as the type of player the Kings should get. Who knows if he is available though? Similarly, I just used the Jones-Johansen trade as an example of what has been done in the past.

The truth is that if Blake wants the type of defenseman he says the team needs, he will have to get that player via a trade. And the primary trade chips the Kings have are center prospects and draft picks. Potentially Bjornfot in a bigger package deal with more pieces involved. I think most people are being pretty realistic that those are the most likely options available.
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And I'm just saying the Kings don't have a Johansen to trade, so I'm not sure you can use that deal as an example of what Blake can or should do. There's no trading an established C for an established D. To even trade Byfield probably means finding a team that's ready to take a step back, like the Flyers were a decade ago. Considering the contract situation in Clb, I'd guess they're all in next year, because one way or another there's going to be some sort of roster shakeup afterwards. Unless their name is Crosby or McDavid, you're probably not going all in with a 19 year old C.
 
KingsFan7824 said:
And I'm just saying the Kings don't have a Johansen to trade, so I'm not sure you can use that deal as an example of what Blake can or should do. There's no trading an established C for an established D. To even trade Byfield probably means finding a team that's ready to take a step back, like the Flyers were a decade ago. Considering the contract situation in Clb, I'd guess they're all in next year, because one way or another there's going to be some sort of roster shakeup afterwards. Unless their name is Crosby or McDavid, you're probably not going all in with a 19 year old C.
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Blake is going to have to figure it out one way or another. His bargaining chips are center prospects, draft picks, and maybe Bjornfot. My prediction is that he settles for another Maata type acquisition and calls that player the answer. It would fit his pattern.
 
UFA defensemen ranked by points scored per game:

PLAYERAGEPOSHANDEDGPPP/GPTOICAP HIT
Tyson Barrie29RDRight52450.8721:33$3,750,000
Dougie Hamilton28RDRight54420.7822:45$5,750,000
Alec Martinez33LDLeft52310.622:32$4,000,000
Mike Reilly27LDLeft53260.4919:13$1,500,000
Erik Gustafsson29LD/RDLeft28120.4316:39$3,000,000
Jordan Gross26RDRight730.4313:11$750,000
Alex Goligoski35LD/RDLeft55210.3822:59$5,475,000
Brandon Montour27LD/RDRight49180.3720:34$3,850,000
Nate Prosser35RDRight620.3313:03$700,000
Cody Ceci27RDRight52170.3318:31$1,250,000
Ryan Murray27LDLeft46140.318:31$4,600,000
Andreas Borgman26LDLeft720.2911:57$700,000
[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Highest ranking LD is Martinez of course.
 
The "Money Puck" UFA defenseman that makes some sense for the Kings is Mike Reilly.

Plays LD, shoots left. Is one of the youngest UFAs. Scored at a 40 point pace.

Check out the Bruins discussion of him. Glowing reviews:
Player Discussion - Mike Reilly

Scouting report:
Mike Reilly Stats, Profile, Bio, Analysis and More | Boston Bruins | The Sports Forecaster

"Reilly is tied with Carlo for the fewest offensive zone starts with 45.7% of faceoffs beginning in the O-zone. Compare that to McAvoy who gets 54.3% of the O-zone starts. Yet Reilly only trails McAvoy in attempted shots per game with 3.75 compared to McAvoy’s 3.81."
Dominic Tiano: Mike Reilly Has Changed the Complexion of the B’s Blue Line
 
Dean made 50 trades before winning the first cup. Blake is only at 20. Not saying he needs to made 30 more moves but it is telling that a rebuild is still in progress and many more moves will come.
 
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tomd said:
Blake is going to have to figure it out one way or another. His bargaining chips are center prospects, draft picks, and maybe Bjornfot. My prediction is that he settles for another Maata type acquisition and calls that player the answer. It would fit his pattern.
Click to expand...

Maatta was for primarily for the expansion draft requirements, but still young enough that had things gone right, maybe he's helping the team. He cost literally nothing, and Chicago still retained. That's a move that you make when you're building.

His pattern exists in a context. I know context means nothing, but it does mean something. I know Kovalchuk was old, but other teams were also trying to sign him. That of course it was the Kings overpaying in cash and term only makes sense with the franchise history of the team. Once this expansion draft is over with, that is when Blake's second and what should be last chance starts.

Is it more likely that he's not able to get a real difference maker? Yes, so you will most likely be right. Real talent is hard to get. You said so yourself with the draft, so not sure why that doesn't also translate over to NHL player acquisitions. And bringing in someone else's 4th line C and hoping he can be productive would be classic snake oil Kings, and exactly the only kind of move Blake has shown he's able to make.

Blake isn't going anywhere before this summer, so you have to give him yet more time to prove to be a disappointing employee, and the Kings more time to yet again show that they're cheap and not interesting in winning.
 
Raccoon Jesus said:
I'm still of the mind that hunting for unicorns before you even know what holes you have to fill is absolute folly.

Even dumber if that unicorn costs Byfield.

Yes you have to give to get but you're just opening up another hole at this stage. It's cutting off your nose to spite your face.
Click to expand...

The holes are pretty obvious. A top 4 LHD and at least 1 top 6 RW and 1 top 6 LW. And that assumes the Kings will "gift" the 2c spot to Byfield and hope he is ready for it. We'll see but it would sure help him if he had a winger or two who actually has had success at the NHL level.

On defense, I don't think it is much of an exaggeration to say that if the Kings had had a legit top 4 LHD this season they would have probably 3-5 additional wins. MacDermid alone cost the Kings that many games. Blake must fill that hole this summer.

And I'm not advocating trading Byfield but as a GM Blake has to be open to anything that would help the team in both the short and long term. As an example (and it is just an example), if Columbus came to the Kings and proposed Werenski and Laine for Byfield, Bjornfot, and another player then the Kings would be nuts not to seriously consider that. But yes, it would take that type of trade to move Byfield...but he IS movable.
 
tomd said:
And I'm not advocating trading Byfield but as a GM Blake has to be open to anything that would help the team in both the short and long term. As an example (and it is just an example), if Columbus came to the Kings and proposed Werenski and Laine for Byfield, Bjornfot, and another player then the Kings would be nuts not to seriously consider that. But yes, it would take that type of trade to move Byfield...but he IS movable.
Click to expand...
They'd be nuts to consider it all.
 
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Only on HF can we make up terrible unrealistic trade proposals and then argue about them! Then throw in our agenda that the current regime would or wouldn’t do it, therefore they are terrible!
 
tomd said:
The holes are pretty obvious. A top 4 LHD and at least 1 top 6 RW and 1 top 6 LW. And that assumes the Kings will "gift" the 2c spot to Byfield and hope he is ready for it. We'll see but it would sure help him if he had a winger or two who actually has had success at the NHL level.

On defense, I don't think it is much of an exaggeration to say that if the Kings had had a legit top 4 LHD this season they would have probably 3-5 additional wins. MacDermid alone cost the Kings that many games. Blake must fill that hole this summer.

And I'm not advocating trading Byfield but as a GM Blake has to be open to anything that would help the team in both the short and long term. As an example (and it is just an example), if Columbus came to the Kings and proposed Werenski and Laine for Byfield, Bjornfot, and another player then the Kings would be nuts not to seriously consider that. But yes, it would take that type of trade to move Byfield...but he IS movable.
Click to expand...

That's absolutely terrible. He's movable, but pretty much most moves to age the core are reckless and sloppy.

Edit: to clarify - Byfield + Bjornfot are part of the next wave of youth inheriting ownership. The Kings don't have much under the age of 25 who are ready to be leaders.

Laine is not part of a future ownership. He wore out his welcome in half a season in Columbus.

Werenski is skilled, which the Kings would benefit from. But not nearly enough to trade Bjornfot, Byfield, plus.

And most players who are future leaders under 25 aren't being traded. So this is an exercise in futility.
 
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King'sPawn said:
That's absolutely terrible. He's movable, but pretty much most moves to age the core are reckless and sloppy.
Click to expand...

You realize that Laine and Werenski are both 23 years old, right? Is that really "aging the core"? Or is it improving it immeasurably?

And show me your posts from 2011 where DL added Richards (26) for Schenn (20) and Simmonds (23). Setting aside that Richards was a drug addicted alcoholic at the time of the trade, was that not "aging the core"?
 
tomd said:
You realize that Laine and Werenski are both 23 years old, right? Is that really "aging the core"? Or is it improving it immeasurably?

And show me your posts from 2011 where DL added Richards (26) for Schenn (20) and Simmonds (23). Setting aside that Richards was a drug addicted alcoholic at the time of the trade, was that not "aging the core"?
Click to expand...

I clarified above.

Kings need new leaders once Kopitar/Brown/Doughty retire.

Laine is not a future leader to take team ownership.

Werenski isn't enough for what you want to trade.

And Richards took leadership/ownership.

Comparing what the Kings need now versus what the Kings needed in 2011/12 shows a lack of understanding of building a team. Just trading away future core to increase overall skill is a detriment.
 
King'sPawn said:
I clarified above.

Kings need new leaders once Kopitar/Brown/Doughty retire.

Laine is not a future leader to take team ownership.

Werenski isn't enough for what you want to trade.

And Richards took leadership/ownership.

Comparing what the Kings need now versus what the Kings needed in 2011/12 shows a lack of understanding of building a team. Just trading away future core to increase overall skill is a detriment.
Click to expand...

You criminally underrate both Laine and Werenski and overrate Bjornfot and Byfield. A little too much homerism for my taste but ok. It is clear that your method of improvement is through years of drafting. That's fine. The benefit of that approach will be the firing of both Blake and Luc in a year or two when the team still sucks. I trust the next management team will be a little more serious about their commitments to the fans.
 
tomd said:
You criminally underrate both Laine and Werenski and overrate Bjornfot and Byfield. A little too much homerism for my taste but ok. It is clear that your method of improvement is through years of drafting. That's fine. The benefit of that approach will be the firing of both Blake and Luc in a year or two when the team still sucks. I trust the next management team will be a little more serious about their commitments to the fans.
Click to expand...

Laine literally is wearing out his welcome within three months of joining a new team. You want to ship off two of the Kings best prospects plus for him.

What's the opposite of homerism?
 
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tomd said:
The holes are pretty obvious. A top 4 LHD and at least 1 top 6 RW and 1 top 6 LW. And that assumes the Kings will "gift" the 2c spot to Byfield and hope he is ready for it. We'll see but it would sure help him if he had a winger or two who actually has had success at the NHL level.

On defense, I don't think it is much of an exaggeration to say that if the Kings had had a legit top 4 LHD this season they would have probably 3-5 additional wins. MacDermid alone cost the Kings that many games. Blake must fill that hole this summer.

And I'm not advocating trading Byfield but as a GM Blake has to be open to anything that would help the team in both the short and long term. As an example (and it is just an example), if Columbus came to the Kings and proposed Werenski and Laine for Byfield, Bjornfot, and another player then the Kings would be nuts not to seriously consider that. But yes, it would take that type of trade to move Byfield...but he IS movable.
Click to expand...
Youd be getting Laine to play along side Byfield so you cant make that trade. I may be in the minority here but Id love to see Laine in a kings uniform and think its something they should pursue. Byfield is off the table though Id think.
 
Schmooley said:
Youd be getting Laine to play along side Byfield so you cant make that trade. I may be in the minority here but Id love to see Laine in a kings uniform and think its something they should pursue. Byfield is off the table though Id think.
Click to expand...

You'd be getting Laine to play alongside Kopitar.
 
tomd said:
And there it is....prospects >>>> established stars who are under 25 years old. Only on HF is such a world possible.
Click to expand...
Byfield isn't just some prospect though. He's the 2OA pick. It's so rare that teams get an opportunity to draft a player like him. There's a chasm between someone like him and say Turcotte for example.
 
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72a62484a11e2def625193b15ef50d20.jpg
 
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