Why is Auston Matthews considered a top 10 player?

[Kamiccolo]

Getting major deja-vu here of spending pages and pages posting Kessel stats, showing he was a top 5 scorer over the last 5 years in the NHL, showing he is PPG with AHler's and Bozak on his lines, etc and being told how he is over rated because he is a Leaf and all these other players are better.

How much does anyone want to bet if Matthews was traded to say, Arizona, he'd be easily seen as a top 5 player by almost every person in this thread? It's just not even worth the effort fellow Leaf fans. We've seen this same song and dance time and time again. Let's just enjoy watching our young stars grow into what they will someday be and enjoy that for once our team is a bubble team not because we are in our primes and barely hanging on but because the team is young and still learning.

 

[BruinLVGA]

"Intangibles" seems like a cop out (assuming you know what the word means). There are many other tangible things that SHOULD go into what makes a player. I suspect an agenda would make you cling to points only.

I suspect that there aren’t enough “intangibles” to make Auston overcome the lesser production in regards to the vast majority of those 24 players who have a better production, for him to be top 10 of this list (never mind top defensemen and goalies).

For a tangibles example, yesterday another one of you guys talked about possession stats to cite Auston’s superiority over Marchand and when I brought the numbers, he... disappeared (because they were all in Marchand’s favor). Rumor is that he is still running towards the hills at full tilt.

 

[Canucks1096]

It makes me laugh when Matthews lovers compare him to Mcdavid.

Matthews is not even on the same tier as Mcdavid.

 

[Pocket Hercules]

Because #Leaffans. Do you remember when Luke Schenn was the best defensive defenseman in the league? LOL. Could you imagine if McDavid was in Matthews place? It would be multiple levels and tiers worse.

Devan Dubnyk says hi.

 

[BruinLVGA]

Getting major deja-vu here of spending pages and pages posting Kessel stats, showing he was a top 5 scorer over the last 5 years in the NHL, showing he is PPG with AHler's and Bozak on his lines, etc and being told how he is over rated because he is a Leaf and all these other players are better.

How much does anyone want to bet if Matthews was traded to say, Arizona, he'd be easily seen as a top 5 player by almost every person in this thread? It's just not even worth the effort fellow Leaf fans. We've seen this same song and dance time and time again. Let's just enjoy watching our young stars grow into what they will someday be and enjoy that for once our team is a bubble team not because we are in our primes and barely hanging on but because the team is young and still learning.

Nay. He wouldn’t be a top 5 player either, if he played for any other team. He does not have the numbers to be a top 5 player. That’s what the boys in blue & white in here don’t seem to understand.

 

[X66]

With the huge flop of a season the Oilers have had, they at least get a lot of enjoyment discussing Matthews. He's done great things for both fan bases.

 

[HockeyGuruPitka]

Getting major deja-vu here of spending pages and pages posting Kessel stats, showing he was a top 5 scorer over the last 5 years in the NHL, showing he is PPG with AHler's and Bozak on his lines, etc and being told how he is over rated because he is a Leaf and all these other players are better.

How much does anyone want to bet if Matthews was traded to say, Arizona, he'd be easily seen as a top 5 player by almost every person in this thread? It's just not even worth the effort fellow Leaf fans. We've seen this same song and dance time and time again. Let's just enjoy watching our young stars grow into what they will someday be and enjoy that for once our team is a bubble team not because we are in our primes and barely hanging on but because the team is young and still learning.

I think you hit the nail on the head here. Theres no point in debating his rank amongst other players in the league. That's the old "out of playoffs" leaf fan mentality. The days of trying to prove some relevance to the rest of the league while not being anywhere close to contending for a playoff spot are over. At the end of the day I sleep a lot better at night knowing the Leafs now have better chance of making the playoffs then not.

I'll admit that I mostly only watch players on other teams when they play the Leafs. However what I do know is that the majority of the time Auston Matthews is the best player on the ice even if that just means the other players were having off-nights.

I'd also love to know how Matthews PP time compares to these other players. Not many teams can run two units like the Leafs do

 

[BlueBaron]

Both are as bad as each other

I'm sure to an outsider it is all just noise, but the evidence really does not support your position.

 

[Garthinater]

Getting major deja-vu here of spending pages and pages posting Kessel stats, showing he was a top 5 scorer over the last 5 years in the NHL, showing he is PPG with AHler's and Bozak on his lines, etc and being told how he is over rated because he is a Leaf and all these other players are better.

How much does anyone want to bet if Matthews was traded to say, Arizona, he'd be easily seen as a top 5 player by almost every person in this thread? It's just not even worth the effort fellow Leaf fans. We've seen this same song and dance time and time again. Let's just enjoy watching our young stars grow into what they will someday be and enjoy that for once our team is a bubble team not because we are in our primes and barely hanging on but because the team is young and still learning.

Kinda strange as soon as kessel joined the pens, he was regarded very highly. I wonder what made the neutral fans change their opinion on him...

 

[g00n]

Stay on topic. Stop the fanbase and OT posts.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

He's lead the league in EV strength goals since he entered the league no?

yes, and is #6 in ES points since entering the league

 

[Sweet Leaf]

This was BS and poorly researched from the start. Stamkos has played maybe 15 total games on the wing in his entire career, and it's normally done to bust him out of a slump.

Not all games are created equal. Moved to wing in the NHL playoffs when your team is one of the favorites is telling of how valuable they thought Stamkos was as a center vs a winger.

Anyway, I didn't write the article nor was I one of the numerous paid talking heads talking about whether or not Stamkos should be moved to wing full time. So your beef isn't really with me. It's with those people... including Jon Cooper who put fan to flame by actually moving Stamkos to wing in the games that mattered most.

Regardless, the point remains...no coach or talking head will ever debate whether or not Matthews needs to move to wing.

 

[weems]

yes, and is #6 in ES points since entering the league

Last time I check the majority of the game is played 5v5.

So he's been the best even strength goal scorer since he entered the league all the while not seeing as much icetime as other stars.

I dont see how saying he's a top 10 player is somehow absurd.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

Last time I check the majority of the game is played 5v5.

So he's been the best even strength goal scorer since he entered the league all the while not seeing as much icetime as other stars.

I dont see how saying he's a top 10 player is somehow absurd.

PP is still an important part of the game, and it really hurts him. if he got as much time as other stars on a stacked #1 PP unit he'd look a lot better though

 

[Garthinater]

A new No. 1: McDavid edges Crosby in TSN's Top 50 player poll - Article - TSN

Actually, multiple independent sources had him there before the season even started.

Do Oilers fans get some sort of satisfaction out of putting Matthews down? Unbelievable that some of you spent your Christmas break doing this crap. It’s sad and incredibly pathetic.

This. I guess when your season is going so badly (26th place now?) you resort to spending your holidays bashing Matthews. Stay classy.

 

[stampedingviking]

Last time I check the majority of the game is played 5v5.

So he's been the best even strength goal scorer since he entered the league all the while not seeing as much icetime as other stars.

I dont see how saying he's a top 10 player is somehow absurd.

Because there are other facets to the game, therefore you should compare total points to total points.

 

[LeafGrief]

I suspect that there aren’t enough “intangibles” to make Auston overcome the lesser production in regards to the vast majority of those 24 players who have a better production, for him to be top 10 of this list (never mind top defensemen and goalies).

Bergeron's points per game is tied for 69th in the league this year, and 71st on the list you posted on a previous page. He's up there with the likes of Sebastian Aho, Evander Kane, and TJ Oshie. I am sure you have a lot of justifications for why you think Bergeron is a better player than those players and I would agree with you. Perhaps that benefit of the doubt and justifying can also be used on Matthews when considering that he might be a better player than the players you have listed ahead of him. I mean, there is just no justification in the world for you telling me that Josh Bailey is better than Auston Matthews.

 

[weems]

Because there are other facets to the game, therefore you should compare total points to total points.

You mean the other facets that he's really good at?

 

[Garthinater]

Last time I check the majority of the game is played 5v5.

So he's been the best even strength goal scorer since he entered the league all the while not seeing as much icetime as other stars.

I dont see how saying he's a top 10 player is somehow absurd.

Because we're leafs fans and he's a leaf player so we're automatically biased and out to lunch if we think he's top 10. Those professionals who have already said he's top 10, yea they're out to lunch as well. Especially that Barkov, saying Matthews has the best skill set in the league. Shame on him.

 

[stampedingviking]

You mean the other facets that he's really good at?

If that were so, you (and others) wouldn't concentrate so much on his ES scoring.

 

[weems]

If that were so, you (and others) wouldn't concentrate so much on his ES scoring.

We concentrate on EV strength goals scored because thats a MASSIVE achievement especially considering he doesnt get as much icetime as other stars.
The game is about scoring more goals than your opponent and when the game is played at full strength this guy is the best in the entire league.
On yah he's also really solid defensively and good in the faceoff dot (something that cant be said for many other young stars).

 

[g00n]

He's 15th this year in points per games played (min 30 games), which can be couched a bit with the team's struggles and some injury issues. Last year he was 28th. So he's moving up that chart, at least.

But of course, being 2nd in the league in goals last year boosts it a bit, and this year he's still 12th overall in goals scored despite having maybe 25% fewer games played.

There are only 5 players who have more goals AND higher points per game (the top 5 goalscorers). And again that's with 30 games played vs 38-40 games for everyone else above him.

I'd say that's a pretty convincing argument, yes?

 

[LeafGrief]

If that were so, you (and others) wouldn't concentrate so much on his ES scoring.

Well, he's literally the best in the league at that, so when we're talking about Matthews as a top10 player, that's a good place to start. We do talk about his ability to drive play, strong defensive play, elite transition game, takeaway ability, strength on the puck, shooting talent, and fun stuff like that, but those tend to get "lolLeafsfans" type responses.

 

[weems]

He's 15th this year in points per games played (min 30 games), which can be couched a bit with the team's struggles and some injury issues. Last year he was 28th. So he's moving up that chart, at least.

But of course, being 2nd in the league in goals last year boosts it a bit, and this year he's still 12th overall in goals scored despite having maybe 25% fewer games played.

There are only 5 players who have more goals AND higher points per game (the top 5 goalscorers). And again that's with 30 games played vs 38-40 games for everyone else above him.

I'd say that's a pretty convincing argument, yes?

He also only plays 18 mins a game is on a second PP unit.

 

[stampedingviking]

He's 15th this year in points per games played (min 30 games), which can be couched a bit with the team's struggles and some injury issues. Last year he was 28th. So he's moving up that chart, at least.

But of course, being 2nd in the league in goals last year boosts it a bit, and this year he's still 12th overall in goals scored despite having maybe 25% fewer games played.

There are only 5 players who have more goals AND higher points per game (the top 5 goalscorers). And again that's with 30 games played vs 38-40 games for everyone else above him.

I'd say that's a pretty convincing argument, yes?

So not top 10 then, you've just proved the op's point.