Williams, Kopitar, Gaborik 4 goals total last 13 games

[TopT]

It's not a joke. Toews and Kane's contracts will cripple Chicago's ability to keep and sign supporting players. Why should Lombardi make the same mistake just so Kopitar can get paid? What good does it do to pay Kopitar and not be able to continue to be a Stanley Cup contender?

I am sorry but do you think the Kings can be a contender without Kopi ?
You do know that we cant be a contender forever; now is our window and we have to take it

Yes it will cripple them but the market price has been set.

 

[Reclamation Project]

I blame Mike Richards

Winner.

 

[YP44]

I would still be fine with Kopi at $9M, however I hope that this off year decreases his contract demands.

 

[Buddy The Elf]

Meh, I was using a rather extreme hypothetical to make a point. I fully expect the Kings to re-sign Kopitar. I just think it would be a massive mistake to do so for 8 years and $72M total.

A lot of people around here think Kopitar deserves that kind of money, I don't.

BTW, you're no longer allowed to copy my picks in FGOG.

I will say DL should use caution and I'm sure he will given how he was burned with Richards and will likely be with Brown. I know some people around here assume every player is going to squeeze for every penny that can but I think DL will be able to negotiate a reasonable deal with him. Where people seem to think Brown got paid for past performance, Kopitar go paid for future performance on his current deal. His cap hit was a little high for what he was providing at the time he signed. The Kings took a gamble, it paid off. The cap increased which made the Cap hit much more palatable and Kopitar helped bring the team home two SC's. This next contract Kopitar is going to be on the down side of his career within a few years and the Cap might not be increasing as much over the life of it. I think we should all just take a deep breath until it all comes to pass because we have no idea what he is looking for.

EDIT: I only want to finish second place, by picking the same picks as you, I'm guaranteed points and will never catch you!

 

[TopT]

Meh, I was using a rather extreme hypothetical to make a point. I fully expect the Kings to re-sign Kopitar. I just think it would be a massive mistake to do so for 8 years and $72M total.

A lot of people around here think Kopitar deserves that kind of money, I don't.

BTW, you're no longer allowed to copy my picks in FGOG.

So what kind of contract does he deserve ?

 

[Sacha Baron Corbin]

If the Kings want to spend $9M on a center, I suggest they give that money to Johansen when he becomes an UFA.

I'm sorry but this is laughable. Pay Johansen 9 mil but not Kopitar? Johansen is no where near the 2 way player that Kopi is and wouldn't fit the system as well as Kopitar. Johansen's production would die here. Neither guy is worth 9 million a year.

Kopi's down season might pay off in the long run contract wise.

 

[TopT]

I would still be fine with Kopi at $9M, however I hope that this off year decreases his contract demands.

What off year for God sake ? Where do you people see him having an off year

 

[Fishhead]

I'm more worried about Williams playing like ass in the defensive zone than his points. Not that they were ever fantastic, but my god what happened to that guy's breakout passes? He can't clear the zone much of the time.

Can we keep our playoff spot so we can see beast Williams, please?

 

[YP44]

What off year for God sake ? Where do you people see him having an off year

in the point department. I doubt he will get to the 70 point mark.
in the goal department. last season he scored 5on5 at .3 GPG this season .12
Also I don't put alot of stock into +/- but the difference between this year and last is staggering. probably has more to do with Mitchell and voynov though

 

[TopT]

in the point department. I doubt he will get to the 70 point mark.
Also I don't put alot of stock into +/- but the difference between this year and last is staggering. probably has more to do with Mitchell and voynov though

He will end up with the same PPG as last year. I dont worry about him at all.
Also what I hate that people here tend to over-analyze when and how he scored points.
He doesnt score on road !
He doesnt score 5 on 5 !
Last year it was; he doesnt score on PP !

IT DOESN'T MATTER, Its the total that we look at

 

[KINGS17]

So what kind of contract does he deserve ?

Already asked and answered in another thread. I don't know where Dean starts the negotiations, but if it ends up being 6 years (age 35) and a cap hit of around $8.2M would be about right.

Certainly would be fine with Kopitar getting $9M a season the first couple of years.

 

[KINGS17]

He will end up with the same PPG as last year. I dont worry about him at all.

No, he won't. His number of shots are way down from seasons past. That means fewer goals, and fewer assists as well.

What off year for God sake ? Where do you people see him having an off year

If you can't see that THIS is an off season for Kopitar, you lose credibility on this subject.

I am sorry but do you think the Kings can be a contender without Kopi ?
You do know that we cant be a contender forever; now is our window and we have to take it

Yes it will cripple them but the market price has been set.

So, just go ahead and intentionally become crippled. Real genius at work there.

 

[KINGS17]

I'm sorry but this is laughable. Pay Johansen 9 mil but not Kopitar? Johansen is no where near the 2 way player that Kopi is and wouldn't fit the system as well as Kopitar. Johansen's production would die here. Neither guy is worth 9 million a year.

Kopi's down season might pay off in the long run contract wise.

See above.

 

[KINGS17]

I will say DL should use caution and I'm sure he will given how he was burned with Richards and will likely be with Brown. I know some people around here assume every player is going to squeeze for every penny that can but I think DL will be able to negotiate a reasonable deal with him. Where people seem to think Brown got paid for past performance, Kopitar go paid for future performance on his current deal. His cap hit was a little high for what he was providing at the time he signed. The Kings took a gamble, it paid off. The cap increased which made the Cap hit much more palatable and Kopitar helped bring the team home two SC's. This next contract Kopitar is going to be on the down side of his career within a few years and the Cap might not be increasing as much over the life of it. I think we should all just take a deep breath until it all comes to pass because we have no idea what he is looking for.

EDIT: I only want to finish second place, by picking the same picks as you, I'm guaranteed points and will never catch you!

I copy Alisa on Wednesday night games. Can't give you the rest of the formula.

I have sucked at FGOG for so long, I really don't know what happened this season.

 

[Trolfoli]

Deserves got nothing to do with it.... Kopitar as a UFA will get crazy money thrown at him.... He seems like a reasonable guy and will take a good number from the Kings... It's going to be a big number...

If you want more out of Gaborik/Kopitar put someone on their line that can make a play and get them the puck when they are in a scoring area.... a Toffoli/Pearson type player would be perfect... If you could find someone that could be physical in the corner... even better.

Ask yourself how many times you have seen Brown break the puck out.. pass to Kopitar who in turn sets up Gaborik for a shot? Then ask how many times you've seen Gaborik start a play that ends up with Brown getting a shot...

Gaborik has one of the best shots on the team and should be playing with guys that can get him the puck cleanly for a shot.

 

[TopT]

No, he won't. His number of shots are way down from seasons past. That means fewer goals, and fewer assists as well.



If you can't see that THIS is an off season for Kopitar, you lose credibility on this subject.



So, just go ahead and intentionally become crippled. Real genius at work there.

Come on man
I ll just stop; no future in this debate

 

[YP44]

He will end up with the same PPG as last year. I dont worry about him at all.
Also what I hate that people here tend to over-analyze when and how he scored points.
He doesnt score on road !
He doesnt score 5 on 5 !
Last year it was; he doesnt score on PP !

IT DOESN'T MATTER, Its the total that we look at

Come on now. His 5 on 5 play is way worse than last year as both his scoring and his +/- would indicate. Do you have any factual evidence that this isn't true?
IMO he is still one of the games best all around players and that is why I said he should still get $9M a year. However if you cannot see is having an off year by his standards I do not know what to say

 

[YP44]

Come on man
I ll just stop; no future in this debate

You're right there is no future in the debate.
Kopitar in years past is out performing kopitar this year, therefore he is having an off year. Nothing to debate.

 

[Primakov!]

Besides, in terms of offense, Jeff Carter is the Kings' #1 center. Kopitar is still a great 2-way center, but he needs to be surrounded by other players on the team that carry a significant load. That is why the Kings can't pay him ridiculous money.

This might be weird, but I don't quite agree with that part in bold, but probably not for the reason you might expect.

I think Kopitar has slightly regressed since being teamed up with Marian Gaborik (and on occasions Jeff Carter) because he's deferring to these guys to a ridiculous degree. It's at a point now where he's not taking shots for himself and compounding the problem by looking to force a play even when a passing lane is not available.

You might actually see an up-tick in shots and production from Kopitar if he had lesser talent on his line that leaves him no choice except to take charge because he has nobody else to rely on to be the shooter. It might even do him some good because it would probably open up passing options since he'd have more than one-dimension to present to the opposition.

2014-15: 54 Games - 93 shots = 1.72
2013-14: 82 Games - 200 shots = 2.44
2012-13: 47 Games - 98 shots = 2.09
2011-12: 82 Games - 230 shots = 2.80
2010-11: 75 Games - 233 shots = 3.11
2009-10: 82 Games - 259 shots = 3.16
2008-09: 82 Games - 234 shots = 2.85
2007-08: 82 Games - 201 shots = 2.45
2006-07: 72 Games - 193 shots = 2.68

He's currently on pace 136 shots in 79 games, which is downright anemic when you compare it to the numbers he has generated in previous years.

 

[KINGS17]

He will end up with the same PPG as last year. I dont worry about him at all.
Also what I hate that people here tend to over-analyze when and how he scored points.
He doesnt score on road !
He doesnt score 5 on 5 !
Last year it was; he doesnt score on PP !

IT DOESN'T MATTER, Its the total that we look at

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/players/3788/

Ok, look at the totals and tell us that this isn't a crap year for Kopitar.

 

[KINGS17]

This might be weird, but I don't quite agree with that part in bold, but probably not for the reason you might expect.

I think Kopitar has slightly regressed since being teamed up with Marian Gaborik (and on occasions Jeff Carter) because he's deferring to these guys to a ridiculous degree. It's at a point now where he's not taking shots for himself and compounding the problem by looking to force a play even when a passing lane is not available.

You might actually see an up-tick in shots and production from Kopitar if he had lesser talent on his line that leaves him no choice except to take charge because he has nobody else to rely on to be the shooter. It might even do him some good because it would probably open up passing options since he'd have more than one-dimension to present to the opposition.

2014-15: 54 Games - 93 shots = 1.72
2013-14: 82 Games - 200 shots = 2.44
2012-13: 47 Games - 98 shots = 2.09
2011-12: 82 Games - 230 shots = 2.80
2010-11: 75 Games - 233 shots = 3.11
2009-10: 82 Games - 259 shots = 3.16
2008-09: 82 Games - 234 shots = 2.85
2007-08: 82 Games - 201 shots = 2.45
2006-07: 72 Games - 193 shots = 2.68

He's currently on pace 136 shots in 79 games, which is downright anemic when you compare it to the numbers he has generated in previous years.

Still Kopitar's fault.

 

[NikF]

If you want to go that way Kopi did outplay Getzlaf. You think Carter would outplay Toews ?

If we talk contract I think Kopi will get around 8,5 not cause he doesnt deserve more but cause he has bought into the Lombardi system.

The difference is the Kings were a superior team to the Ducks by a fair bit. Only Chicago matches the Kings slot-for-slot. I think last year was the most consistent year Kopitar had and probably the best one in his career, while this one is certainly reason for slight concern as his shot totals have completely tanked which can be a sign of a player on offensive decline. The Kings only realistic option is probably to sign Kopitar if they intend on contending the next few years, however to pretend there isn't slight concern there in regards to Kopitar's offensive game seemingly declining is a bit far-fetched, but again the realistic thing and the right thing to do is to sign him regardless.

I think Kopitar has slightly regressed since being teamed up with Marian Gaborik (and on occasions Jeff Carter) because he's deferring to these guys to a ridiculous degree. It's at a point now where he's not taking shots for himself and compounding the problem by looking to force a play even when a passing lane is not available.

This has been a consistent problem in Kopitar's career. He's always had the tendency to defer to the point that he limits his own impact on the ice. Some of his best hockey was on a line with Richardson and Simmonds. Even when that Smyth-Kopitar-Williams line was hot, he wasn't doing much of the driving in creating offensive chances instead limiting himself to a role of a facilitator. It's up to Kopi to figure it out how to maintain that balance on a consistent basis. Is he a problem? No. But great players still have things to improve on.

 

[KINGS17]

Deserves got nothing to do with it.... Kopitar as a UFA will get crazy money thrown at him.... He seems like a reasonable guy and will take a good number from the Kings... It's going to be a big number...

If you want more out of Gaborik/Kopitar put someone on their line that can make a play and get them the puck when they are in a scoring area.... a Toffoli/Pearson type player would be perfect... If you could find someone that could be physical in the corner... even better.

Ask yourself how many times you have seen Brown break the puck out.. pass to Kopitar who in turn sets up Gaborik for a shot? Then ask how many times you've seen Gaborik start a play that ends up with Brown getting a shot...

Gaborik has one of the best shots on the team and should be playing with guys that can get him the puck cleanly for a shot.

Deserves has everything to do with it in the Kings' organization. That's why Brown's contract is what it is, because it certainly isn't due to him being able to earn that money in future years with his performance.

Kopitar got his money on his 2nd deal. Most of these guys didn't. If Kopitar and his agent can't see that, I'm thinking Dean is going to be pretty pissed off.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Come on now. His 5 on 5 play is way worse than last year as both his scoring and his +/- would indicate. Do you have any factual evidence that this isn't true?
IMO he is still one of the games best all around players and that is why I said he should still get $9M a year. However if you cannot see is having an off year by his standards I do not know what to say

To be fair he's still driving play like an animal and a lot of his work is what's enabling the 70s line to run amok. Yes the productions down and the +/- is down severely but I'd put some of that on the team around him as well. Like the rest of the team, he's still doing all of the right things and good stuff will follow. But reading this thread you'd think he was on pace for a 40 point season.

 

[KINGS17]

To be fair he's still driving play like an animal and a lot of his work is what's enabling the 70s line to run amok. Yes the productions down and the +/- is down severely but I'd put some of that on the team around him as well. Like the rest of the team, he's still doing all of the right things and good stuff will follow. But reading this thread you'd think he was on pace for a 40 point season.

No, but he is on pace for the low to mid 60's, and that's not good enough for a $9M+ cap hit player.