OT: Winnipeg ICE sold - Moving to Wenatchee, Washington renamed Wenatchee Wild

[RetroWinnipeg]

ICE need to get Savoie back. And I need to figure out how to turn the away commentators on in the CHL app, it’s quite annoying listening to the away homers.

Under the audio and subtitles icon (located at the bottom of the video stream), you can switch to the away feed (it might also be labelled as a second "English").

 

[Guardian17]

Western Hockey League

whl.ca

 

[jetsmooseice]

So painful to lose two games in OT against the Oil Kings. Once on a silly flub, and then again with a late blown lead. It drives me nuts to know the ICE could easily be up 3-0.

That said, this series is still 100% winnable. It just needs to begin with a win tomorrow night as there is no way this team is going to come back from a 3-1 deficit against Edmonton. I assume Savoie is out for Wednesday but is Pederson back from his suspension? If so that will make a difference for sure. ICE need all the offense they can muster if they want to pull this off.

 

[nobody imp0rtant]

A good Winnipeg team not being able to get past Edmonton. It's like deja vu all over again.

 

[snowkiddin]

So painful to lose two games in OT against the Oil Kings. Once on a silly flub, and then again with a late blown lead. It drives me nuts to know the ICE could easily be up 3-0.

That said, this series is still 100% winnable. It just needs to begin with a win tomorrow night as there is no way this team is going to come back from a 3-1 deficit against Edmonton. I assume Savoie is out for Wednesday but is Pederson back from his suspension? If so that will make a difference for sure. ICE need all the offense they can muster if they want to pull this off.

Ah, so that’s where Pederson was. Curious that he got suspended but Sourdif didn’t.

 

[snowkiddin]

Savoie likely done for the series. He seems injury prone, I can see him falling in the draft.

 

[Heldig]

Savoie likely done for the series. He seems injury prone, I can see him falling in the draft.

That is too bad. I was hoping to watch him in these playoffs.

 

[snowkiddin]

That is too bad. I was hoping to watch him in these playoffs.

It was a dirty hit — he didn’t have the puck and the zebras didn’t call anything — could be a series-changing moment.

 

[Heldig]

It was a dirty hit — he didn’t have the puck and the zebras didn’t call anything — could be a series-changing moment.

Read about it but did not see it.

 

[snowkiddin]

The ICE defence is pretty f***ing abysmal, man.

 

[snowkiddin]

That’s a spectacularly bad call on Geekie, wow.

 

[snowkiddin]

Shades of the Jets, the ICE are shockingly, unspeakably bad in basically a do or die game.

 

[Fairview]

No urgency by the Ice. Disappointing

Not sure that we have won a single board battle the whole game.

 

[snowkiddin]

No urgency by the Ice. Disappointing

Not sure that we have won a single board battle the whole game.

You got that right. Halfway through the 3rd period down by one and they haven’t even threatened yet.

 

[Fairview]

With this type of effort, they will be out of it after game five, unfortunately

Too bad, this game was never in doubt.

 

[snowkiddin]

With this type of effort, they will be out of it after game five, unfortunately

It’s a shame. From management inexplicably screwing the pooch at the deadline, to a defensive system that makes the Jets look like the mid-90s Devils teams, to an effort that resembles a preseason game, to repetitive brain dead turnovers, to losing their best player to a dirty play … it’s a tough way to lose what was an incredible season.

 

[Guardian17]

Western Hockey League

whl.ca

 

[jetsmooseice]

Savoie likely done for the series. He seems injury prone, I can see him falling in the draft.

Hard to argue. Between the infamous injury he suffered as a 15 year old to missing 20-odd games in the regular season to getting injured again in the playoffs, there is a clear pattern emerging here. If this is how it's going in junior then what's it going to be like in the pros?

The ICE defence is pretty f***ing abysmal, man.

Been a sore spot all season and when you have situations like game 3 OT where Sourdif easily splits your two best D men to get the OT winner then you know it's not a good scene. Tanner Brown did not look good at all and Jonas Woo has potential but Edmonton is too overwhelming for a young kid like that.

It’s a shame. From management inexplicably screwing the pooch at the deadline, to a defensive system that makes the Jets look like the mid-90s Devils teams, to an effort that resembles a preseason game, to repetitive brain dead turnovers, to losing their best player to a dirty play … it’s a tough way to lose what was an incredible season.

If you want to look at it as optimistically as possible, you could say that this was the warmup for the ICE's best shot which will be next year. That is at least the reason I hope explains their inaction at the trade deadline... they're keeping their powder dry for next season when they will have to go all in like Edmonton did this year.

What is agonizing about it is that the ICE did come close to taking the lead in the series. Losing two OT games including one that they were leading until less than a couple minutes left is very painful. This could have easily been a 3-1 ICE series right now. Last night was the only game where the ICE really got dominated and even then they had a decent start to the game, they just had an uncharacteristically bad third period.

I like to look on the bright side but I can't say I'm expecting a comeback miracle in this series.

 

[RetroWinnipeg]

So far this series is playing out exactly like the 2009 Calder Cup Finals. (OT loss, followed by a big win)

In other words, prepare for upsetting times in Edmonton.

 

[snowkiddin]

Hard to argue. Between the infamous injury he suffered as a 15 year old to missing 20-odd games in the regular season to getting injured again in the playoffs, there is a clear pattern emerging here. If this is how it's going in junior then what's it going to be like in the pros?



Been a sore spot all season and when you have situations like game 3 OT where Sourdif easily splits your two best D men to get the OT winner then you know it's not a good scene. Tanner Brown did not look good at all and Jonas Woo has potential but Edmonton is too overwhelming for a young kid like that.



If you want to look at it as optimistically as possible, you could say that this was the warmup for the ICE's best shot which will be next year. That is at least the reason I hope explains their inaction at the trade deadline... they're keeping their powder dry for next season when they will have to go all in like Edmonton did this year.

What is agonizing about it is that the ICE did come close to taking the lead in the series. Losing two OT games including one that they were leading until less than a couple minutes left is very painful. This could have easily been a 3-1 ICE series right now. Last night was the only game where the ICE really got dominated and even then they had a decent start to the game, they just had an uncharacteristically bad third period.

I like to look on the bright side but I can't say I'm expecting a comeback miracle in this series.

Next year is definitely gonna be the ICE's all-in year, but I still think they should've done more this year. The idea that we won't lose anyone from this roster is patently untrue.

First, Nolan Orzeck, Cole Muir, and Jakin Smallwood are all overagers who will graduate. So, that's a top 4 defenseman; a solid, but unspectacular, defensive forward; and a PPG forward who is one of the leaders on the team.

Then, you can only have three overagers on the roster so a bunch '02s will be gone. Finley will be in the AHL next season. McClennon likely too. So, there goes a big, talented C and you're leading goalscorer. Milne hasn't been drafted yet (maybe he's a late pick this year) so I think there's a fair chance he comes back as an overager, which is huge. If Milne takes up a spot you have two left and I think they'd go with Zloty and Pederson - both won't be turning pro (at least not next year) so you can get a final year out of them. I can see the Ducks wanting to return Alexander to junior for one more year but the ICE probably go with Hauser, and there isn't really a spot for an overager backup goalie on the roster. That means you also lose Brown and Wheatcroft.

I'm not entirely sure, but since Lambos is an '03 I think it's NHL or junior for him next season, I don't think he is eligible for the AHL. I don't think he's an NHLer yet, so if he comes back, that's huge, even though he's been extremely underwhelming defensively this series. Earlier in the season I would've pegged Savoie as 50/50 between the NHL and junior but especially with this latest injury I think he'll be back. Geekie is almost certainly back. Benson will be back and will be a top 5 pick in 2023. It'll also depend a lot on any young guys that come in, and how they do. Another full season for Woo and he should greatly improve.

All of the ICE's returning players should be even better so expectations should and will be high next year, and I expect the ICE to be near the top of the league again. Still, given the season they had it's extremely disappointing that they didn't feel like engaging in the arms' race with Edmonton. It's like they saw the Oil Kings loading up and said, "You know what? They're spending a lot to bring in top-end talent, let's just let them win."

On the bright side, Edmonton won't be a problem at all next year. They're gonna lose all of Guenther, Neighbours, Prokop, Guhle, Cossa, Williams, Souch, and Sourdif. That's essentially their entire core - they'll be rebuilders next season.

 

[jetsmooseice]

Next year is definitely gonna be the ICE's all-in year, but I still think they should've done more this year. The idea that we won't lose anyone from this roster is patently untrue.

First, Nolan Orzeck, Cole Muir, and Jakin Smallwood are all overagers who will graduate. So, that's a top 4 defenseman; a solid, but unspectacular, defensive forward; and a PPG forward who is one of the leaders on the team.

Then, you can only have three overagers on the roster so a bunch '02s will be gone. Finley will be in the AHL next season. McClennon likely too. So, there goes a big, talented C and you're leading goalscorer. Milne hasn't been drafted yet (maybe he's a late pick this year) so I think there's a fair chance he comes back as an overager, which is huge. If Milne takes up a spot you have two left and I think they'd go with Zloty and Pederson - both won't be turning pro (at least not next year) so you can get a final year out of them. I can see the Ducks wanting to return Alexander to junior for one more year but the ICE probably go with Hauser, and there isn't really a spot for an overager backup goalie on the roster. That means you also lose Brown and Wheatcroft.

I'm not entirely sure, but since Lambos is an '03 I think it's NHL or junior for him next season, I don't think he is eligible for the AHL. I don't think he's an NHLer yet, so if he comes back, that's huge, even though he's been extremely underwhelming defensively this series. Earlier in the season I would've pegged Savoie as 50/50 between the NHL and junior but especially with this latest injury I think he'll be back. Geekie is almost certainly back. Benson will be back and will be a top 5 pick in 2023. It'll also depend a lot on any young guys that come in, and how they do. Another full season for Woo and he should greatly improve.

All of the ICE's returning players should be even better so expectations should and will be high next year, and I expect the ICE to be near the top of the league again. Still, given the season they had it's extremely disappointing that they didn't feel like engaging in the arms' race with Edmonton. It's like they saw the Oil Kings loading up and said, "You know what? They're spending a lot to bring in top-end talent, let's just let them win."

On the bright side, Edmonton won't be a problem at all next year. They're gonna lose all of Guenther, Neighbours, Prokop, Guhle, Cossa, Williams, Souch, and Sourdif. That's essentially their entire core - they'll be rebuilders next season.

Great analysis.

That last paragraph touches on the key difference between the Oil Kings' approach and the ICE's... the Oil Kings clearly concentrated their efforts on going all in on 2021/22 while the ICE are simply too staggered for a concentrated push in any one season. Krebs and Barteaux are gone, a bunch of key cogs are leaving as you point out and next season is a question mark as we don't know how this team's makeup is going to look as several new players come on board.

Tanner Brown was a decent add defensively, he added some depth, but not getting a potential top pairing guy like Edmonton did with Prokop or Guhle was a major fail.

I guess the most charitable interpretation is that the ICE decided to wait out the Oil Kings and go all in for next year. In 2022-23 it will basically be now or never for the current crop.

 

[snowkiddin]

Great analysis.

That last paragraph touches on the key difference between the Oil Kings' approach and the ICE's... the Oil Kings clearly concentrated their efforts on going all in on 2021/22 while the ICE are simply too staggered for a concentrated push in any one season. Krebs and Barteaux are gone, a bunch of key cogs are leaving as you point out and next season is a question mark as we don't know how this team's makeup is going to look as several new players come on board.

Tanner Brown was a decent add defensively, he added some depth, but not getting a potential top pairing guy like Edmonton did with Prokop or Guhle was a major fail.

I guess the most charitable interpretation is that the ICE decided to wait out the Oil Kings and go all in for next year. In 2022-23 it will basically be now or never for the current crop.

Yep - the ICE’s roster will probably be similar calibre. They’ll lose some good players for sure but growth from the 04s and 05s should offset that to some degree. The Oil Kings will suck next year so the championship is the ICE’s for the taking.

 

[jetsmooseice]

Yep - the ICE’s roster will probably be similar calibre. They’ll lose some good players for sure but growth from the 04s and 05s should offset that to some degree. The Oil Kings will suck next year so the championship is the ICE’s for the taking.

I'm curious to see who in the Eastern Conference is poised to step up to be a contender for the conference title. No team that I can think of, really, at least not for next season. A lot of teams on the way up and down, but only the ICE are really going to be at the top of the mountain.

I have no idea what's going on in the Western Conference that could mess that up for the ICE, though.

 

[snowkiddin]

I'm curious to see who in the Eastern Conference is poised to step up to be a contender for the conference title. No team that I can think of, really, at least not for next season. A lot of teams on the way up and down, but only the ICE are really going to be at the top of the mountain.

I have no idea what's going on in the Western Conference that could mess that up for the ICE, though.

I'll have to look into some more tonight after work but in the west Everett should be very good again. Kamloops has been carried by Stankoven - if he's back they'll be a force, if he's gone, then they'll likely be a bubble team. He's an 03 so it's NHL or bust for him and as a smaller player I think he might end up heading back. The Pats should take a huge step but not enough to compete with the ICE. Moose Jaw, Brandon, Prince Albert and Saskatoon are all kind of meh, so the ICE should theoretically run away with the division at the very least.

 

[jetsmooseice]

Gameday, baby. I am ready for the comeback to begin! IT AIN'T OVER!