Williams, Kopitar, Gaborik 4 goals total last 13 games

[damacles1156]

The thing about Kopitar is he controls the game so much even when he isn't scoring. That is what I never understood in having these debates about MR, it goes well well beyond scoring. Kopitar if he became a 30 point player tomorrow would still have value for his defensive ability, size, reach, smarts etc. This is a down year for Kopitar offensively, but he is still among the best overall centers in the world.

And Kopitar doesn't have to sign July 1st this year, in fact it makes zero sense for him to do it unless the Kings want to pay him more than he is worth. He is better off waiting for the cap to go up in 2016 and for him to be likely coming off a better season.

If Kopitar became a 30 point player(tomorrow or even two years from now), and was on a eight year, 9+ million dollar contract; There would be a Kopitar thread saying how much of a mistake Lombardi made offering that deal.

It wouldn't matter how good Kopitar was on Defense.

You know it Herby.

Kopitar most likely will be 29 years of age when he signs an extension. I wouldn't give any 29 year old an Eight year contract. I would even hesitate to give Crosby one.

29 year old's are past their production primes. You going to bet on, that you have the next Nic Lidstrom ?

 

[King'sPawn]

If Kopitar became a 30 point player, and was on a eight year 9+ million dollar contract; There would be a Kopitar thread saying how much of a mistake Lombardi made offering that deal.

It wouldn't matter how good Kopitar was on Defense.

You know it Herby.

Kopitar most likely will be 29 years of age when he signs an extension. I wouldn't give any 29 year old an Eight year contract. I would even hesitate to give Crosby one.

29 year old's are past their production primes. You going to bet on, that you have the next Nic Lidstrom ?

I guess Conn Smythe winner Justin Williams is washed up since he'd past his "production prime" amirite?

Kopitar, with more ice time than any other forward on the team, is a key part to the team's success even when he isn't scoring. Just like how Doughty contributes so much more than points.

 

[ibleedkings]

Kopitar is the grease that keeps the Kings wheel moving. When he is out of the lineup, this team suffers big time. Having said that, he's having a bit of an off year. He still has time to turn it up a notch.

8.5 for 7 years and ill be happy.

 

[damacles1156]

I guess Conn Smythe winner Justin Williams is washed up since he'd past his "production prime" amirite?

Kopitar, with more ice time than any other forward on the team, is a key part to the team's success even when he isn't scoring. Just like how Doughty contributes so much more than points.

Is anyone going to offer Justin Williams Eight years or 9+ Million ?

When was Justin Williams last career year ? It was near a decade ago...Hence past production prime

Any more remarks that have no basis or foundation with Kopitar's extension ?

 

[Reclamation Project]

 

[go4hockey]

Kopitar...... Leads the team in scoring just about every year, is one of the best defensive centers in the game and many King fans just want to ***** and moan over him. If he left via UFA just about every team that could afford it would be throwing big money and term to him.... And the Kings would be done winning for a while. We have only had a hand full of true number one centers in this franchise maybe some of you need to enjoy him while he is here. Complaining about scoring with this team is just dumb as nobody scores big here due to system. Put Kopitar with a team like the flyers and he is a 25-30 goal and 80+ point center without having to play defense. Give him 6 years even if it cost a bit more (better than going 8 years) that takes him to mid 30's. But we all know the way things work he will want 8 years and get it.

 

[damacles1156]

No one is saying "Don't sign Kopitar"....

People are thinking, maybe it's not a good idea to give him the max contract at a huge cap hit.

That is worthy of debate.

 

[Reclamation Project]

Especially given recent events...

I wouldn't want someone bringing out the big guns and starting a... *dramatic pause* PLAYER DISCUSSION THREAD!

 

[TopT]

With all this complains that Kopitar will be in mid 60s in points this year and is having an off year I'll repeat again what I wrote few weeks ago.

Since 2008 not a single Kings player with the exception of Kopitar has reached 60 points or more. And Kopitar in that period never had less than 70 points (with the exception of lock-out season, but even then he was on pace for over 70 points in full season).

What is wrong with you.
Being reasonable in this thread is a sin.

BTW Kopi missed 3 games this year so if we included that in his PPG he would be on same pace as last year. Oh why do I even bother

 

[kingsfan]

The one point in all these threads about a player not doing as well this year that I never see mention is the fact LA has played something like 65 games in the playoffs the last three years. That's almost one full season. In other words when we go up against a team like Calgary, we have played four seasons in the same time span they played three. Countless NHLers have pointed out all those games take a huge toll on you the following season and we are on our third following season.

And we are acting like its a shock Kopitar isn't playing quite where he was three years ago. Or Quick. Or others. It's not excusing a drop off like Richards but we should be expecting a drop off of some level. Especially after last years marathon playoffs.

 

[damacles1156]

The one point in all these threads about a player not doing as well this year that I never see mention is the fact LA has played something like 65 games in the playoffs the last three years. That's almost one full season. In other words when we go up against a team like Calgary, we have played four seasons in the same time span they played three. Countless NHLers have pointed out all those games take a huge toll on you the following season and we are on our third following season.

And we are acting like its a shock Kopitar isn't playing quite where he was three years ago. Or Quick. Or others. It's not excusing a drop off like Richards but we should be expecting a drop off of some level. Especially after last years marathon playoffs.

Kane and Toews have played I think three less games in that span(maybe five?). Both are on pace for pretty good years, neither look tired.

Doughty looks fine to me as well. Duncan Keith looks fine this year, and he is older than everyone I just listed.

 

[TopT]

Kane and Toews have played I think three less games in that span. Both are on pace for pretty good years, neither look tired.

Keith too, Doughty looks fine to me as well.

Is he ?
Are the points worth more if you are Canadian

Doughty is the giveaway/takeaway king of the NHL this year but he does that cute spin-o-rama move on the blueline as last guy so I am not complaining

 

[damacles1156]

Doughty is on pace for 40 assists and a Norris nomination. Also playing the most minutes in the league almost.

Toews is on pace for his career average, he looks fine.

 

[kingsfan]

Kane and Toews have played I think three less games in that span(maybe five?). Both are on pace for pretty good years, neither look tired.

Doughty looks fine to me as well. Duncan Keith looks fine this year, and he is older than everyone I just listed.

Come on Damacles, it takes two seconds to look.

Chicago has 48 games in the playoffs the last three years. That's 17 games difference, that's a lot. And Toews is putting up basically the same point total as Kopitar.

 

[damacles1156]

Come on Damacles, it takes two seconds to look.

Chicago has 48 games in the playoffs the last three years. That's 17 games difference, that's a lot. And Toews is putting up basically the same point total as Kopitar.

So 2012 playoffs is when Chicago went out early, but since has played just as much as the Kings.

17 games is a lot, but the majority of that was from Chicago's early exit in 2012.

Could playing 17 more games be effecting Kopitar ? Sure, that's possible.

 

[SettlementRichie10]

No one is saying "Don't sign Kopitar"....

People are thinking, maybe it's not a good idea to give him the max contract at a huge cap hit.

That is worthy of debate.

Absolutely. I've been saying from the day Toews and Kane signed their deals that Kopitar's wouldn't be similar.

However, with that said, I find it difficult to believe Lombardi won't sign Kopitar to a mad length deal, if only to tack on lower salary years at the end to bring the cap down. I've guessed a total AAV of around 8 million from the get go. A full length deal takes Kopitar to age 36. Hard to justify a Toews deal that takes a player to the 35+ age.

 

[damacles1156]

A lot is made of the Toews/Kane deals, but think about this folks.

Both of those guys signed their deals at 26 years of age...That is right smack in the middle of prime production for an NHL player.

Chicago had to pay for that, they had to. Look at Kane this year, having an incredible year, Toews is simply on pace for his career average.

That I think is why both got what they wanted.

Kopitar most likely will be signing this next deal at 29. 29 years of age, not 26.

 

[TopT]

Doughty is on pace for 40 assists and a Norris nomination. Also playing the most minutes in the league almost.

Toews is on pace for his career average, he looks fine.

58 16 31 47
54 12 31 43

one of this guys looks fine and is on pace for his career average and makes over 10M, oh and yes he is also canadian. The other one is having a down year and should not be signed even close to the 10M number

 

[damacles1156]

58 16 31 47
54 12 31 43

one of this guys looks fine and is on pace for his career average and makes over 10M, oh and yes he is also canadian. The other one is having a down year and should not be signed even close to the 10M number

Kopitar is not having a down year overall, just on the road. If Kopitar's road numbers pick up, he will hit 70 points.

Kopitar will be signing his extension at 29 most likely, not 26 like Toews just did.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Kopitar is not having a down year overall, just on the road. If Kopitar's road numbers pick up, he will hit 70 points.

Kopitar will signing his extension at 29 most likely, not 26 like Toews just did.

Not saying you're wrong--you're absolutely right--but we nitpick a different piece of his game every year. Last year people were freaking out because he was getting no production on the PP. Now he is, and people are pissed that it's not 5v5 or on the road. There's only finite points to distribute. Considering minus a bad start he's still on his career pace, I'd say he's fine, I'd be more upset about the eye test that is turnovers and looks like fatigue (getting outmuscled, etc.).

As I mentioned in that other thread as well, Blackhawks play a different system than the Kings too, more uptempo and less contact for their stars. Kopi wears three sweaters night in and night out, Kane dances solo. One of these guys is inherently going to be much more tired than another. Toews is closer, but maybe part of his being underrated is being able to do better with that, I dunno.

 

[kingsfan]

So 2012 playoffs is when Chicago went out early, but since has played just as much as the Kings.

17 games is a lot, but the majority of that was from Chicago's early exit in 2012.

Could playing 17 more games be effecting Kopitar ? Sure, that's possible.

And yet he's still producing nearly identical to Toews, which you glossed right over, after saying Toews was on pace for a good year and saying Kopitar looks tired.

 

[damacles1156]

Not saying you're wrong--you're absolutely right--but we nitpick a different piece of his game every year. Last year people were freaking out because he was getting no production on the PP. Now he is, and people are pissed that it's not 5v5 or on the road. There's only finite points to distribute. Considering minus a bad start he's still on his career pace, I'd say he's fine, I'd be more upset about the eye test that is turnovers and looks like fatigue (getting outmuscled, etc.).

As I mentioned in that other thread as well, Blackhawks play a different system than the Kings too, more uptempo and less contact for their stars. Kopi wears three sweaters night in and night out, Kane dances solo. One of these guys is inherently going to be much more tired than another. Toews is closer, but maybe part of his being underrated is being able to do better with that, I dunno.

This year has been strange for Kopitar, just like the 2013 playoff's.

 

[damacles1156]

And yet he's still producing nearly identical to Toews, which you glossed right over, after saying Toews was on pace for a good year and saying Kopitar looks tired.

Quote where I said Kopitar looks tired....

 

[kingsfan]

Quote were I said Kopitar looks tired....

I took it as implied in this post.

Kane and Toews have played I think three less games in that span(maybe five?). Both are on pace for pretty good years, neither look tired.

Doughty looks fine to me as well. Duncan Keith looks fine this year, and he is older than everyone I just listed.

 

[damacles1156]

I took it as implied in this post.

You would be wrong, that was response to the Kings in general being tired due to a lot of games played.

I never even mentioned Kopitar, in that reply.

I don't think Kopitar is tired at all, or any Kings player. Brown looks fine as a matter of fact. Quick has well.