Why is Auston Matthews considered a top 10 player?

[joe dirte]

Soo. Who are the 10 better players?

crosby thats all. he scored more goals.

 

[ImpartialNHLfan]

Matthews is on an 82 point pace playing 17ish minutes a night. Seems top 10 to me.

 

[leaffaninvancouver]

Soo. Who are the 10 better players?

It's a pretty subjective ranking it's not that hard to find ten players some people might put ahead. The thread is just designed to get people to argue.

 

[nobody]

Soo. Who are the 10 better players?

The Isles top line, the Flyers top line, the Lightening top line, the Blues top line, the Jets top line and McKinnon.

 

[BruinLVGA]

I agree. He has played through injuries and has slumped since coming back multiple times and is sitting at PPG still. Is it really that preposterous to think he wouldn't be 5-6 points over PPG? It's not like he was on pace for 70 points in 42 games. He would be on pace for 50 in 42. Anyway, I agree with your general argument. My point was he would be sitting at around ppg. 42 +/- 2 points.

This whole thread was derailed by a couple of stupid posts. The OP post itself is kind of silly because Leafs fans aren't the ones out here clamouring about Matthews being top 10 or top 5. We frankly don't care, it's the media that had him as the top 10 guy in the league (both TSN and NHL.com). Another thing is related to McDavid. Some of us hold the opinion that McDavid and Matthews are very close as overall players. None of us claim it as a matter of fact but rather opinion, I don't know why people get so worked up about it. That poster up there spent 70+ posts arguing Matthews and McDavid for basically no reason. I don't think Leafs fans care about McDavid vs Matthews debates. Our team is struggling to find its footing in the playoff race right now and we have bigger things to worry about. We can hold the d*** measuring contests in the offseason.

Your forecast had he not been injured is not unreasonable, of course.

 

[BruinLVGA]

No they really don't. Everyone is entitled to voice an opinion but most people's don't matter, especially when people are saying their opinion is more valid then professional analysts. They just aren't. That doesn't mean you can't disagree but it's arrogant to assume that people should listen to you over them.

Of course it’s unwise to state that one’s opinion is superior to that of those who are professionals.
But in and of itself, what one human being thinks is by default valuable. So I wish you would refrain from telling people that their opinions doesn’t matter.

 

[The Grim Reaper]

Soo. Who are the 10 better players?

Crosby
Ovechkin
Malkin
Stamkos
Kane
Backstrom
Marchand
Getzlaf
Tavares
Kucherov

 

[joe dirte]

I agree. He has played through injuries and has slumped since coming back multiple times and is sitting at PPG still. Is it really that preposterous to think he wouldn't be 5-6 points over PPG? It's not like he was on pace for 70 points in 42 games. He would be on pace for 50 in 42. Anyway, I agree with your general argument. My point was he would be sitting at around ppg. 42 +/- 2 points.

This whole thread was derailed by a couple of stupid posts. The OP post itself is kind of silly because Leafs fans aren't the ones out here clamouring about Matthews being top 10 or top 5. We frankly don't care, it's the media that had him as the top 10 guy in the league (both TSN and NHL.com). Another thing is related to McDavid. Some of us hold the opinion that McDavid and Matthews are very close as overall players. None of us claim it as a matter of fact but rather opinion, I don't know why people get so worked up about it. That poster up there spent 70+ posts arguing Matthews and McDavid for basically no reason. I don't think Leafs fans care about McDavid vs Matthews debates. Our team is struggling to find its footing in the playoff race right now and we have bigger things to worry about. We can hold the d*** measuring contests in the offseason.

as pointed in out in so many words earkier, part of the problem is that while we have other things to concern ourselves with, others may not. for them, this is basically already the offseason......

 

[joe dirte]

Matthews is on an 82 point pace playing 17ish minutes a night. Seems top 10 to me.

yeah its pretty impressive considering how much Babcock spreads the ice time out.

 

[nobody]

Crosby
Ovechkin
Malkin
Stamkos
Kane
Backstrom
Marchand
Getzlaf
Tavares
Kucherov

I would also throw in Karlsson, Bobrovski, Holtby, Burns, McDavid. Oh and Vasilevski this year. Vasi should be in contention for the Hart this year, he's been freaking amazing.

 

[BruinLVGA]

Matthews is on an 82 point pace playing 17ish minutes a night. Seems top 10 to me.

To be frank, the thread as it is done (= top 10 PLAYER) is intrinsically made to push a “no” answer. That’s because by saying “player”, it also includes the top defensemen and goalies.
It would have been more realistic & fair to say “forwards”, instead of “players”.

 

[nobody]

yeah its pretty impressive considering how much Babcock spreads the ice time out.

Babcock pisses me off so much. Once again last night, Komarov plays 24 minutes and Matthews plays 16. I don't even know how to comprehend that.

 

[Stephen]

Dude, that’s not what they were saying. They were saying that a certain production in a 16 game stretch isn’t an automatic guarantee of keeping up said production for an entire season.
It could be lower, the same or higher. Bottom line one can’t say he had 19 points in 16 games, if he had no injury, he would have x points and therefore be in y position in the scoring race. It’s preposterous.

It’s not a difficult concept to know that players, ALL players (regardless of position, history, etc etc) have ebbs and flows. It’s because they’re human, not machines.

19 points in 16 games isn't much of a stretch from, oh, say, 6 points in 6 games since coming back from the injury...

 

[leaffaninvancouver]

Of course it’s unwise to state that one’s opinion is superior to that of those who are professionals.
But in and of itself, what one human being thinks is by default valuable. So I wish you would refrain from telling people that their opinions doesn’t matter.

In my defense I said that because he said Leaf fans care what I think. I expanded on it when asked but the comment was because he kept going on about how Leaf fans clearly cared what he thought. I'll admit it was a little a curt but so was the comment I was replying to.

I have no desire to shut down a conversation and in case it wasn't very obvious I also include myself in that category of no one actually really cares what I think about hockey.

 

[authentic]

Babcock pisses me off so much. Once again last night, Komarov plays 24 minutes and Matthews plays 16. I don't even know how to comprehend that.

I don't even know what to make of that. Literally the best and worst forward on the team. Play him normal minutes, play with with skilled wingers, treat him like a normal superstar it's so damn frustrating.

 

[Stephen]

On the other hand, if you want to start poking holes in conventional wisdom, why is McDavid considered the best player in the game when he can't even outscore Nikita Kucherov? At least that guy's points are fueling the best team in the league.

 

[BruinLVGA]

I would also throw in Karlsson, Bobrovski, Holtby, Burns, McDavid. Oh and Vasilevski this year. Vasi should be in contention for the Hart this year, he's been freaking amazing.

Vasilevsky looks like the runaway Vezina candidate. 939 sv% while Tampa is only mid level (12th overall) in shots against per game. Kid’s been magic.

 

[leaffaninvancouver]

Babcock pisses me off so much. Once again last night, Komarov plays 24 minutes and Matthews plays 16. I don't even know how to comprehend that.

I think Leo plays too much but I mean it's mostly because of the PK and not having a great option in front on the Matthews PP. Leo's minutes would look a lot better if we had another option on the Matthews PP to play that crash in front role that Leo does by default.

I like that Matthews doesn't have too many minutes, I'm hoping it means he's very fresh come the playoffs.

 

[nobody]

On the other hand, if you want to start poking holes in conventional wisdom, why is McDavid considered the best player in the game when he can't even outscore Nikita Kucherov? At least that guy's points are fueling the best team in the league.

We just doused that fire. Please don't bring back the trolls.

 

[authentic]

On the other hand, if you want to start poking holes in conventional wisdom, why is McDavid considered the best player in the game when he can't even outscore Nikita Kucherov? At least that guy's points are fueling the best team in the league.

Or Josh Bailey, or Jakub Voracek and Claude Giroux. Could it be that their current place in points isn't their actual ranking as a player?

 

[BruinLVGA]

In my defense I said that because he said Leaf fans care what I think. I expanded on it when asked but the comment was because he kept going on about how Leaf fans clearly cared what he thought. I'll admit it was a little a curt but so was the comment I was replying to.

I have no desire to shut down a conversation and in case it wasn't very obvious I also include myself in that category of no one actually really cares what I think about hockey.

Good post, man. It’s human nature to get hot under the bonnet/hood sometimes, so to speak. It’s great to acknowledge it like you did.

 

[joe dirte]

Babcock pisses me off so much. Once again last night, Komarov plays 24 minutes and Matthews plays 16. I don't even know how to comprehend that.

it's simple to me. so many claim the leafs were lucky to get so few injuries last year. perhaps it helps that he doesn't ride any particular line as much as other teams. there is a pole of depth on the team.

if he can get through the 82 regular season games reasonably fresh and ready fir the playoffs that's perfect. the playoffs are a grind and can be a battle of attrition. I think he's treating the regular season as preparation for the playoffs instead of a race to accumulate points that don't matter after game 82.

 

[nobody]

I think Leo plays too much but I mean it's mostly because of the PK and not having a great option in front on the Matthews PP. Leo's minutes would look a lot better if we had another option on the Matthews PP to play that crash in front role that Leo does by default.

I like that Matthews doesn't have too many minutes, I'm hoping it means he's very fresh come the playoffs.

You know who plays PK and provides quality minutes to the Marlies? Kasperi Kapanen. You know who doesn't kill penalties and doesn't provide a whole lot to the Leafs? Matt Martin.

Leafs are a much better team with a 4th line of Soshnikov/ Leivo - Goat - Kapanen, Babs needs to get his head straight.

 

[nobody]

it's simple to me. so many claim the leafs were lucky to get so few injuries last year. perhaps it helps that he doesn't ride any particular line as much as other teams. there is a pole of depth on the team.

if he can get through the 82 regular season games reasonably fresh and ready fir the playoffs that's perfect. the playoffs are a grind and can be a battle of attrition. I think he's treating the regular season as preparation for the playoffs instead of a race to accumulate points that don't matter after game 82.

True. I guess I never thought of it that way. It takes an adjustment in thinking when you're not constantly looking at who you're going to be picking in the lottery draft.

 

[authentic]

I think Leo plays too much but I mean it's mostly because of the PK and not having a great option in front on the Matthews PP. Leo's minutes would look a lot better if we had another option on the Matthews PP to play that crash in front role that Leo does by default.

I like that Matthews doesn't have too many minutes, I'm hoping it means he's very fresh come the playoffs.

Yeah, but it's not like we're contenders yet anyway. He's young and getting used to the league, I don't see how he should be playing less than 20 minutes a night. Atleast get him out there on the powerplay more, seems like he plays less than half of every powerplay we get.