Proposal: Win nyr

[Stuzchuk]

McDonagh or bust.

I'm under the impression that there will be many disappointed Jets fan when Trouba is traded. Every single time that a player ask for a trade and it goes public... it's always an underwhelming return

 

[Pablo El Perro]

As an outsider, if they trade Trouba, Staal with a significant plus seems like a realistic guess at what the Jets will receive. I'm not saying it's great value or the Jets will trade Trouba. For their sake, I even hope I'm wrong.

 

[Hunter368]

I'm under the impression that there will be many disappointed Jets fan when Trouba is traded. Every single time that a player ask for a trade and it goes public... it's always an underwhelming return

Not true, Kane trade went very well for us and Chevy got exactly his price (dispite everyone on hfb laughing at his price). Remember that blockbuster trade of the year?

Personally I've seen 5-6 very interesting/fair offers made by fans on other teams. But the vast majority of offers are spare parts, dumps, scraps and pieces that fill zero needs. People feel some kinda need to spam offers with little thought or effort put into constructing them then get annoyed when they get turned down. Normal day on hfb

 

[jay from jersey]

see

Not true, Kane trade went very well for us and Chevy got exactly his price (dispite everyone on hfb laughing at his price). Remember that blockbuster trade of the year?

Personally I've seen 5-6 very interesting/fair offers made by fans on other teams. But the vast majority of offers are spare parts, dumps, scraps and pieces that fill zero needs. People feel some kinda need to spam offers with little thought or effort put into constructing them then get annoyed when they get turned down. Normal day on hfb

see these are not scraps. NYR has probably played more playoff games then any team in the league in the last few years. Skjei is our #1 D prospect. He is young, plays LD has huge potential, exempt from Exp draft and cost controlled. Zuc has largely been our best forward for the last 2 seasons. If you don't like the offer that is fine but these are no two scrap. Skjei will be top 4 ranger D man on a team that is most likely on the way to the playoffs again. Zuc is also cost controlled for the next 3 years. Look at the zibinajad trade for example. Brassard being very cheap was key to that deal. I understand you probably don't watch a lot of NYR games but that is a really solid offer. If you don't like it fine but to trash a top 3 forward and top 2 prospect in our organization by calling them scraps is just dead wrong. McD making only 4.7 mill a year while being top 20 in his position puts him in another bracket then trouba. He also loves the rangers and doesn't want to be traded. he is battle tested and our captain. McD 1 for 1 with trouba is just a non starter unless there is a significant add.

 

[Hunter368]

see these are not scraps. NYR has probably played more playoff games then any team in the league in the last few years. Skjei is our #1 D prospect. He is young, plays LD has huge potential, exempt from Exp draft and cost controlled. Zuc has largely been our best forward for the last 2 seasons. If you don't like the offer that is fine but these are no two scrap. Skjei will be top 4 ranger D man on a team that is most likely on the way to the playoffs again. Zuc is also cost controlled for the next 3 years. Look at the zibinajad trade for example. Brassard being very cheap was key to that deal. I understand you probably don't watch a lot of NYR games but that is a really solid offer. If you don't like it fine but to trash a top 3 forward and top 2 prospect in our organization by calling them scraps is just dead wrong. McD making only 4.7 mill a year while being top 20 in his position puts him in another bracket then trouba. He also loves the rangers and doesn't want to be traded. he is battle tested and our captain. McD 1 for 1 with trouba is just a non starter unless there is a significant add.

Please read my post again, I never called this offer/two players scrap pieces. I stated many of the offers we've seen so far are scrap pieces being offered.

In thread OP just isn't interesting. Don't need forwards, especially 29 year old forwards as the main piece. Prospect just isn't good enough to be interesting for Trouba. Fine prospect, just not good enough a return for Trouba.

Just a poorly thought out offer, not calling your players bad. No interest in them as a return for Trouba.

 

[Jeti]

I'm under the impression that there will be many disappointed Jets fan when Trouba is traded. Every single time that a player ask for a trade and it goes public... it's always an underwhelming return

Jets fans are already disappointed the situation came to this. We're disappointed because we liked Trouba and because realistically we know whatever the Jets get back won't make them better now or in the future compared to keeping Trouba. Most seem to think the likely outcome is getting a young #4 LHD with some throw-ins (failing the mythical 1-for-1 trade for a left-handed Trouba without the entitlement). We also realize that D prospects that someday might be #4 D is bad value and that making up the value with a winger (albeit a good one) doesn't fit the team needs at all.

If the Jets can't get McDonaugh, there's a long list of other targets before they go for Zucc+Skjei, for example, Gardiner, Dekeyser, Klefbom, (hell,, even Fowler if it really came to that) with adds.

 

[Gardner McKay]

Fair to you, perhaps.

Jets don't need any forwards, nor any prospect D in exchange for Trouba for that matter; PASS

There is a difference between saying it isn't fair value wise and isn't acceptable needs wise. I have yet to see you acknowledge anything fair value wise from any team that isn't a total and complete win for the Jets.

I get a proposal not filling needs, that doesn't mean it isn't a fair offer in value. A guy who will likely be a top 4 dman for us by the end of the year and a already established top 6 winger is a perfectly fair offer from a value perspective.

And no. McDonagh will not be traded for Trouba on a 1 for 1 basis, especially with Mcdonagh being on a 4.7 million a year contract. Not only is McDonagh better, he is on a better contract than Trouba wants.

McDonagh for Trouba with a significant plus from Winnipeg.

 

[Machinehead]

For the sake of team needs, I would only deal Zuccarello for a comparable or better winger coming back. Has nothing to do with value.

He's just not an expendable player. At least for Brassard we got a center coming back.

 

[Al Lagoon]

Not the worst proposal I've read here, value wise anyway

 

[broc]

I dont get why ppl talk about McDonagh today, as if he's the McD from a few seasons ago.

He has not been playing as well, he's not that much better than Trouba.. and while he's likely to have a bit better cap number, it will be for shorter term, he'll be UFA quicker, and he's 5 years older.

Significant add to Trouba for McD? I don't think so.

 

[One Winged Angel]

You seem mistaken; I'm the one killing some free time prior to heading out. You are the one dishing out insults over meaningless banter on a message-board.

Hope that clarifies things for you.

Actually, you seem to have the roles reversed.

Not only that, but telling you to relax because you're a little too worked up over the fact that you have no real say as to what would happen in a real life scenario involving NHL general managers is an insult?

Truth hurts. Get over it and stop making things up. You sound childish saying I insulted you.

 

[Saitama]

I'm a fan of both teams (as you can probably tell) and while Zucc would be frigging amazing in our already "starting to be amazing" forward core in Winnipeg, the Jets have to be looking at defense. Plus, Zucc as a Ranger just seems right. I hope he never leaves!

 

[BBKers]

Winnipeg is looking at offers and has not yet been enticed to act. Winnipeg brass likely using the Drouin scenario last year as a template how to deal with this situation.
I do not think Zucc going to Winnipeg would be the foundation of this trade. Not a good fit for Winnipegs needs. The Miller + Skjei proposal Sounds more mutually beneficial, maybe with a small add from Winnipeg. I also do think that assets obtained by NYR if Zucc were to be dealt elsewhere first and using (some/all of?) them to acquire Trouba has been discussed and might be in the works. He can fetch a lot in the right deal with the right team. I think Miller might be on the block as an alternative to Zucc in a three way and has been looked at too - but maybe his return would not be enough to get Trouba(dour)? Time will tell.

 

[dashripdot]

I dont get why ppl talk about McDonagh today, as if he's the McD from a few seasons ago.

He has not been playing as well, he's not that much better than Trouba.. and while he's likely to have a bit better cap number, it will be for shorter term, he'll be UFA quicker, and he's 5 years older.

Significant add to Trouba for McD? I don't think so.

Look at the RHD partners he's been dragging around the past few seasons: Girardi and, occasionally, Dan Boyle. Give him a decent (not all-star) partner full-time (Klein has only been paired with him briefly) and he's the same guy he was "a few seasons ago." Trouba is overvalued, but better than any RHD the Rangers currently have, hence the interest.

 

[Kaapo Cabana]

I'm under the impression that there will be many disappointed Jets fan when Trouba is traded. Every single time that a player ask for a trade and it goes public... it's always an underwhelming return

BINGO!!! we have a winner.

You can't dictate terms when you have no leverage.

 

[slg1963]

win gets
Mats zucarello
brady skjei

nYR gets
trouba
Lowry


trouba wants out. His skillset has been discussed to death NYR needs a 1 RD. He has a lot of potential. Lowry gives them a 4th center for the future as well.

win gets zuc who can play both wings, cost controlled, 60+pts.
skjei who is dubbed mini McD by many. Skates like the wind,big,talented. His offense is a ?. he will be a top 4 D in the NHL no doubt. If his offense game rounds out he is a McDonuagh clone. If not he is more brett hedican. 1 month younger then trouba

Honestly this is more than fair to Winnipeg, fills a need for both teams

 

[Gump Hasek]

BINGO!!! we have a winner.

You can't dictate terms when you have no leverage.

If the Jets intent was to trade Trouba, they probably would have done it by now.

They can dictate the terms by seeking a return that makes them whole (a similarly aged d-man with similar skills and NHL experience). That is a very specific ask, one very few teams can meet even ex the current circumstances; that is because the ask is likely designed as a signal that they are girded for a protracted battle with the agent and aren't really interested in offers that don't fully replace his value in their D-group.

 

[Maukkis]

BINGO!!! we have a winner.

You can't dictate terms when you have no leverage.

What leverage does Gorton have over Chevy? One holds Trouba's rights, the other does not. That's what matters.

 

[bernmeister]

Woefully inadequate Jersey Jay offer #1: Jets don't need any more smalls; PASS
Bernmeister special #1: Jets don't need any old Staals; PASS

no vote acknowledged, thanks for sharing.
short follow up:
so, in construct of a package deal, where both Stepan AND Staal are significant'y reduced to approx full max, and you are saving $ w/netminder upgrade x2 yrs while you groom star replacement, you don't think that ALL of that is worth an insured (conditional) add for Staal's NMC that you only have to deal with for this year before buyout IF he is THAT atrocious [not likely, btw]?

Miller and Skjei for Trouba is a fair offer.

no Rangers give up too much youth and can't afford to part w/Skjei, Graves

Fair to you, perhaps.
Jets don't need any forwards, nor any prospect D in exchange for Trouba for that matter; PASS

If Winnipeg wants McDonagh, they're going to need to give way more than Trouba.

Don't be upset. You may note that several Winnipeg fans have all said McD.

We can throw in Burmistrov and take back Skjei then.

Happy?

Rangers should move all of vets McD, Klein, Staal and Girardi from D if they can, along w/other vet Fs.

G is only guy being given away here.

I am willing to oblige w/McD, but there has to be substantive add.
If no agreement, then it would have to be multiple swap of picks in NY favor

I would like to see if we can agree on who that add might be, what balanced package can we come up with.

HOWEVER, NY can NOT deal it's youngest core.
ELCs are a premium this year.

Let's be honest about Burmi being a de facto rental unless he gets top top $, discounting his value --- which is fine, but then you need offset (moving a highly discounted Staal, for example) --- going the other way.

check all out this w/e see what you come up with

As an outsider, if they trade Trouba, Staal with a significant plus seems like a realistic guess at what the Jets will receive. I'm not saying it's great value or the Jets will trade Trouba. For their sake, I even hope I'm wrong.

confirms premise of one of my variations was real(istic) despite adamant 'no staal' cries
smaller deal(s) only McD or only Staal as a major [not only] piece = possible
huge deal w/both to 'peg = also possible

key is decent value to NY but we are not giving up youngest assets ELCs etc

Jets fans are already disappointed the situation came to this. We're disappointed because we liked Trouba and because realistically we know whatever the Jets get back won't make them better now or in the future compared to keeping Trouba. Most seem to think the likely outcome is getting a young #4 LHD with some throw-ins (failing the mythical 1-for-1 trade for a left-handed Trouba without the entitlement). We also realize that D prospects that someday might be #4 D is bad value and that making up the value with a winger (albeit a good one) doesn't fit the team needs at all.

If the Jets can't get McDonaugh, there's a long list of other targets before they go for Zucc+Skjei, for example, Gardiner, Dekeyser, Klefbom, (hell,, even Fowler if it really came to that) with adds.

sure, but good luck there, those would all be HUGE, OUTRAGEOUS adds

again, no on Skjei

 

[Gump Hasek]

no vote acknowledged, thanks for sharing.
short follow up:
so, in construct of a package deal, where both Stepan AND Staal are significant'y reduced to approx full max, and you are saving $ w/netminder upgrade x2 yrs while you groom star replacement, you don't think that ALL of that is worth an insured (conditional) add for Staal's NMC that you only have to deal with for this year before buyout IF he is THAT atrocious [not likely, btw]?

The Jets reported ask is for a very specific return, a similarly aged and skilled d-man; Staal is not that player. BTW, they don't need Stepan, and already have three goalies currently in the running for two jobs. Your offer is way off the mark.

 

[Kaapo Cabana]

What leverage does Gorton have over Chevy? One holds Trouba's rights, the other does not. That's what matters.

Time.

also, one teams hand is being forced, and its not the Rangers.

 

[Maukkis]

no vote acknowledged, thanks for sharing.
short follow up:
so, in construct of a package deal, where both Stepan AND Staal are significant'y reduced to approx full max, and you are saving $ w/netminder upgrade x2 yrs while you groom star replacement, you don't think that ALL of that is worth an insured (conditional) add for Staal's NMC that you only have to deal with for this year before buyout IF he is THAT atrocious [not likely, btw]?



no Rangers give up too much youth and can't afford to part w/Skjei, Graves








Rangers should move all of vets McD, Klein, Staal and Girardi from D if they can, along w/other vet Fs.

G is only guy being given away here.

I am willing to oblige w/McD, but there has to be substantive add.
If no agreement, then it would have to be multiple swap of picks in NY favor

I would like to see if we can agree on who that add might be, what balanced package can we come up with.

HOWEVER, NY can NOT deal it's youngest core.
ELCs are a premium this year.

Let's be honest about Burmi being a de facto rental unless he gets top top $, discounting his value --- which is fine, but then you need offset (moving a highly discounted Staal, for example) --- going the other way.

check all out this w/e see what you come up with





confirms premise of one of my variations was real(istic) despite adamant 'no staal' cries
smaller deal(s) only McD or only Staal as a major [not only] piece = possible
huge deal w/both to 'peg = also possible

key is decent value to NY but we are not giving up youngest assets ELCs etc

Stepan @ 4, Staal @ 3, Raanta - Trouba, Burmi, Pavelec

First off, Raanta isn't an upgrade over Hellebuyck and Hutchinson - it would be more of the same we already have in Pavelec and Hutch, expect cheaper.

Staal is all yours. No matter how hard ya'll wish that he was gone, it's not happening - that NMC ruins every little chance of him being attractive for anyone. Even retained, that term is way too much for a bottom pairing guy. And it's funny you say that the NMC is a problem only for a one year - yay, guess what. We have eight guys in need of protection as of now. Do that deal, and all of a sudden, we have nine. Someone has to go, and it's not the worst one - instead, it's either the guy who just signed an extension (Perreault), or the RHD who's even more crucial now without Trouba (Myers). There's no reason for us to take on Staal.

Stepan. At 4 million, a nice addition. At any amount of money, he brings in nothing in terms of LHD help. Instead, he'd be our 3C behind Scheif and Little. Not the worst thing, but considering the organizational depth at forward, no chance. Perreault as your 4C is overkill, and downright wrong, when he'll make over 4 million for the next four years starting from 17-18.

So, your deal is essentially...

A young top pairing RHD, depth forward + a bad one year cap dump
for
A 3C (for us), bottom pairing defenseman signed for too much and for too long, and a backup which we don't need.



It's McDonagh or bust. Nothing else makes sense, no matter how you rate Staal.

 

[Maukkis]

Time.

also, one teams hand is being forced, and its not the Rangers.

Nice. Let's wait then.

...wait for Chevy to not trade Trouba to the Rangers for anyone not named McDonagh. Oh wait, and talk about someone's hand being forced. Trouba requested a trade five months ago. Nothing has happened to him since.

All I'm saying is, either that team is not Winnipeg, or Trouba can't tie Chevy's hands properly. Or both.

I'd want to hear where you're going with this, honestly. Doesn't look like you know that either.

 

[Kaapo Cabana]

If the Jets intent was to trade Trouba, they probably would have done it by now.

They can dictate the terms by seeking a return that makes them whole (a similarly aged d-man with similar skills and NHL experience). That is a very specific ask, one very few teams can meet even ex the current circumstances; that is because the ask is likely designed as a signal that they are girded for a protracted battle with the agent and aren't really interested in offers that don't fully replace his value in their D-group.

So since literally nobody will meet those demands and, according to you, Chevy won't budge on his ask, what do you expect to happen? You think Trouba will just take it on the chin?

Do you guys really want to pay Trouba 6M/year to play on his off side, or on the third pairing, especially when you already have 3 defensemen making 5.5M+?

Time is not on your side, and every other team knows this. Nobody is going to pay the price you think Trouba is worth now when they can just wait it out. The only way something happens now is if Chevy blinks.

His value won't go up unless he plays, and he won't play until he has a contract. Each passing day the value drops.

tick tock

 

[Saidin]

Chevy sticking to the guns out weighs him blinking and taking a lesser deal. Future RFA's from around the league/Jets know that you can't have these players dictate what they want to do on their terms. It has to be done on the teams terms.

I have no problem letting him rot for the next 4 years. I'd rather that than trade him to the vultures like I see in these threads.