Proposal: Win nyr

[dashripdot]

McDonagh was awful at the World Cup, and he had a good partner.

You wasted your time watching that **** show and now you're wasting my time talking about it.

 

[bigdog16]

Has it been discussed who exactly the Jets want for Trouba? All i see is "no" "dont need wingers" "value not high enough". I get it you want a similarly aged dman who can fill in for Trouba, good luck with that...Any specific names you'd target??

 

[TS Quint]

I'm under the impression that there will be many disappointed Jets fan when Trouba is traded. Every single time that a player ask for a trade and it goes public... it's always an underwhelming return

Evander Kane?

 

[Zhamnov5GoalGame]

So since literally nobody will meet those demands and, according to you, Chevy won't budge on his ask, what do you expect to happen? You think Trouba will just take it on the chin?

Do you guys really want to pay Trouba 6M/year to play on his off side, or on the third pairing, especially when you already have 3 defensemen making 5.5M+?

Time is not on your side, and every other team knows this. Nobody is going to pay the price you think Trouba is worth now when they can just wait it out. The only way something happens now is if Chevy blinks.

His value won't go up unless he plays, and he won't play until he has a contract. Each passing day the value drops.

tick tock

Management, ownership, coaches, media and fan base all on Chevy's side not to cave to this ridiculous request by Trouba. Our team is better with him than not but we're already playing without him. We can't change that. But Trouba is the one who is going to start losing A LOT of money. Money he can never make back. Jets own his rights for 4 years and can hang on to him as long as they like. If Trouba sits out the year or goes to KHL etc... well we still own his rights for 4 more years. If Trouba wants to get traded he should sign a deal and come back to work. Playing along side Buff will juice up his stats and worth. The best way for Trouba to get what he wants (money and apparently out of Winnipeg) is to increase his value on the ice.

Every other franchise should be thanking Chevy for not caving. RFA's without arbitration rights should not be dictating where the are going to play. You earn that right at UFA. If every player who wanted to move because of location, or a better opportunity to play on another team had that right then a majority of franchises would be struggling with this. The team has a right to the full value of the player they drafted. Trouba signed an ELC that gives the Jets rights over him. Suck it up, tell your parents to shut up and get an agent who isn't loathed in the industry.

I'm a season ticket holder and I support the Jets stance. This is no different than if he had gotten injured in training camp. You play with who you have in the room. Hopefully in a few weeks Jacob will realize this, come back to work and help facilitate the environment that will make trading him possible.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

McDonagh or bust.

Can we trade Fast for Scheiffele too then?

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

McDonagh was awful at the World Cup, and he had a good partner.

What World Cup were you watching?

 

[Shootertooter]

On a side note, I think the jets would love to have stepan if he was available. I however do not want him moved like bern and others.. He has tremendous chemistry with wheeler going back to Junior days (olympic). But with scheif and little, it is not a pressing priority........

Maybe trouba little for stepan, skjei, + pick??? could get interesting

Not that I want trade Step, but this would be one deal where I would consider it. And I had said a few weeks ago Step, Skjei + a pick would be the offer.

 

[Hunter368]

Not that I want trade Step, but this would be one deal where I would consider it. And I had said a few weeks ago Step, Skjei + a pick would be the offer.

At this point, I doubt Chevy takes any return with a forward being the main piece. Will that change with how Josh M is playing and looks like a lock for a top 4 LHD position and we get closer to Dec 1st? Maybe

 

[Jeti]

Not that I want trade Step, but this would be one deal where I would consider it. And I had said a few weeks ago Step, Skjei + a pick would be the offer.

Little is better than Stepan and Trouba is significantly better than Skjei. Of course you'd do that trade. Jets wouldn't. That's even worse than the OP offer.

At this point, I doubt Chevy takes any return with a forward being the main piece. Will that change with how Josh M is playing and looks like a lock for a top 4 LHD position and we get closer to Dec 1st? Maybe

When Morrissey was drafted we all hoped he'd take the #2LHD (i.e. #4 D) spot behind Enstrom. Now Enstrom is declining and can no longer handle top-pairing minutes. So Morrissey doesn't change the fact that there's still a big hole on LHD in the future. Morrissey's play only dictates if it's one hole or two.

 

[Arthur Fonzarelli]

Honestly this is more than fair to Winnipeg, fills a need for both teams

It's a very fair deal from Winnipeg's perspective & here's why.

Anyone that follows the Jets knows their biggest weakness is at LD:

1) Tobias Enström (31)-under sized top pairing defensemen whose been on the decline for 3 seasons
2) Josh Morrissey (21)-1 season of pro hockey after a stellar junior career
3) Mark Stuart (32)-over priced particularly when his stats are among the leagues worst
4) Ben Chiarot (25)-a slightly above average AHL dman that just played his first full NHL season
5) Brian Strait (28)-some call him the worst dman in the NHL. Those that don't replace his name with Mark Stuart.
6) Julian Melchiori (24)-a slightly below average AHL dman that has been nothing more than a call-up

That's bad. Likely the worst LD in the league. To be that bad there must be something coming up in the system right? Wrong

1) Logan Stanley (18)-a 1st round project. Years away from the NHL.
2) Sami Niku (19)-7th rounder with some upside playing overseas

...and that's it. Nothing else in the system. Why? While Chevy has been collecting one of the best collection of forward prospects in hockey, in his six years of draft history they've drafted five LD, only three of which remain in the system.

1) 2016 Stanley (1st-18)
2) 2015 Niku (7th-198)
3) 2013 Morrissey (1st (13)
4) 2011 Harstad (7th-187) released
5) 2011 Yuen (4th-119) released

So now that you understand how dire the Jets position is at LD, it's no wonder many Jets fan would look for the add to be McDonagh. Thinking this potential deal out loud let's see how this leaves the Jets for expansion.

They'd be stuck in a position to go with 4D & 4F:
1D-Dustin Byfuglien
2D-Ryan McDonagh
3D-Tyler Myers
4D-Tobias Enström
1F-Blake Wheeler
2F-Mark Scheifele
3F-Bryan Little
4F-Mathieu Perreault
1G-Connor Hellebuyck

& now they expose all of Dano, Armia, Copp, Lowry, Burmistrov & Matthias.

True they have a dirth of expansion exempt forwards, but trading Trouba for Zuccarello / Skeij puts them in a position to protect 7 forwards & 3 defensemen.

Skeij is expansion exempt & has tremendous upside. He's also from Minnesota & would fit in the Minnesota Mafia (Wheeler, Byfugien, Stuart).

Zuccarello is a premiere player & is a MUCH better option than protecting any of Dano, Armia, Copp, Lowry, Burmistrov & Matthias. PLUS this scenario affords two more of these forwards to be protected.

Take Zuccarello off the table & replace with J.T. Miller & this is still a good deal for the Jets.

 

[10Ducky10]

win gets
Mats zucarello
brady skjei

nYR gets
trouba
Lowry


trouba wants out. His skillset has been discussed to death NYR needs a 1 RD. He has a lot of potential. Lowry gives them a 4th center for the future as well.

win gets zuc who can play both wings, cost controlled, 60+pts.
skjei who is dubbed mini McD by many. Skates like the wind,big,talented. His offense is a ?. he will be a top 4 D in the NHL no doubt. If his offense game rounds out he is a McDonuagh clone. If not he is more brett hedican. 1 month younger then trouba

Trouba and a 2nd for McDonagh and Skjei.

 

[WesMcCauley]

Trouba and a 2nd for McDonagh and Skjei.

What are you guys on? Mcdonagh is a legit #1 in his prime. Win would have to add with Trouba to get Mcdonagh. Trouba isnt Ekblad, hell trouba isnt even close to Rielly, Lindholm etc either.

 

[RangerBlues]

Zucc and Skjei for Truba and a spare tire.

Yeah
riiiiight

 

[Arthur Fonzarelli]

Zucc and Skjei for Truba and a spare tire.

Yeah
riiiiight

It's the Rangers fans that have being suggesting these deals.

Of the three teams (Arizona, New York & Colorado) that are reported to be the main teams in the running, Jets fans are the ones that dislike a deal with the Rangers as that key piece, a LD clone of Trouba isn't something they possess. The closest is Skeij.

I was pointing out that perhaps it isn't in the best interest of the Jets to be going after an LD like McDonagh who would require protection, but to suggest this mindset of a LD being the only piece the Jets would accept has legitimate problems that come along with it.

There's nothing wrong with accepting a premiere forward in exchange, go with a 7-3-1 expansion plan & then address the Jets woeful LD at another time.

ps...3-1 Jays!!! two 1st inning homers!!!

 

[RangerBlues]

It's the Rangers fans that have being suggesting these deals.

Of the three teams (Arizona, New York & Colorado) that are reported to be the main teams in the running, Jets fans are the ones that dislike a deal with the Rangers as that key piece, a LD clone of Trouba isn't something they possess. The closest is Skeij.

I was pointing out that perhaps it isn't in the best interest of the Jets to be going after an LD like McDonagh who would require protection, but to suggest this mindset of a LD being the only piece the Jets would accept has legitimate problems that come along with it.

There's nothing wrong with accepting a premiere forward in exchange, go with a 7-3-1 expansion plan & then address the Jets woeful LD at another time.

ps...3-1 Jays!!! two 1st inning homers!!!

Its the offseason. The adults are now in the room.
Graves and a second round pick.
Why overpay for a middling defensman who wants out of small market Canada and 7 mill a year
Im watching the game.
Ive thought the Jays were the best team in the AL all season

 

[10Ducky10]

Doesn't matter, he will re-sign with the Jets.

 

[bernmeister]

The Jets reported ask is for a very specific return, a similarly aged and skilled d-man; Staal is not that player. BTW, they don't need Stepan, and already have three goalies currently in the running for two jobs. Your offer is way off the mark.

sorry for delay in reply, have been swamped
yes, Staal is no longer THAT player
he is still useful for you even if not 1LD; he is not Girardi
and that is all the more so if salary eaten

Stepan was interjected as currency.
You had the option to keep as long term replacement for Burmi or move as desired
Again, Rangers eat sizeable chunk so his value is now extremely high.

Pavelec was a cap dump in my projection, and that he was waived confirms that estimate.
Us sending Raanta at 1m per x 2 give you max flex to play da kids, develop both and if still under contract and superfluous, deal Raata as an expiring.

Still willing to move McD, but you have to realize, like it or not, that there is an appreciable market for him throughout the league

We can rework this deal, give you McD, but part of the + that comes w/Trouba is you take a reduced Staal and his NMC. that is inconvenience, but if I remember w/out Trouba, you can squeeze him on the 3 required to be protected list of expansion

 

[bernmeister]

It's a very fair deal from Winnipeg's perspective & here's why.

Anyone that follows the Jets knows their biggest weakness is at LD:

1) Tobias Enström (31)-under sized top pairing defensemen whose been on the decline for 3 seasons
2) Josh Morrissey (21)-1 season of pro hockey after a stellar junior career
3) Mark Stuart (32)-over priced particularly when his stats are among the leagues worst
4) Ben Chiarot (25)-a slightly above average AHL dman that just played his first full NHL season
5) Brian Strait (28)-some call him the worst dman in the NHL. Those that don't replace his name with Mark Stuart.
6) Julian Melchiori (24)-a slightly below average AHL dman that has been nothing more than a call-up

That's bad. Likely the worst LD in the league. To be that bad there must be something coming up in the system right? Wrong

1) Logan Stanley (18)-a 1st round project. Years away from the NHL.
2) Sami Niku (19)-7th rounder with some upside playing overseas

...and that's it. Nothing else in the system. Why? While Chevy has been collecting one of the best collection of forward prospects in hockey, in his six years of draft history they've drafted five LD, only three of which remain in the system.

1) 2016 Stanley (1st-18)
2) 2015 Niku (7th-198)
3) 2013 Morrissey (1st (13)
4) 2011 Harstad (7th-187) released
5) 2011 Yuen (4th-119) released

So now that you understand how dire the Jets position is at LD, it's no wonder many Jets fan would look for the add to be McDonagh. Thinking this potential deal out loud let's see how this leaves the Jets for expansion.

They'd be stuck in a position to go with 4D & 4F:
1D-Dustin Byfuglien
2D-Ryan McDonagh
3D-Tyler Myers
4D-Tobias Enström
1F-Blake Wheeler
2F-Mark Scheifele
3F-Bryan Little
4F-Mathieu Perreault
1G-Connor Hellebuyck

& now they expose all of Dano, Armia, Copp, Lowry, Burmistrov & Matthias.

True they have a dirty of expansion exempt forwards, but trading Trouba for Zuccarello / Skeij puts them in a position to protect 7 forwards & 3 defensemen.

Skeij is expansion exempt & has tremendous upside. He's also from Minnesota & would fit in the Minnesota Mafia (Wheeler, Byfugien, Stuart).

Zuccarello is a premiere player & is a MUCH better option than protecting any of Dano, Armia, Copp, Lowry, Burmistrov & Matthias. PLUS this scenario affords two more of these forwards to be protected.

Take Zuccarello off the table & replace with J.T. Miller & this is still a good deal for the Jets.

The above, thank you, proves my point about how minus Trouba you can protect a reduced Staal also in a deal

Rangers are not moving expansion safe Skjei or Graves

McD and Staal reduced, Raanta
hell I'll add the expiring Holden, a lefty who plays either side

Trouba, Burmi, Pavelec = cap dump and another D we can agree on
Rangers can afford to bury an overpriced contract
WITHIN REASON
scratch my itch on the NMC and I'll help you with a bad $ deal
everybody wins

 

[bernmeister]

No way. Moving Little for Stepan would be counter-productive, and it ties a lot of money to our center core in the future (over 17 million for the next four years in total). Then we're left with Trouba and Skjei again. Just no.

I know it's more likely a no deal than a deal, but if it's the latter, only McDonagh makes sense for us, unless other deals go through.

for the record, this was not my Stepan suggestion, which had him reduced

you have agreed with me, quite responsibly, that the ideal deal
is
McD + for Trouba +

help me devise a reasonable PACKAGE that is win win

McD CAN be included
NY can eat a certain amount as long as it can bury and buy out WITHIN REASON

Staal --- who you can use even as is --- can be reduced
but he has to go w/his NMC

McD-Trouba cancel expansion wise
Morrissey is exempt
figure Myers, if not dealt, which is theoretically possible

McD, Myers, Staal
who do you really have to protect that you can't spare that 3rd expansion slot?

 

[bernmeister]

Miller and Skjei for Trouba is a fair offer.

not enough LD depth to move exempt Skjei
and Miller is not going, unless it is in a package and Hanifin returns

 

[bernmeister]

Stepan @ 4, Staal @ 3, Raanta - Trouba, Burmi, Pavelec

First off, Raanta isn't an upgrade over Hellebuyck and Hutchinson - it would be more of the same we already have in Pavelec and Hutch, expect cheaper.

Staal is all yours. No matter how hard ya'll wish that he was gone, it's not happening - that NMC ruins every little chance of him being attractive for anyone. Even retained, that term is way too much for a bottom pairing guy. And it's funny you say that the NMC is a problem only for a one year - yay, guess what. We have eight guys in need of protection as of now. Do that deal, and all of a sudden, we have nine. Someone has to go, and it's not the worst one - instead, it's either the guy who just signed an extension (Perreault), or the RHD who's even more crucial now without Trouba (Myers). There's no reason for us to take on Staal.

Stepan. At 4 million, a nice addition. At any amount of money, he brings in nothing in terms of LHD help. Instead, he'd be our 3C behind Scheif and Little. Not the worst thing, but considering the organizational depth at forward, no chance. Perreault as your 4C is overkill, and downright wrong, when he'll make over 4 million for the next four years starting from 17-18.

So, your deal is essentially...

A young top pairing RHD, depth forward + a bad one year cap dump
for
A 3C (for us), bottom pairing defenseman signed for too much and for too long, and a backup which we don't need.

It's McDonagh or bust. Nothing else makes sense, no matter how you rate Staal.

Clarification:
Staal one year you have to hold off before buying out IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF
somehow the guy were that atrocious. It only is restrictive to buy out a year or so, you can get out of end of contract term if really nec.

Your LD, as Fonz notes, is atrocious.
Even if Morrissey rises to the fore, there is a role for Staal - not at full pop, but certainly at 3m per

Not sure I would have rated Little ahead of Stepan, but I defer.
If that is the case, factually or otherwise, that does change a delicate balance, and not deal w/Stepan, who we can move elsewhere, possibly to lose Girardi,


As noted elsewhere, McD can be had. $ can be negotiated. Staal has to go to 'peg.
Winni wants specific return,
Rangers can send McD to almost any team in the league.

Work with me on the Staal NMC and I believe we can make something happen.

 

[Maukkis]

for the record, this was not my Stepan suggestion, which had him reduced

you have agreed with me, quite responsibly, that the ideal deal
is
McD + for Trouba +

help me devise a reasonable PACKAGE that is win win

McD CAN be included
NY can eat a certain amount as long as it can bury and buy out WITHIN REASON

Staal --- who you can use even as is --- can be reduced
but he has to go w/his NMC

McD-Trouba cancel expansion wise
Morrissey is exempt
figure Myers, if not dealt, which is theoretically possible

McD, Myers, Staal
who do you really have to protect that you can't spare that 3rd expansion slot?

Enstrom. Full NMC. Not moving. No Staal. Just no.

McDonagh for Trouba and a pick/exempted forward prospect (no Connor/Laine/Ehlers). No expansion problems, you get younger. All good in the hood.

Staal, Stepan or whoever who we would have to protect ruins everything completely. McDonagh is the only defenseman who makes any sense for us, so you have to keep it simple.

 

[Maukkis]

Clarification:
Staal one year you have to hold off before buying out IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF
somehow the guy were that atrocious. It only is restrictive to buy out a year or so, you can get out of end of contract term if really nec.

Your LD, as Fonz notes, is atrocious.
Even if Morrissey rises to the fore, there is a role for Staal - not at full pop, but certainly at 3m per

Not sure I would have rated Little ahead of Stepan, but I defer.
If that is the case, factually or otherwise, that does change a delicate balance, and not deal w/Stepan, who we can move elsewhere, possibly to lose Girardi,


As noted elsewhere, McD can be had. $ can be negotiated. Staal has to go to 'peg.
Winni wants specific return,
Rangers can send McD to almost any team in the league.

Work with me on the Staal NMC and I believe we can make something happen.

Why are we buying Staal out? Your team can do it and eat the buyout penalty. Hell, they signed him for that deal themselves, so they might as well suffer from it.

Staal's NMC ruins the deal, like it or not. There isn't a protection spot for him, period. No matter how many ifs, buts or maybes, he isn't going to Winnipeg. There is no way he fits the plan. I believe most teams think so as well. Enjoy having him and hope that he bounces back.

 

[Gump Hasek]

Still willing to move McD, but you have to realize, like it or not, that there is an appreciable market for him throughout the league

We can rework this deal, give you McD, but part of the + that comes w/Trouba is you take a reduced Staal and his NMC. that is inconvenience, but if I remember w/out Trouba, you can squeeze him on the 3 required to be protected list of expansion

No Staal, period. You are stuck with that contract. McD fits a need here; your attachment of a bunch of flotsam however does not. McD for Trouba and a lower-end prospect from the Jets list would probably work, nothing else. Don't like the cost? Oh well. No deal to be made then.

 

[mazmin]

win gets
Mats zucarello
brady skjei

As already mentioned Jets don't need wingers so Zucc isn't appealing. Also, I think Nee York needs to keep Zucc to keep the offense alive.

Counter offer:

NYR: Trouba

WPG: Skjei, Graves, 1st in 2017


New York probably wins this trade but Jets add one very good LHD prospect in Skjei, another decent LHD in Graves and the first will probably be around the 15-20 range and the Jets scouts should be able to pull a decent player.

Is this value fair?